Is this the end of Orangism?

rem81

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We must not allow our hopes to influence our predictions. Rumours about the death of the Orange Order tend to be very exaggerated - unfortunately.
The reason they don't allow any members with Catholic parents?
 


rem81

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Any fair and decent society would not tolerate them for one second sir.
What's the point of Protestants being effected their parents religion? If they are Good Prods that should be enough.
 

alba go bragh

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This is my first post because I did not have the confidence to do it mainly I have had 2 strokes in the last 4 years anyway, I live in a village in Ayrshire called Dreghorn it is called a "loyalist village". The leader of the SNP Nicola Sturgeon brought up in the village and her parents still live there, on the other side the "Top Man" of the OO is also from the village his name is Jim McHarg. I would say since the 2014 referendum the people of the village is almost 50/50 Nat or Yoon and the actual % of religion is about 96% Prod. The Lodge in the village is now has probably less than 30 members whereas 10 years ago there would have been 60 plus members. Also Kilmarnock now have got a good support now in the village and a lot of them are ex Rangers fans like myself who are Nationalists and have taken our backs away from bigotry. I know it is only a village of Ayrshire with a population of 3k plus but things are definitely getting better for the village, Ayrshire and Scotland
 
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mr_anderson

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I find the OO somewhat fascinatingly ironic.
Throught their stoic opposition to the RCC, they have actually become the RCC - left behind by society while they cling to a long lost past.

And like the RCC, they still have their fundementalist supporters.

But the writing is on the wall.

Has been for years.
 

AhNowStop

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I find the OO somewhat fascinatingly ironic.
Throught their stoic opposition to the RCC, they have actually become the RCC - left behind by society while they cling to a long lost past.

And like the RCC, they still have their fundementalist supporters.

But the writing is on the wall.

Has been for years.
a beautiful irony indeed :unsure: lol
 

AhNowStop

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This is my first post because I did not have the confidence to do it mainly I have had 2 strokes in the last 4 years anyway, I live in a village in Ayrshire called Dreghorn it is called a "loyalist village". The leader of the SNP Nicola Sturgeon brought up in the village and her parents still live there, on the other side the "Top Man" of the OO is also from the village his name is Jim McHarg. I would say since the 2014 referendum the people of the village is almost 50/50 Nat or Yoon and the actual % of religion is about 96% Prod. The Lodge in the village is now has probably less than 30 members whereas 10 years ago there would have been 60 plus members. Also Kilmarnock now have got a good support now in the village and a lot of them are ex Rangers fans like myself who are Nationalists and have taken our backs away from bigotry. I know it is only a village of Ayrshire with a population of 3k plus but things are definitely getting better for the village, Ayrshire and Scotland
Good to hear (y)

Scotland & Ireland will both be better off away from Londons interference .. it may take a while but it will most certainly be worth it.
 

Mickeymac

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This is my first post because I did not have the confidence to do it mainly I have had 2 strokes in the last 4 years anyway, I live in a village in Ayrshire called Dreghorn it is called a "loyalist village". The leader of the SNP Nicola Sturgeon brought up in the village and her parents still live there, on the other side the "Top Man" of the OO is also from the village his name is Jim McHarg. I would say since the 2014 referendum the people of the village is almost 50/50 Nat or Yoon and the actual % of religion is about 96% Prod. The Lodge in the village is now has probably less than 30 members whereas 10 years ago there would have been 60 plus members. Also Kilmarnock now have got a good support now in the village and a lot of them are ex Rangers fans like myself who are Nationalists and have taken our backs away from bigotry. I know it is only a village of Ayrshire with a population of 3k plus but things are definitely getting better for the village, Ayrshire and Scotland

Interesting post indeed Alba, hopefully your health improves sir as you continue to contribute to the forum.(y)
 

Mickeymac

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I find the OO somewhat fascinatingly ironic.
Throught their stoic opposition to the RCC, they have actually become the RCC - left behind by society while they cling to a long lost past.

And like the RCC, they still have their fundementalist supporters.

But the writing is on the wall.

Has been for years.

