Is this the end for the Anglo-Saxon model?

readytogo

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Mary Harney once said that Ireland's economy was closer to Boston than Berlin. That was back in 2000.

Mary Dejevsky had an excellent article in yesterday's British Independent saying that if she was a French or German politician, she would demand "an apology from the US and Britain for the self-righteous lectures about growth they delivered during their credit-fuelled economic booms".

Mary Dejevsky: A nation's success is defined by much more than its GDP - Mary Dejevsky, Commentators - The Independent

Such 'self-righteous lectures' were not limited to the UK and America. As Morgan Kelly noted:

And unlike the Greeks, we lacked the tact and common sense to keep our grubby dealing to ourselves. Europeans had to endure a decade of Irish politicians strutting around and telling them how they needed to emulate our crony capitalism if they wanted to be as rich as we are. As far as other Europeans are concerned, the Irish Government is aiming to add injury to insult by getting their taxpayers to help the “Richest Nation in Europe” continue to enjoy its lavish lifestyle.​

Conor McCabe at Dublin Opinion recently dug up an editorial in the Irish Times from 24th August, 2006:

Dublin Opinion » Blog Archive » GERALDINE KENNEDY, 2006: GERMANY MUST FOLLOW IRELAND’S LEAD; THE STUDENT HAS NOW BECOME THE MASTER

German elections have shown an electorate that continues to be reluctant to abandon the social model of generous welfare provision and extensive public services. The result has been a worsening budgetary position in a country whose pensions burden will approach crisis levels within a few decades.

How ironic it is that we are approaching the tenth anniversary of the formation of the EU Stability Pact. For it was on the insistence of a German finance minister that countries wishing to participate in economic and monetary union agreed to abide by a code of fiscal discipline.

At the time, Ireland was one of the countries with which Germany feared to share a currency. Ireland bravely accepted the pact’s terms and adhered to them with flying colours, only to see Germany - under the chancellorship of Gerhard Schroder - disregard the pact flagrantly.

The student has now become the master.

If Germany’s economy does indeed relapse into slowdown, its electorate may have to conclude that the time has finally come to accept a strong dose of its medicine.

In doing so, it can draw inspiration from that medicine’s success in reducing unemployment in Ireland to the lowest level in the EU.​
 
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ocoonassa

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Anglo-Saxons are extinct like dinosaurs, they never had much of a business model other than feudalism, it sucked.
 

Mar Tweedy

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I agree it is discredited as a model. Unfortunately though, in the efforts to deal with the crisis it has created, it will deliver more of the same, even more harshly. Cuts and privatisations of public services will be imposed, and the social democracies under strain from the collapse of a credit party which they did not attend, will also come under pressure to do exactly what Madame suggested (except this time at least they won't have to deal with the hubris).

It's a disaster for ordinary people. The only light I see is that the inhumanity of the model will be made so visible, that it will, after much trauma, be binned and replaced by something that puts everyone's welfare at its centre, and not just the welfare of those who have enough wealth to exercise their liberty to ensure that the liberty of the few is protected at the expense of the liberty of the many to enjoy any sort of a decent life.

Might happen quicker than I can see now. History can move quickly during times of crisis.
 

Pauli

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A cursory look at the state of the USA, the UK and particularly Ireland will tell you that this creed is a beaten docket. Strangely, it has its defenders, even on this forum, who are a discontented bunch of reality-deniers. A defence of neo-liberalist economics is usually preceded by a bout of chronic flatulence by the defender. In this, the defender is merely clearing his throat before launching into his impassioned if somewhat deranged speech.

This is not an aural forum so you have to decipher the throat-clearing through text alone.
 

Dredger

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[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQcNiD0Z3MU]YouTube - Johnny cash - Personal jesus[/ame]
 

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Dillinger

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Dublin Opinion » Blog Archive » GERALDINE KENNEDY, 2006: GERMANY MUST FOLLOW IRELAND’S LEAD; THE STUDENT HAS NOW BECOME THE MASTER

German elections have shown an electorate that continues to be reluctant to abandon the social model of generous welfare provision and extensive public services. The result has been a worsening budgetary position in a country whose pensions burden will approach crisis levels within a few decades.

