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Is Constitutional Convention run by the Irish Times?


Big Brother

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Feb 2, 2011
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Its chairman is a man I respect

But he is also chairman of the Irish Times (Tom Arnold) and his appointment was greeted by Ivana Bacik who helped
Labour come fifth in Meath East and who is a heroine to Irish Times staff

The pollsters who chose the "representative sample" of citizens are also people I respect. But they are
also.pollsters for the IT and got childrens referendum disastrously wrong prdicting 4% "No" vote (the outcome was 42%)

And we dont even know who names of these citizens are (their names are confidential)

So is this - like RTEs stitch up of the Presidential election - another media made stitch up to change us from our backward
beliefs (as the Irish Times wd describe it)

There is a case for gay mariage and short of adoption I suport it

But I doubt if this convention has any more credibility than the Labour party which created it
 

Ren84

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The Constitutional Convention was the brainchild of FG, not Labour.
 

wombat

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But I doubt if this convention has any more credibility than the Labour party which created it
Of course it doesn't but Enda had to give them something to counterbalance the Senate referendum.
 

ruserious

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Ultimately, any change to the constitution will be made by the Irish people.

So what is your problem?
 

Ren84

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Of course it doesn't but Enda had to give them something to counterbalance the Senate referendum.
What do you mean "counterbalance"? Both the Seanad abolition referendum and CC were in FG's manifesto before the GE.
 

Eire1976

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The Constitutional Convention was the brainchild of FG, not Labour.
Not read into this yet but I'm guessing anything invented by FG that might deal with the constitution is going towards the demeaning of Irish culture and the changing of it to suit EU interests.
 

Catalpast

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Ultimately, any change to the constitution will be made by the Irish people.

So what is your problem?
Well I think the big problem is that when the Establishment gets an answer it does not like

- we are made to vote again on an issue until we give the 'right' answer...:?

As for the OP the IT may not run it

- but they seem to be very influential there

- more so than is healthy IMO

My biggest bugbear with the thing is that many of its members are on it incognito

Who are these people

- are they even all Irish Citizens?

We just do not know...
 

Ren84

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Not read into this yet but I'm guessing anything invented by FG that might deal with the constitution is going towards the demeaning of Irish culture and the changing of it to suit EU interests.
It's terms of reference are actually fairly restrictive.....

The following are the only areas the convention can look at:

  1. reducing the presidential term of office to five years and aligning it with the local and European elections;
  2. reducing the voting age to 17;
  3. review of the Dáil electoral system;
  4. giving citizens resident outside the State the right to vote in presidential elections at Irish embassies, or otherwise;
  5. provision for same-sex marriage;
  6. amending the clause on the role of women in the home and encouraging greater participation of women in public life;
  7. increasing the participation of women in politics;
  8. removal of the offence of blasphemy from the Constitution; and
  9. following completion of the above reports, such other relevant constitutional amendments that may be recommended by it
BTW, as far as the IT is concerned the CC is a sham:

The way politics is done - News Debate | Opinion & Discussion |The Irish Times - Thu, Jul 12, 2012
 

Ren84

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Well I think the big problem is that when the Establishment gets an answer it does not like

- we are made to vote again on an issue until we give the 'right' answer...:?

As for the OP the IT may not run it

- but they seem to be very influential there

- more so than is healthy IMO

My biggest bugbear with the thing is that many of its members are on it incognito

Who are these people

- are they even all Irish Citizens?

We just do not know...
Actually we do know.........

https://www.constitution.ie/Documents/ListOfMembers.pdf

All are Irish citizens, apart from perhaps one or two of the Northern MLA's. Take a quick look through the list, no "foreign" sounding names there. Hope this eases your xenophobic worries.
 

Radix

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Ultimately, any change to the constitution will be made by the Irish people.

So what is your problem?


Ah yes ruserious, but you are missing the obvious, that the convention is a stunt complete with puppets and strings.

It has Kenny Lite written all over it.
 

Eire1976

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Messages
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It's terms of reference are actually fairly restrictive.....