Just when many of the sane and sensible have given up on any progress in the six counties we get this piece of good news in the demise of Orangeism.
 

mr_anderson

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Messages
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This is my first post because I did not have the confidence to do it mainly I have had 2 strokes in the last 4 years anyway, I live in a village in Ayrshire called Dreghorn it is called a "loyalist village". The leader of the SNP Nicola Sturgeon brought up in the village and her parents still live there, on the other side the "Top Man" of the OO is also from the village his name is Jim McHarg. I would say since the 2014 referendum the people of the village is almost 50/50 Nat or Yoon and the actual % of religion is about 96% Prod. The Lodge in the village is now has probably less than 30 members whereas 10 years ago there would have been 60 plus members. Also Kilmarnock now have got a good support now in the village and a lot of them are ex Rangers fans like myself who are Nationalists and have taken our backs away from bigotry. I know it is only a village of Ayrshire with a population of 3k plus but things are definitely getting better for the village, Ayrshire and Scotland
Do you mind me asking, is religion still a 'thing' in Scotland ?

Also, 'Nat or Yoon' what does that mean ?

Thanks.
 

alba go bragh

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Do you mind me asking, is religion still a 'thing' in Scotland ?

Also, 'Nat or Yoon' what does that mean ?

Thanks.
Yes the religion thing is still there in the West and Central areas of Scotland but is not as bad was a decade ago imo Nat = Supporter of Independence----Yoon = Unionist. Yoon is small for union therefore a Yoon is a Unionist
 

PBP voter

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81% of Catholics in the north said they attended mass regularly (at least monthly) in 1998, falling to 52% in 2017. A rapid decline. The figure is even lower – 34% – in the Republic of Ireland.

Amongst Protestants in Northern Ireland, 52% attended church regularly in 1998, dropping to 43% in 2017


Religion will die out. So will the orange order.
 

PBP voter

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Do you mind me asking, is religion still a 'thing' in Scotland ?

Also, 'Nat or Yoon' what does that mean ?

Thanks.
Very little of it left in Scotland.

7.2% of Scotland's population regularly attend church, down from 17% in 1984;

 

belfast1981

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Interesting topic. There is no doubt 'Orangism' has lost its sway politically. And truthfully, that is a good thing. Non political independent institutions should not be allowed to dictate how a state is run. And it is a good thing the 'Orange state' is gone.

In saying that. The OO will always be around, and the 12th will always attract big crowds. At the core it is commemorating a battle. That happens world wide and I don't think anyone can truly object to that.

While for me the 12th is boring. I can understand the appeal that it brings to people. It is a family day with music, bands, entertainment etc.

The problem is not so much the order itself, but the actual supporters of the order. Get them riled up on the run up to the 12th and they become alcohol fuelled bigots with a 'ATAT' mentality.

The Orange Order museum was founded to give an understanding of the Order, and has attracted many catholic groups and visitors. Showing, that at the core the OO is about the 'Battle not the Bottle' and many have come away with a new understanding of what is, at the core a christian organisation preserving history. However it can't be said that many supporters (and some members) adhere to that principal.

They do need to take more steps to change the perception of being anti catholic. Lifting the ban on members attending Catholic services would go a long way to help the image. I can understand them not wanting to take part in Catholic services such as communion that happens during services . (I don't take part myself when at a catholic service) But an outright ban on going is long past needing changed. A move also needs to happen to show that you can celebrate your Protestant/Christian heritage without belittling the catholic faith and remembering it is a commemoration.

It is good to see that there is less and less trouble these days. But a lot of the bad image Orangism has is due to supporters and not the Order itself. However, the Order do have a big responsibility to speak out and say 'not in our name'

I've rambled enough. Have a nice day :)
 

Mickeymac

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Joined
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Messages
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Interesting topic. There is no doubt 'Orangism' has lost its sway politically. And truthfully, that is a good thing. Non political independent institutions should not be allowed to dictate how a state is run. And it is a good thing the 'Orange state' is gone.

In saying that. The OO will always be around, and the 12th will always attract big crowds. At the core it is commemorating a battle. That happens world wide and I don't think anyone can truly object to that.

While for me the 12th is boring. I can understand the appeal that it brings to people. It is a family day with music, bands, entertainment etc.

The problem is not so much the order itself, but the actual supporters of the order. Get them riled up on the run up to the 12th and they become alcohol fuelled bigots with a 'ATAT' mentality.

