Kelly appoints independent boundary review group for Cork City & County

eurlex

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,082
There was another proposal some time back to bring the entire Cork Metro region under a single authority......



If boundary expansion is the preferred plan then they should be ambitious and make the entire metro area one city region under Cork City Council. Dublins four local authorities need to likewise be merged into a new Dublin metro authority. The trend in England and the continent is for city regions, Ireland should do likewise.
Giving Cork City Council control over the approximate area bounded in dark green on the map would be the most sensible solution, if the option to expand the city council area is chosen rather than the option to merge the two councils into one.

It might even encourage a similar solution for Dublin which should really have one council (with boroughs in a 'federal' arrangement) for the entire built-up area of greater Dublin, to include Bray and Greystones, plus some suburbs and towns in Kildare and Meath, even if that upsets those for whom county boundaries are sacrosant.

I'm not sure I understand the Irish loyalty to county boundaries which were imposed by the English, albeit with some boundaries being based on pre-Norman political units. If it wasn't for the organisation of the GAA on county lines I suppose these loyalties wouldn't be anywhere near as strong as they are today. That's not a dig at the GAA which was only responding to counties which had been created centuries earlier.
 
Last edited:


Ren84

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Messages
49,046
Giving Cork City Council control over the approximate area coloured in dark green on the map would be the most sensible solution if the option to expand the city council area is chosen rather than the option to merge the two councils into one.

It might even encourage a similar solution for Dublin which should really have one council (with boroughs in a 'federal' arrangement) for the entire built-up area of greater Dublin, to include Bray and Greystones, plus some suburbs and towns in Kildare and Meath, even if that upsets those for whom county boundaries are sacrosant.

I'm not sure I understand the Irish loyalty to county boundaries which were imposed by the English, albeit with some boundaries being based on pre-Norman political units. If it wasn't for the organisation of the GAA on county lines I suppose these loyalties wouldn't be anywhere near as strong as they are today. That's not a dig at the GAA which was only responding to counties which had been created centuries earlier.
Unfortunately county boundaries are near sacrosanct. Anyone remember the near insurrection by Clare patriots when it was suggested parts of Clare be given to Limerick? Or Kilkenny folk marching against their lands being handed over to Waterford City in boundary reviews? Maybe if their moronic councils hadn't tried to feed off the success of nearby cities in acts of pure greed and built suburbs on their borders such proposals for land transfers wouldn't have been suggested to begin with.
 

eurlex

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,082
Unfortunately county boundaries are near sacrosanct. Anyone remember the near insurrection by Clare patriots when it was suggested parts of Clare be given to Limerick? Or Kilkenny folk marching against their lands being handed over to Waterford City in boundary reviews?
I know, utterly ridiculous. It's impossible to have rational urban planning and administration when such concerns are entertained.
 

jacko

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 6, 2009
Messages
2,650
dont know all 5 but Reidy comes across really well in the media and Dermot Keogh is an exceptional academic and a gentleman
 

GDPR

1
Joined
Jul 5, 2008
Messages
217,846
The Minister sees a clear case for extending the Cork City boundary to encompass a wider metropolitan area and has appointed an independent group to review the boundary and examine whether the local authority structures should be merged.
This seems to be sensible given that 79,000 people within Cork City, are under Cork County Council administrative area.

The option of unifying the city and county structures in Cork should also be considered in view of the potential benefits such as strengthening local government, elimination of administrative duplication, improved service delivery, greater efficiency, economies of scale, and more cohesive and effective economic development.
So they will also consider a merge, but not the intention at this point, but lets wait and see what is recommended.

News - Department of the Environment, Community & Local Government
 

Blissett

Active member
Joined
Nov 9, 2008
Messages
277
Giving Cork City Council control over the approximate area bounded in dark green on the map would be the most sensible solution, if the option to expand the city council area is chosen rather than the option to merge the two councils into one.

It might even encourage a similar solution for Dublin which should really have one council (with boroughs in a 'federal' arrangement) for the entire built-up area of greater Dublin, to include Bray and Greystones, plus some suburbs and towns in Kildare and Meath, even if that upsets those for whom county boundaries are sacrosant.

I'm not sure I understand the Irish loyalty to county boundaries which were imposed by the English, albeit with some boundaries being based on pre-Norman political units. If it wasn't for the organisation of the GAA on county lines I suppose these loyalties wouldn't be anywhere near as strong as they are today. That's not a dig at the GAA which was only responding to counties which had been created centuries earlier.
In many ways that map would be a pretty sensible approach from the City's point of view, harbour in the one Local Authority, and all the commuter towns, with room to expand.