How ironic it is that we are approaching the tenth anniversary of the formation of the EU Stability Pact. For it was on the insistence of a German finance minister that countries wishing to participate in economic and monetary union agreed to abide by a code of fiscal discipline.

At the time, Ireland was one of the countries with which Germany feared to share a currency. Ireland bravely accepted the pact’s terms and adhered to them with flying colours, only to see Germany - under the chancellorship of Gerhard Schroder - disregard the pact flagrantly.

The student has now become the master.

If Germany’s economy does indeed relapse into slowdown, its electorate may have to conclude that the time has finally come to accept a strong dose of its medicine.

In doing so, it can draw inspiration from that medicine’s success in reducing unemployment in Ireland to the lowest level in the EU.​


Jesus what a muppet. In 2006 I was busy selling my property, because the warning signs were out there for anyone with half a brain. Although, most people were too busy strutting around boasting about how much they were worth.
 

Pauli

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Dublin Opinion » Blog Archive » GERALDINE KENNEDY, 2006: GERMANY MUST FOLLOW IRELAND’S LEAD; THE STUDENT HAS NOW BECOME THE MASTER

German elections have shown an electorate that continues to be reluctant to abandon the social model of generous welfare provision and extensive public services. The result has been a worsening budgetary position in a country whose pensions burden will approach crisis levels within a few decades.

How ironic it is that we are approaching the tenth anniversary of the formation of the EU Stability Pact. For it was on the insistence of a German finance minister that countries wishing to participate in economic and monetary union agreed to abide by a code of fiscal discipline.

At the time, Ireland was one of the countries with which Germany feared to share a currency. Ireland bravely accepted the pact’s terms and adhered to them with flying colours, only to see Germany - under the chancellorship of Gerhard Schroder - disregard the pact flagrantly.

The student has now become the master.

If Germany’s economy does indeed relapse into slowdown, its electorate may have to conclude that the time has finally come to accept a strong dose of its medicine.

In doing so, it can draw inspiration from that medicine’s success in reducing unemployment in Ireland to the lowest level in the EU.​

Jesus wept. How dire can this possibly be?

"The student has now become the master" Christ almighty, does it get worse than this?

And the Germans can "draw inspiration" from us?? In what way can the world's second-biggest export economy draw inspiration from an IMF intensive care patient???

Now wonder the reputation of the Irish Times is stuck in the S-bend.

Of course, she WAS a PD TD at one stage.
 

Panopticon

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Has no-one here noticed that it is GERMAN and FRENCH banks that are embroiled in debts to Ireland, as well as UK and US banks? So the "credit" line is a lie.

Has no-one noticed that the PIIGS are, with one exception, Continental-model economies? So the "poorly-run" line is a lie.

French youth unemployment was already 25% before the crisis. I wonder how high it is now? So the "humane" line is a lie.

Given all that, I don't see what the Continental economic model has to say for itself.

All of Europe has been working and spending like it's 1959 for the last 50 years. The "end of crisis" for France will be getting back to the 8-10% unemployment rates that they have been used to for the last 20 years. If we in the Anglo-Saxon world can aspire to better things than 1 in 10 workers out of work, that is a condemnation of the Continental model.
 

clonycavanman

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End of the Anglo-Saxon model?; long hours culture, cheap-as-chips labour, trickle-down wealth, de-regulation, responsibility-free hiring and firing, consequence-free bankrupcy...let's hope so.
 

clonycavanman

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Given all that, I don't see what the Continental economic model has to say for itself.
It would say, 'Look at Switzerland'.
And...what was Irish youth unemployment at the peak of the boom? In Limerick it was 62%.
In Limerick it was 62%
In Limerick it was 62%
 

Panopticon

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End of the Anglo-Saxon model?; long hours culture, cheap-as-chips labour, trickle-down wealth, de-regulation, responsibility-free hiring and firing, consequence-free bankrupcy...let's hope so.
Enjoy permanent 8-10% unemployment, low economic growth, labour laws biased towards incumbent workers, emigration of the most talented to the United States, immigration tensions and dependence on the Anglo-Saxon countries for almost every new business idea.
 

Panopticon

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It would say, 'Look at Switzerland'.
And...what was Irish youth unemployment at the peak of the boom? In Limerick it was 62%.
In Limerick it was 62%
In Limerick it was 62%
Switzerland as a typical Continental economy? Really?

