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J'accuse - Brian Lenihan

Malbekh

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Joined
Apr 30, 2009
Messages
3,012
On the 29th of September 2008, Brian Lenihan and Brian Cowen met with Brian Goggin and Richard Burrows of BoI and Dermot Gleeson and Eugene Sheehy of AIB. During this meeting, supported by officials from the Finance Ministry, Lenihan put forward his proposals for the bank guarantee scheme, a scheme that would guarantee all the liabilities in the banks, including the bonds of all the Irish banks.

In January 15th, Brian Lenihan announced that Anglo-Irish Banks was of systemic importance to Ireland and nationalised it. There was no choice in doing this, because we as the taxpayer, would have had to reimburse the vast majority of liabilities in the bank owing to that guarantee.

Today, Lenihan has announced that the expected bill for this nationalisation is a minimum of €22b. There can be no other conclusion that the decision to guarantee the liabilities in Anglo-Irish was the worst financial decision ever made in the (short) history of our country, likely never to be matched, and certainly never surpassed.

I believe Brian Lenihan to be an honourable man, I believe that when he made the statement extolling the virtues and importance of Anglo Irish, he did so not as a fabrication or obsfucation, but because he was merely incompetent and negligent.

Accordingly, and as a citizen of this State, because of this gross negligence and incompetence, I call on him to resign his position forthwith, and Brian Cowen, who backed his judgement and decisions, to allow this state and its citizens to pass judgement in a general election.
 


captainwillard

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Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
2,859
I read that Dermot gleeson is in deep financial trouble, having bought property at the peak. These men exercised poor judgment.
 

Corkoniense

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Joined
Nov 12, 2008
Messages
57
Brian Lenihan is most certainly not an honourable man. And he will not be resigining his position. FF will hang in for 2.5 more years, so that up to 200,000 Irish citizens will do as 60,000 did last year - like my brother - and emigrate. When that many angry voters have gone, the defeat for FF will be more palatable, and more likely they will be back in office (never in power) in 2017, having opposed each and every policy of the contradictory FG/Lab coalition whose policies will appease neither the right nor left in this country.

Twas ever thus. Sad to say it on this day of our nation's greatest betrayal.
 

owedtojoy

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Joined
Feb 27, 2010
Messages
46,688
In 2008, there was a danger that if Anglo went under, it might drag other banks with it, and collapse the international banking system.

Then was then, and now is now. I can scarcely believe that an Irish Government is comitting the Irish taxpayer to this enormous burden. An burden built up by the improvidence of Sean Fitzpatrick and the tricksy politicians who thought they were ensuring eternal exercise of power for themselves.

We need a general election desperately right now! Will some, any, backbencher vote for the good of people before party?
 
Joined
Sep 8, 2009
Messages
89
Brian Lenihan is most certainly not an honourable man. And he will not be resigining his position. FF will hang in for 2.5 more years, so that up to 200,000 Irish citizens will do as 60,000 did last year - like my brother - and emigrate. When that many angry voters have gone, the defeat for FF will be more palatable, and more likely they will be back in office (never in power) in 2017, having opposed each and every policy of the contradictory FG/Lab coalition whose policies will appease neither the right nor left in this country.

Twas ever thus. Sad to say it on this day of our nation's greatest betrayal.

+1
 

john scott

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Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
532
Yes, I agree, the decision to guarantee Anglo Irish was (is) a catastrophe. We're all paying for it now. Anglo should have been let go to the wall and wound up like any other failed company. I feel Cowen and Lenihan were bounced into it by the banks and did not have enough expertise to see the problems it would cause. It's not just you and me will be paying for it. I have two grandchildren and they'll be paying also. Probably the worst financial decision ever made by an Irish government.
 

SideysGhost

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Joined
Nov 30, 2009
Messages
17,364
Brian Lenihan is most certainly not an honourable man. And he will not be resigining his position. FF will hang in for 2.5 more years, so that up to 200,000 Irish citizens will do as 60,000 did last year - like my brother - and emigrate. When that many angry voters have gone, the defeat for FF will be more palatable, and more likely they will be back in office (never in power) in 2017, having opposed each and every policy of the contradictory FG/Lab coalition whose policies will appease neither the right nor left in this country.

Twas ever thus. Sad to say it on this day of our nation's greatest betrayal.
+2
 

cHeal

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Joined
Mar 31, 2008
Messages
301
I was under the impression that it was Brian Cowen, and Cowen alone who extended the guarantee to Anglo, against the advice of the central banking members present at the meeting. I believe that the guarantee was effective to stablise the banking system at the time, but it was only needed because Cowen and the government knowingly ignored the problem and believed the crap being spewed by the banks in the previous 6 months. At the very least Anglo should not have been included, and that afaik was a decision made solely by Brian Cowen. I hope he will be remembered as a traitor to this country.
 

An Gilladaker

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Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
4,295
Brian Lenihan is most certainly not an honourable man. And he will not be resigining his position. FF will hang in for 2.5 more years, so that up to 200,000 Irish citizens will do as 60,000 did last year - like my brother - and emigrate. When that many angry voters have gone, the defeat for FF will be more palatable, and more likely they will be back in office (never in power) in 2017, having opposed each and every policy of the contradictory FG/Lab coalition whose policies will appease neither the right nor left in this country.

