Irish Times goes into full panic mode. West Brit in Chief Michael McDowell catastrophising again.

Estragon

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.

They were actually mad bastards.

What we all need to do is listen to young people, they have no hang-ups, they believe in democracy and they are not influenced by religion. It will bring a United Ireland to us.

Fekk the drum banging settlers, destructive people with no culture.
Young people? When in God's name have young people ever effected meaningful political change?

The polls were telling us the youth vote was going to give Jeremy Corbyn a chance. I think what unfolded in reality tells you how much the youth vote is worth.

No harm Rural, but I was listening to that hope-in-the-youth baloney when I was a youth. It was wishful thinking then, it's wishful thinking now.
 


Lumpy Talbot

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No
Young people? When in God's name have young people ever effected meaningful political change?

The polls were telling us the youth vote was going to give Jeremy Corbyn a chance. I think what unfolded in reality tells you how much the youth vote is worth.

No harm Rural, but I was listening to that hope-in-the-youth baloney when I was a youth. It was wishful thinking then, it's wishful thinking now.
The young voters predominantly have brought great social change already via two recent referendums ranged up against the old failed Ireland.
 

redneck

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Glasgow Celtic are the first UK club to win the European cup. And they are also supported by Rod Stewart. Hardly a "hater".
Hibs have not really won anything.
 

recedite

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McDowell's right of course.
It would be a disgrace if the educated people of Ireland turned democracy into a "weapon" to be wielded to win "justice", and to consolidate majority rights?
Democracy should rather be wielded to protect minority rights, conceived of in its best sense.
McDowell is wrong, because democracy is not a weapon. It is what it is. It reflects reality.
We have just seen what happened when the UK parliament rejected a democratic referendum result. They ended up being turfed out by the electorate. Pretty much the same as what already happened to McDowell.

McDowell is one of those people who like to think they are "the elite". They are intelligent and have quite a powerful influence, but they are also arrogant.
They have no respect for democracy, unless the democratic vote happens to back up their own opinion.

In this article he uses a devious and dishonest argument, pretending that it would be an Anscluss event whereby the larger country annexed the smaller one without consent. Of course the reality is that the majority in NI would have to agree in advance to any merger.

He has a legitimate fear, ie that a majority of nationalists in NI might impose their will on the minority unionist population. And then (separately) the majority of people in RoI might endorse this. And then some trouble would erupt on this island.

But this fear must be addressed honestly and openly, in a national dialogue. IMO there are two saving graces which "might" come into play.
1. The majority in both jurisdictions might wish for a UI solution to be proposed that is acceptable to any reasonable unionist. So not just an annexation of one by the other, but a Reformation of both.
2. If 1. above does not happen, the majority in either (or both) jurisdictions might decline to vote Yes, based on the very understandable desire to avoid the troubles.
 
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McTell

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No
//

He has a legitimate fear, ie that a majority of nationalists in NI might impose their will on the minority unionist population. And then (separately) the majority of people in RoI might endorse this. And then some trouble would erupt on this island.

//
There isn't going to be an expulsion of scots or "huns", but a lot of the nordie nationalists' opinion was that they are loud mouthed and occasionally violent, and should be forcibly removed after unity.

Unity will be a great disappointment all round. Any clearances will be the poor from both "sides" seeing that they are much better off in dublin or birmingham. The richer nordies will carry on and get richer.

There's a point of view that the UK welfare state only entrenched and perpetuated the poorer communities in belfast and derry, and without that cushion of money the poor will drift off to where they should have gone in the 1920s.

NI's only edge in the 1800s was cheap labour. The result being 2 rustbelt cities, that the rest of us are not going to want to subsidise like indian reservations.
 


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