I suppose every Continental economy must be the world leader in international banking. Better than all the other world leaders. Wait a minute...

Limerick is a city of, what, <100k people? You can leave Limerick relatively easily to take a job in Shannon, Ennis, Nenagh, even perfidious Dublin. France is a country of 60 MILLION people. We can play this game and ask about unemployment in Marseille if you like, but it's kind of facetious to compare unemployment in Ireland's poorest city to that in an entire, large, modern country.
 

McDave

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Jesus wept. How dire can this possibly be?

"The student has now become the master" Christ almighty, does it get worse than this?

And the Germans can "draw inspiration" from us?? In what way can the world's second-biggest export economy draw inspiration from an IMF intensive care patient???

Now wonder the reputation of the Irish Times is stuck in the S-bend.

Of course, she WAS a PD TD at one stage.
Kennedy has to be for the high jump. There have been quite a number of dire editorials on her watch, including supporting Bush on Iraq.

Irish hubris was widespread and sustained. Likewise for many of the proponents of the Anglo-Saxon model who preached relentlessly (and some still do) at the continentals for adhering to their (IMO) more balanced economic and social model. It's fine if the UK and the US want to follow a particular path. But trying to force others...

At any rate, now is the time to revisit the question do we want to be more like Boston or Berlin (well, at any rate after Harney has vacated her Dail seat).
 

Aindriu

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End of the Anglo-Saxon model?; long hours culture, cheap-as-chips labour, trickle-down wealth, de-regulation, responsibility-free hiring and firing, consequence-free bankrupcy...let's hope so.
Not!

In America you can have worked for a company for twenty years only to come in on a Monday morning and be fired. No redundandcy, no come back, nothing!

If you think that is a good model to follow then screw you!
 

Pauli

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Enjoy permanent 8-10% unemployment, low economic growth, labour laws biased towards incumbent workers, emigration of the most talented to the United States, immigration tensions and dependence on the Anglo-Saxon countries for almost every new business idea.

Dependence on the Anglo-Saxon countries for every new business idea???? Bollocks!

Every bad business idea perhaps!
 

onlyasking

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I agree it is discredited as a model. Unfortunately though, in the efforts to deal with the crisis it has created, it will deliver more of the same, even more harshly. Cuts and privatisations of public services will be imposed, and the social democracies under strain from the collapse of a credit party which they did not attend, will also come under pressure to do exactly what Madame suggested (except this time at least they won't have to deal with the hubris).

It's a disaster for ordinary people. The only light I see is that the inhumanity of the model will be made so visible, that it will, after much trauma, be binned and replaced by something that puts everyone's welfare at its centre, and not just the welfare of those who have enough wealth to exercise their liberty to ensure that the liberty of the few is protected at the expense of the liberty of the many to enjoy any sort of a decent life.

Might happen quicker than I can see now. History can move quickly during times of crisis.
Absolutely first class analysis.

We should never underestimate the power of the business sector propaganda, as expressed by the media entities which operate from the heart of the business sector. After all, didn't Eoghan Harris claim to have played a central role on his own in the re-election of the Bertie & Biffo caravan of economic death? That's massive power in the hands of one single madman.

De-regulatory right wing policies lead us to disaster. The business sector propagandists like those in the Sindo, Stephen Collins and Madame in the IT, and the rest will hammer home the theme, as they are doing right now, that more right wing policies are the only panacea, as well as the lie that public sector workers are at the heart of our downfall.

This savagery will be brought to bear in order to lay the foundations for the next round of boom and bust, during which economic power will be further concentrated in even fewer, richer hands. And the wishes of the super rich will continue to be expressed through their mercenary hack-knights in the media.

As you say however, the continuation of the Irish sheep-like mentality, sustained as it is by the moronic celebrity and sports circuses promoted by the media, should not be assumed to be a permanent, immutable state.

Unforeseen cathartic events unfolded rapidly in the past. The ordinary people will only take so much, and I believe that more than the necessary amount of pain is on the cards.
 

Cato

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Not only is the economic model a busted flush, but the model of society is also failing. The British psychologist, Oliver James, in his book, Affluenza, shows that the Anglo-Saxon model of society actively causes mental distress within their populations.
 


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