Twas ever thus. Sad to say it on this day of our nation's greatest betrayal.
Dont put any money on Brian Lenihan not resigning as minster of no finance i do not think he will stay much longer and i do not blame him
 

MPB

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Joined
Nov 27, 2009
Messages
4,455
The guarantee was up in September.

The problem was nationalisation. Why was it nationalised?

Lenihan might not have known about the possible liabilities when he guaranteed them, but he did when he nationalised them.

Lenihan knew what he was doing. Lenihan knew we would be paying the debts of private investors and crooked borrowers.

Is there such a thing as the crime of treason in this country because if there is, this was surely a treacherous act.
 
B

birthday

I would like to see Garda raids on the homes of the BOI and AIB execs who made false statements about the solvency of their banks.
 

Barnacle

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Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
854
I would like to see Garda raids on the homes of the BOI and AIB execs who made false statements about the solvency of their banks.
I would like to see them raid the home of Fingleton, he was and is a key player in all this.
 

dunno

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Joined
Jan 29, 2009
Messages
1,263
Brian Lenihan is most certainly not an honourable man. And he will not be resigining his position. FF will hang in for 2.5 more years, so that up to 200,000 Irish citizens will do as 60,000 did last year - like my brother - and emigrate. When that many angry voters have gone, the defeat for FF will be more palatable, and more likely they will be back in office (never in power) in 2017, having opposed each and every policy of the contradictory FG/Lab coalition whose policies will appease neither the right nor left in this country.

Twas ever thus. Sad to say it on this day of our nation's greatest betrayal.
+2

The worst bank on earth is still with us, and will land us with at least a 20 billion Euro bill to keep it alive. Taken with the other banks, the bill looks to be 50 billion, but a person can suspect that it will be worse once all the liabilities are counted at some future time. The investors, subordinated bondholders and others, who funded the madness should be wiped out. Wasn't Richard Bruton saying as much on the news? They have no entitlement to a red cent of taxpayer money.
 

asset test

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Joined
Oct 3, 2008
Messages
14,593
Dont put any money on Brian Lenihan not resigning as minster of no finance i do not think he will stay much longer and i do not blame him
Would that be because he is ill, or because he might feel the guilt of what he has done to the nation?

BTW, looking at him on TV earlier he looked fine, and is an inspiration to those going through chemo for a serious cancer, it has to be said.

However, he should resign, but if he does, I reckon it will be put down to illness.
 

powderfinger

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Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
3,350
On the 29th of September 2008, Brian Lenihan and Brian Cowen met with Brian Goggin and Richard Burrows of BoI and Dermot Gleeson and Eugene Sheehy of AIB. During this meeting, supported by officials from the Finance Ministry, Lenihan put forward his proposals for the bank guarantee scheme, a scheme that would guarantee all the liabilities in the banks, including the bonds of all the Irish banks.

In January 15th, Brian Lenihan announced that Anglo-Irish Banks was of systemic importance to Ireland and nationalised it. There was no choice in doing this, because we as the taxpayer, would have had to reimburse the vast majority of liabilities in the bank owing to that guarantee.

Today, Lenihan has announced that the expected bill for this nationalisation is a minimum of €22b. There can be no other conclusion that the decision to guarantee the liabilities in Anglo-Irish was the worst financial decision ever made in the (short) history of our country, likely never to be matched, and certainly never surpassed.

I believe Brian Lenihan to be an honourable man, I believe that when he made the statement extolling the virtues and importance of Anglo Irish, he did so not as a fabrication or obsfucation, but because he was merely incompetent and negligent.

Accordingly, and as a citizen of this State, because of this gross negligence and incompetence, I call on him to resign his position forthwith, and Brian Cowen, who backed his judgement and decisions, to allow this state and its citizens to pass judgement in a general election.
As Toasteroven posted above Malbekh.
Was the Guarantee proposal not plucked from a banker's briefcase on that fateful night?
 

rubensni

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Joined
Apr 27, 2009
Messages
737
In 2008, there was a danger that if Anglo went under, it might drag other banks with it, and collapse the international banking system.
That's rubbish. There was no international risk from Anglo failing, merely domestic.
That night AIB and Bank of Ireland should have been nationalised, as if Anglo had failed they would have gone down with it. However, the international system hit the rocks in 2007 with the credit crunch and the Bear Stearns bailout. Lehman Brothers being refused bailout cash by Paulson was a symptom of this.

As for what Lenny knew, the regulator knew Anglo was finished in 2008 (the St Patrick's day massacre and the circular transactions) and it wouldn't have surprised any serious investors that it would have gone bust, so I don't find it credible that the minister didn't know that Anglo was a house of cards that would result in a pay out like we had today.
 

rubensni

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Joined
Apr 27, 2009
Messages
737
Because of this gross negligence and incompetence, I call on [Lenihan] to resign his position forthwith, and Brian Cowen, who backed his judgement and decisions, to allow this state and its citizens to pass judgement in a general election.
It is Cowen who is the real villain. He attended all those meetings with Lenihan that night, and had more invested in the survival of Anglo than any man outside the board of the rotten bank other than maybe Seán Quinn.
 

MPB

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Joined
Nov 27, 2009
Messages
4,455
As Toasteroven posted above Malbekh.
Was the Guarantee proposal not plucked from a banker's briefcase on that fateful night?
What happened that night has been classified Top Secret.

The Banking inquiry is barred from investigating it. Why?

My guess is that the Govt. were hoodwinked or black mailed.
 


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