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Irish Times article on reforms of PS


Jizzlepops

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Troika concern over focus on debt deal - The Irish Times - Mon, Jan 28, 2013

'Other unpublished figures showed that Ireland had the largest increase in the public wage bill of all EU countries between numbers and wages since 2000 but that public sector pay cuts since then have been markedly smaller than other programme countries such as Portugal and Spain.'

To all the PS pay defenders on this forum, are you really sure there have been substantial pay cuts in the Irish Public Service? We are arguably in a far worse financial state than Spain and Portugal but our PS have taken markedly smaller pay cuts!
 

Dohville

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I'll bite, before this goes to zoo.
What pay cuts have PS workers in Spain and Portugal taken?
 

Disillusioned democrat

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I'll bite, before this goes to zoo.
What pay cuts have PS workers in Spain and Portugal taken?
Does it matter? What matters is that we do what's right for Ireland - a country where 55% of the cost of employing "high" earners' goes to the government already.
 

statsman

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Does it matter? What matters is that we do what's right for Ireland - a country where 55% of the cost of employing "high" earners' goes to the government already.
SO, we shouldn't debate points raised in the OP?
 

Mitsui2

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Troika concern over focus on debt deal - The Irish Times - Mon, Jan 28, 2013

'Other unpublished figures showed that Ireland had the largest increase in the public wage bill of all EU countries between numbers and wages since 2000 but that public sector pay cuts since then have been markedly smaller than other programme countries such as Portugal and Spain.'

To all the PS pay defenders on this forum, are you really sure there have been substantial pay cuts in the Irish Public Service? We are arguably in a far worse financial state than Spain and Portugal but our PS have taken markedly smaller pay cuts!
Another quote from the article would suggest that the Troika's interest (unlike the Government's, some would say) isn't just focused on the more powerless, "everyday" public servant -

Troika staff have focused on the public sector pay bill in recent months. The core argument is that cutting numbers is not enough. The commission noted that Irish medical consultants were the highest paid in the EU for their public work, being paid twice the rate in the UK.
Though I'm sure many medical consultants would bridle at being called "servants", public or otherwise.
 

Amnesiac

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Another quote from the article would suggest that the Troika's interest (unlike the Government's, some would say) isn't just focused on the more powerless, "everyday" public servant -

Though I'm sure many medical consultants would bridle at being called "servants", public or otherwise.
There seems to be no government appetite for change regarding state-sponsored professions. The Troika need to breathe some fire on this front. I think they would have the political cover to do so. How many people would protest the undemocratic over-reaching of the IMF if it forced the government to review the public pay of hospital consultants?
 

southwestkerry

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well my contribution to this would be this.
as i said in the passed and indeed told to a few folks here in kerry in political circles. the government would be best placed to cap all public wages at 60-65k a year with a reform with income tax in order to manage public pay best for a country the size of Ireland. alas every time i say this folk run a mile.
sWk
 

Mitsui2

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There seems to be no government appetite for change regarding state-sponsored professions. Troika need to breathe some free on this front. I think they would have the political cover to do so. How many people would protest the undemocratic over-reaching of the IMF if it forced the government to review the public pay of hospital consultants?
Very, very few, I would imagine - outside the ranks of related professions who saw themselves as possibly being next on the hitlist.

Unfortunately (for us, I hasten to add) this would include many deeply patriotic politicians.
 

Socratus O' Pericles

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SO, we shouldn't debate points raised in the OP?
No!

We should listen to "sources" and do whatever they say.

well-placed sources, has shown there is concern that promised radical reform has flagged in recent months.

Sources say the Government has portrayed a deal on the promissory note as a “panacea” for all the State’s problems, resulting in a slowing of the reform moment.

The sources have pointed to


For sources read vested interests.
 
D

Deleted member 17573

There seems to be no government appetite for change regarding state-sponsored professions. The Troika need to breathe some fire on this front. I think they would have the political cover to do so. How many people would protest the undemocratic over-reaching of the IMF if it forced the government to review the public pay of hospital consultants?
The IMF aren't too shy about their own remuneration:

http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/ar/2012/eng/pdf/webtable54.pdf
 

SeanieFitz

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the cynic in me wonders is this all part of a conspiracy to scare PS into agreeing to CPA2!
Government/Unions/Troika all seem to be anxious to tie PS into more changes in terms of employment, reduced take home pay and whatever you are having yourself.
 

Sister Mercedes

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the cynic in me wonders is this all part of a conspiracy to scare PS into agreeing to CPA2!
Government/Unions/Troika all seem to be anxious to tie PS into more changes in terms of employment, reduced take home pay and whatever you are having yourself.
Which do you think a PS employee would prefer? To be subject to a CPA2 that they didn't like, or to be subject to whatever the Troika was prepared to pay them?
 

curiousorange

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the cynic in me wonders is this all part of a conspiracy to scare PS into agreeing to CPA2!
Government/Unions/Troika all seem to be anxious to tie PS into more changes in terms of employment, reduced take home pay and whatever you are having yourself.
yeah, its almost as if the troika don't want to keep funding half the PS pay bill forever.
 

EUrJokingMeRight

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'unpublished figures'. Unpublished by whom? The PS?

Nothing new....Noonan wants to deal with the IMF so he can keep his pension....that is all.
 

gatsbygirl20

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the cynic in me wonders is this all part of a conspiracy to scare PS into agreeing to CPA2!
Government/Unions/Troika all seem to be anxious to tie PS into more changes in terms of employment, reduced take home pay and whatever you are having yourself.
Of course it is. The time has come for more slashing and burning, yelling about greedy PS workers and how we need to take a hatchet / axe / slash hook / scalpel to their wages and bring them to their knees.

Scaring the bejaysus out of them by telling them the Troika are gunning for them will put them in the right mood for more...um...reform (less money, more work)

I think there is already another thread on this where the juicy dish of PS wage cuts is being salivated over by the kind of posters who would shriek blue murder if you tried to "dip into" their own precious wage packets:
"Harry McGee Says We Are Not The best Boys In Class"
 

culmore

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The Ps unions might be better to come to some agreement with government and go for cuts at top range of pay and leave bootom alone, ( thats what a good Union should do ) but I have a feeling any cuts will be across the board, remember the last cuts, these at the bottom were cut while the top people only lost their bonuses, the alternative is let Troika come and cut about 20% all round.
 

Sister Mercedes

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Ireland had the largest increase in the public wage bill of all EU countries between numbers and wages since 2000 but that public sector pay cuts since then have been markedly smaller than other programme countries such as Portugal and Spain.
 
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