The Orange Order museum was founded to give an understanding of the Order, and has attracted many catholic groups and visitors. Showing, that at the core the OO is about the 'Battle not the Bottle' and many have come away with a new understanding of what is, at the core a christian organisation preserving history. However it can't be said that many supporters (and some members) adhere to that principal.

They do need to take more steps to change the perception of being anti catholic. Lifting the ban on members attending Catholic services would go a long way to help the image. I can understand them not wanting to take part in Catholic services such as communion that happens during services . (I don't take part myself when at a catholic service) But an outright ban on going is long past needing changed. A move also needs to happen to show that you can celebrate your Protestant/Christian heritage without belittling the catholic faith and remembering it is a commemoration.

It is good to see that there is less and less trouble these days. But a lot of the bad image Orangism has is due to supporters and not the Order itself. However, the Order do have a big responsibility to speak out and say 'not in our name'

I've rambled enough. Have a nice day :)


Actually a very good and interesting contribution Bel, pity we had not more unionist contributors like your good self ........and you have a good one(y)
 

AhNowStop

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Joined
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Messages
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Interesting topic. There is no doubt 'Orangism' has lost its sway politically. And truthfully, that is a good thing. Non political independent institutions should not be allowed to dictate how a state is run. And it is a good thing the 'Orange state' is gone.

In saying that. The OO will always be around, and the 12th will always attract big crowds. At the core it is commemorating a battle. That happens world wide and I don't think anyone can truly object to that.

While for me the 12th is boring. I can understand the appeal that it brings to people. It is a family day with music, bands, entertainment etc.

The problem is not so much the order itself, but the actual supporters of the order. Get them riled up on the run up to the 12th and they become alcohol fuelled bigots with a 'ATAT' mentality.

The Orange Order museum was founded to give an understanding of the Order, and has attracted many catholic groups and visitors. Showing, that at the core the OO is about the 'Battle not the Bottle' and many have come away with a new understanding of what is, at the core a christian organisation preserving history. However it can't be said that many supporters (and some members) adhere to that principal.

They do need to take more steps to change the perception of being anti catholic. Lifting the ban on members attending Catholic services would go a long way to help the image. I can understand them not wanting to take part in Catholic services such as communion that happens during services . (I don't take part myself when at a catholic service) But an outright ban on going is long past needing changed. A move also needs to happen to show that you can celebrate your Protestant/Christian heritage without belittling the catholic faith and remembering it is a commemoration.

It is good to see that there is less and less trouble these days. But a lot of the bad image Orangism has is due to supporters and not the Order itself. However, the Order do have a big responsibility to speak out and say 'not in our name'

I've rambled enough. Have a nice day :)
Sorry Bel but I cant agree .....


The pathetic DUP still let the OO (along with paramilitaries) tell them what to do .. e.g. The Feb 2018 deal to get stormont back up was vetoed by them..

So the OO "SHOULD NOT" hold political sway but they most certainly still do



and also, commemorating a battle is one thing .. if they kept it to the 12th that would be one thing but does it have to go on for half the year ? .. 2500 marches whose sole purpose is to p1ss off the fenians and keep the croppy in place .. thats all


and btw the reason there is less trouble the past couple of years is simply because the world is looking on, esp the Brits ... the fact that they can keep a lid on it when they want to proves them to be even more disgusting than I had previously thought..
.. Once the coalition of crackpots is over it will be "game on" again for the thugs while the DUP and OO stand back and say .. its not our fault sure we cant control them .. when they obviously can..
 
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Mickeymac

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I got this far (1st line re OO holding sway politically) Belfast1981 and had to stop ....

The pathetic DUP still let the OO (along with paramilitaries) tell it what to do .. e.g. The Feb 2018 deal to get stormont back up was vetoed by them..

So the OO "SHOULD NOT" hold political sway but they most certainly still do



and also, commemorating a battle is one thing .. if they kept it to the 12th that would be one thing but does it have to go on for half the year ? .. 2500 marches whose sole purpose is to p1ss off the fenians and keep the croppy in place .. thats all

I have never came across a statement from unionists on here posting something like this ANS...….

There is no doubt 'Orangism' has lost its sway politically. And truthfully, that is a good thing.

That opens tangient debate/discussion unlike the looney tune "bonfires, flegs, marching crap" we are subjected to from our usual suspects on a regular basis.
 


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