Is there a place for religion in modern politics?

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Religion for years has shaped the very laws our elected representatives have set out for us, however in this post modern world religion has taken a step back and been replaced with a new religion of politics.

For someone like myself who still holds a fundamental value and belief in the power of a supreme being, I hope that my actions during this life will be rewarded in the after life.

That is me, but for others the idea if allowing a political influence to shape the way politicians behave or make decisions is repulsive.

The question I am posing is if religion has any place in a modern society when it comes to politics?

Should a TD be seen attending mass on a Sunday, funerals for their lost friends, and weddings for their mates?

Should a politician be seen to live a good Christian life ?

Or should we go down the road to ban all instruments of religion from the world of politics ?
 


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You don't understand secularism if you're asking those questions.

Here is an opposing question: should politicians sit in their car smoking while the obsequies for a President take place?
 

ruserious

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There should be a complete separation of the political and religious spheres.

A TD going to Mass in a private capacity is obviously not a problem.

Start by removing crosses and morning prayers from political chambers. Then remove religious references from the constitution such as the Holy Trinity whom all authority is apparently owed.
 
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You don't understand secularism if you're asking those questions.

Here is an opposing question: should politicians sit in their car smoking while the obsequies for a President take place?
I agree that there is a lot of dressing up when it comes to religion in politics, this gives us two questions.

Do you want your politicians acting all religious?

Should religion be totally removed from politics?
 
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There should be a complete separation of the political and religious spheres.

A TD going to Mass in a private capacity is obviously not a problem.

Start by removing crosses and morning prayers from political chambers. Then remove religious references from the constitution such as the Holy Trinity whom all authority is apparently owed.
Can a TD go to mass privately though?

Even the Irish constitution would need a rewrite to remove the idea of a God.

Would you accept that the idea of a God regardless of personal beliefs provides the state with a moral compass?
 

ruserious

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Can a TD go to mass privately though?

Even the Irish constitution would need a rewrite to remove the idea of a God.

Would you accept that the idea of a God regardless of personal beliefs provides the state with a moral compass?
No. Religion does not hold a monopoly on morality. The state ought to owe its authority from its citizens and its citizens alone.
 

Hewson

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Religion for years has shaped the very laws our elected representatives have set out for us, however in this post modern world religion has taken a step back and been replaced with a new religion of politics.

For someone like myself who still holds a fundamental value and belief in the power of a supreme being, I hope that my actions during this life will be rewarded in the after life.

That is me, but for others the idea if allowing a political influence to shape the way politicians behave or make decisions is repulsive.

The question I am posing is if religion has any place in a modern society when it comes to politics?

Should a TD be seen attending mass on a Sunday, funerals for their lost friends, and weddings for their mates?

Should a politician be seen to live a good Christian life ?

Or should we go down the road to ban all instruments of religion from the world of politics ?
We've already removed moral obligation from politics.

Who's going to miss religion?
 
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No. Religion does not hold a monopoly on morality. The state ought to owe its authority from its citizens and its citizens alone.
But who decided what the moral compass is?

At least with the ten commandments society had an agreed set of rules to work from, would you be happy with the moral compass being shifted and set by people like Enda?
 

Mercurial

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If you're going to try to justly laws that affect other people who don't share you religious views, you should probably try to make sure that there are secular reasons capable of justifying the law in question.
 

ruserious

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But who decided what the moral compass is?

At least with the ten commandments society had an agreed set of rules to work from, would you be happy with the moral compass being shifted and set by people like Enda?
There has been good ideas come from Religion. Any honest atheist will say that. But to source them officially to God in a constitution? No. The Ten Commandments are a load of crock anyway. "Don't covet your neighbours goods" hmmm that's what makes the economy work.
 
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If you're going to try to justly laws that affect other people who don't share you religious views, you should probably try to make sure that there are secular reasons capable of justifying the law in question.
I dont think we have any examples in life of where different religions have been able to work with each other, it certainly would be a positive step forward and help to provide a idealistic world but with that you would also have to consider those without religion. I suppose though those without religion already excluded.
 
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There has been good ideas come from Religion. Any honest atheist will say that. But to source them officially to God in a constitution? No. The Ten Commandments are a load of crock anyway. "Don't covet your neighbours goods" hmmm that's what makes the economy work.
Have the ten commandments not been the basis for all western laws?
 

ruserious

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Have the ten commandments not been the basis for all western laws?
I dunno, for a society to work you don't need some bearded man come down from a mountain to tell
us not to murder or steal.
 

Hewson

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There has been good ideas come from Religion. Any honest atheist will say that. But to source them officially to God in a constitution? No. The Ten Commandments are a load of crock anyway. "Don't covet your neighbours goods" hmmm that's what makes the economy work.
Sorry, too pat.

The Ten Commandments are a framework for life, not an autocratic diktat. Christianity gets a lot of bad press, some of it justified, some of it just born of ignorance but if everybody put into practice the basic tenets enshrined in those words then poverty, war, famine, corruption, theft and just about every curable affliction known to man would be things of the past.

We don't though. Hence the world you subscribe to.
 

SideysGhost

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Would you accept that the idea of a God regardless of personal beliefs provides the state with a moral compass?
Go get fncked.

There's nothing more insidious than this utter bilge religious snake-oil-peddlers, curtain-twitchers, fundamentalists, social reactionaries and swivel-eyed lunatics like to peddle, that without religion there can be no ethics, no right and wrong, no moral compass.

It was comprehensively demolished by Greek philosophers 2500 years ago but you snivelling headcases still trot it out at every available opportunity in order to justify your sneaking infiltration of social and political organisations, your bizarre insistence on controlling other peoples lives, your creepy perverse obsession about all things sexual, your psychotic belief that the demented warblings of some desert death-cult camel-herders 2000 years ago must define social policy in 21st century industrialised countries.

Chant gibberish at your imaginary sky wizard and your cosmic zombie carpenter all you want in your own time. But try to force - or sneak by the back door - your weirdo loonytunes religious beliefs into public policy, and you should be slapped down and told to sit down and STFU, hard.
 

ruserious

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Sorry, too pat.

The Ten Commandments are a framework for life, not an autocratic diktat. Christianity gets a lot of bad press, some of it justified, some of it just born of ignorance but if everybody put into practice the basic tenets enshrined in those words then poverty, war, famine, corruption, theft and just about every curable affliction known to man would be things of the past.

We don't though. Hence the world you subscribe to.
You've never broken one of the commandments?
 

Dadaist

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I agree that there is a lot of dressing up when it comes to religion in politics, this gives us two questions.

Do you want your politicians acting all religious?

Should religion be totally removed from politics?
The question you haven't asked is what is the relevance of one's personal spiritual beliefs when you are an elected politician? Especially at national level. Afaik there have been no politicians elected to the Dáil via a religious mandate in modern times.

If religion is to have any influence on politics, then a politician would need to highlight the fact that their policies and future actions are influenced by their particular religious beliefs. As I said, I haven't seen it in the modern era. Without such a mandate a politician would not be truly representing his/her flock as s/he would not know which of his/her voters are of a similar spiritual outlook.
 

wombat

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There are two approaches to separation of church and state - the U.S. Where the state can't endow a particular religion but freedom to worship is protected or the French model loved by Irish secularists which is basically anti catholic but can't handle islamists.
 

Hewson

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Sidey, you keep bringing up the subject of sex well before anybody gets to it.

Why's that, do you think?
 


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