However the difficulty in this lies in how viable the Local Authority left outside the boundary is. It would have somewhere in the ballpark of a 10th of the State's road surface, but it's rates base would have been hugely cut. Particularly with Littleisland Ringaskiddy, Ballincollig Douglas etc. How does the remnants of Cork CoCo manage to pay the bills, not easy by any means
 

Socratus O' Pericles

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
32,893
Are they deciding where The Great Wall Of Cork is going?
 

Patrick Healy

Active member
Joined
Mar 2, 2014
Messages
120
Crok County Council pay around half a million each year to the city council in rates on the County Hall (inside the official city boundary). A rough marker the city councils extension would be the smokeless zone, which pays over half of the County's rates / property taxes (As I said before there the same thing with different names), currently needed to fund roads etc in rural Cork. So City might axe the County Hall tax if such an extension was warranted. Given that part of the rates collected by dense area such as Cork and Dublin are distributed to places like Leitrim.
If more or even all Coucil functions are transferred to the likes of Irish Water, National Roads Authority, Environmental Protection Agency, and the suggested National Fire Service, and /or local property taxes / rates are abolished and replaced by central funding as is in many opposition parties manifestos, then such boundary matters would matter less in such a "joined up strategy".
 
Last edited:

Ren84

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Messages
49,046
In many ways that map would be a pretty sensible approach from the City's point of view, harbour in the one Local Authority, and all the commuter towns, with room to expand.

However the difficulty in this lies in how viable the Local Authority left outside the boundary is. It would have somewhere in the ballpark of a 10th of the State's road surface, but it's rates base would have been hugely cut. Particularly with Littleisland Ringaskiddy, Ballincollig Douglas etc. How does the remnants of Cork CoCo manage to pay the bills, not easy by any means
That's a good point. Any boundary change will have a negative effect on Cork County Council. Given the remit of this Cork Boundary Commission is to determine what is the best course of action for BOTH local authority areas it may conclude that a border extension for Cork City Council negatively affects the County Council to the extent that such action isn't recommended.

While a Cork City Council area that covers the entire metro region like in the image posted earlier IS the best thing for Cork City, especially as it includes key commuter towns as well Cork Harbour and airport, it would have a significantly adverse effect on the rest of the county. Within Cork county you have what is effectively fiscal transfers with Cork City areas under County jurisdiction subsidising the rest of the county. If that revenue were to vanish it could potentially make rump Co. Cork unviable.
 

Ryan Tubbs

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 20, 2012
Messages
3,602
Just merge the two already.
A ridiculous, contemptible suggestion. The County Council is already too big to be a single entity, which is why their area divisions (west, north and east) had a fair amount of power individually
 

locke

Well-known member
Joined
May 2, 2007
Messages
3,173
I don't see that it would be any less viable than Mayo or Donegal. There would still be some large towns - towns that may flourish more if they became the focus of their local authority.

While I can see some logic in the argument that Cork supports the rest of the county, this isn't logic that is applied to Dublin or Limerick (granted Limerick does support county areas, but the city makes up over 60% of that county's population).
 

eurlex

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,082
In many ways that map would be a pretty sensible approach from the City's point of view, harbour in the one Local Authority, and all the commuter towns, with room to expand.

However the difficulty in this lies in how viable the Local Authority left outside the boundary is. It would have somewhere in the ballpark of a 10th of the State's road surface, but it's rates base would have been hugely cut. Particularly with Littleisland Ringaskiddy, Ballincollig Douglas etc. How does the remnants of Cork CoCo manage to pay the bills, not easy by any means
Rate-sharing between the two councils, at least for the areas transferred? Heresy, I know...
 

Bea C

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 1, 2010
Messages
23,555
In the rural areas of Cork there are many examples of relict Hominid populations including an interesting Neandertaloid Sub-Speicies in West Cork. Therefore it wouldn't be 500,000 "people".
I know a guy from Bandon.
You should try saying that to his face :p
 

Bea C

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 1, 2010
Messages
23,555
dont know all 5 but Reidy comes across really well in the media and Dermot Keogh is an exceptional academic and a gentleman
Some impressive past pupils as well :)
 

im axeled

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 24, 2010
Messages
29,289
it is a better way of doing things than long fill done with limericck, limerick now has two mayors god knows how many planning and fire officers and their assistants, the same with secetarys, they are all costing the rate and tax payers dear, but then senior civil servants cannot be done without, now can they
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top