The following are the only areas the convention can look at:

  1. reducing the presidential term of office to five years and aligning it with the local and European elections;
  2. reducing the voting age to 17;
  3. review of the Dáil electoral system;
  4. giving citizens resident outside the State the right to vote in presidential elections at Irish embassies, or otherwise;
  5. provision for same-sex marriage;
  6. amending the clause on the role of women in the home and encouraging greater participation of women in public life;
  7. increasing the participation of women in politics;
  8. removal of the offence of blasphemy from the Constitution; and
  9. following completion of the above reports, such other relevant constitutional amendments that may be recommended by it
BTW, as far as the IT is concerned the CC is a sham:

The way politics is done - News Debate | Opinion & Discussion |The Irish Times - Thu, Jul 12, 2012
I was right then.
 

Telemachus

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Actually we do know.........

https://www.constitution.ie/Documents/ListOfMembers.pdf

All are Irish citizens, apart from perhaps one or two of the Northern MLA's. Take a quick look through the list, no "foreign" sounding names there. Hope this eases your xenophobic worries.
Thanks for that.

Gerry Adams, Martin McMurder, Bacik, Ciara Conway, Charlie Flanagan - these are mostly High IQ professional persuaders. Many of the lay members were picked by a polling organization, we don't know the rigor of their selection apart from them been picked from certain geographic and demographic sectors. This convention is a sham. Maybe though thats fine as since its so loaded with high profile lefties they will push for too much. Ronan Mullen may be the only well spoken traditionalist conservative there.
 

Hewson

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Ah yes ruserious, but you are missing the obvious, that the convention is a stunt complete with puppets and strings.

It has Kenny Lite written all over it.
And anything that gets Bacik's imprimatur needs three turns in the washing machine.
 

Hewson

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Thanks for that.

Gerry Adams, Martin McMurder, Bacik, Ciara Conway, Charlie Flanagan - these are mostly High IQ professional persuaders. Many of the lay members were picked by a polling organization, we don't know the rigor of their selection apart from them been picked from certain geographic and demographic sectors. This convention is a sham. Maybe though thats fine as since its so loaded with high profile lefties they will push for too much. Ronan Mullen may be the only well spoken traditionalist conservative there.
That's the part I'd take issue with.
 

Ren84

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Jan 14, 2011
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Thanks for that.

Gerry Adams, Martin McMurder, Bacik, Ciara Conway, Charlie Flanagan - these are mostly High IQ professional persuaders. Many of the lay members were picked by a polling organization, we don't know the rigor of their selection apart from them been picked from certain geographic and demographic sectors. This convention is a sham. Maybe though thats fine as since its so loaded with high profile lefties they will push for too much. Ronan Mullen may be the only well spoken traditionalist conservative there.
You do realise that FG has the most members in the convention?

And Martin McMurder? Get over yourself. :lol:
 

Eire1976

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About what? The topic list looks fairly good to me.
I said, if FG were to invent anything that deals with the constitution it will be to demean Irish culture or to suit the EU.

Your list is full of sh1te that is being done to suit the EU.

What has the Presidency of Ireland got to do with the EU?
 

Mercurial

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Jun 4, 2009
Messages
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Thanks for that.

Gerry Adams, Martin McMurder, Bacik, Ciara Conway, Charlie Flanagan - these are mostly High IQ professional persuaders. Many of the lay members were picked by a polling organization, we don't know the rigor of their selection apart from them been picked from certain geographic and demographic sectors. This convention is a sham. Maybe though thats fine as since its so loaded with high profile lefties they will push for too much. Ronan Mullen may be the only well spoken traditionalist conservative there.
"I don't like the result, therefore it must have been a fix."
 

Ren84

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I said, if FG were to invent anything that deals with the constitution it will be to demean Irish culture or to suit the EU.

Your list is full of sh1te that is being done to suit the EU.
How? And I don't see how same sex marriage, removal of blasphemy and extending voting rights to Nordies is somehow demeaning to Irish culture or policies that FG are big supporters of for that matter. In fact there's nothing in there, bar aligning Presidential elections with EU and local elections, that is in anyway pro EU!! You're seeing things that aren't there. :confused:
 
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