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ruserious

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This lough has been used by fishermen for generations but since independence in 1922, has found itself claimed by two states. Both Ireland and the UK claim the lough and both country's Navys have patrolled it in recent times. Is it about time with the visit of QEII in the summer that this old dispute is put to bed?

Location: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/LoughFoyleLocation.png

As recently as 2005, when asked to list those areas of EU member states where border definition is in dispute, a British Government minister responding for the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs stated:
Lough Foyle " is politically disputed between Ireland and the UK".

One example of an article: Foyle 'loughed' in dispute - Local - Londonderry Sentinel

Finally an example of the Dáil claiming ownership for Ireland: Dil ireann - Volume 328 - 31 March, 1981 - Written Answers. - Lough Foyle Vessel Explosion.

What do you all think? Worth fighting for? or just another costly exercise in trying to claim ownership?
 

ruserious

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Do they ever stop? Is it costly?

I don't know, I'm just throwing it out there. I suppose the legal work required to take the case furthur if it were to happen would cost alot and the loss of revenue from fishermen not allowed to fish in certain parts is costly to the local economy. The use of the Navy in the area also adds a small cost.
 
J

Johnny Boy

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I know Lough Foyle very well and have driven along the roads that run along its shore on both sides of the border, many times. I must admit I hadn't realised that this dispute arose, particularly as the Foyle Fisheriees Commission which was founded, I believe, in 1952 was one of the very first cross-border bodies.
The naked bias in that Sentinel report, with all its emotive language e.g. "covet" made me laugh, though - worthy of the Fox News Award for Objectivity!!!!!! It might have been written by LondonGregory himself.
Presumably the same situation applies in Carlingford lough.
As for settling the issue, I believe that would be very sensible. Common sense suggests that the boundary line should follow the contours of the coastlines at the halfway point.
 

ruserious

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Wait a minute. What about the North! LOL

Well thats already agreed between the two states i.e. until a majority favours a united Ireland, the status quo will remain but Lough Foyle is currently claimed by both states.
 

Estragon

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I know Lough Foyle very well and have driven along the roads that run along its shore on both sides of the border, many times. I must admit I hadn't realised that this dispute arose, particularly as the Foyle Fisheriees Commission which was founded, I believe, in 1952 was one of the very first cross-border bodies.
The naked bias in that Sentinel report, with all its emotive language e.g. "covet" made me laugh, though - worthy of the Fox News Award for Objectivity!!!!!! It might have been written by LondonGregory himself.
Presumably the same situation applies in Carlingford lough.
As for settling the issue, I believe that would be very sensible. Common sense suggests that the boundary line should follow the contours of the coastlines at the halfway point.

The one beautiful thing about the Sentinel is the utterly remorseless decline in its circulation.
 

Schomberg

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I thought we "shared" it via cross border bodies anyway?
 

seanad voter

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Who owns Loughs Foyle & Carlingford ?

I've honestly no idea which forum this should go into so will leave it upto the Mods/Admin.

I was reading the linked article below and wondered if anyone here could shed any light on the matter.

Will rent go to Queen? - Local - Derry Journal
 

QuizMaster

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The border runs through them and they are administered by the Loughs Agency, a committee with cross-border representation.
I travel along the banks of Lough Foyle (RoI side) every day to get to and from work.
From what I can see, the only shipping lane is very close to the RoI side. A lot of it is shallow and there are a lot of sandbanks at low tide. The shipping lane needs constant dredging.
 

seanad voter

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I'm regularly up and down both sides of Lough Foyle too (being a Derryman, although in exile in Lancashire) as my mum's from Moville and I'm often down there.

I've seen Irish pilot and fishery protection boats off Moville and Greencastle and Royal Navy frigates (at least I think they were frigates) on the other side.

There was an RN ship berthed near-permanently in Carlingford Lough (about halfway out) in recent years.
 

ManfredJudge

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Since ferry serives between Omeath and Warrenpoint have recently resumed (and the recently proposed construction of a new bridge) it is hoped[according to whom?] that there will be revived interaction between the two sides of the lough since these two towns are 20 km (13 miles) apart by road.

You have got to love wikipedia's editing on occasions. How long will that last?
 

seanad voter

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I like the bit in Wiki that goes :

"Unlike other borders in the EU, the Irish border is not officially marked by either government."

It reminded me of the occasion back in the late 1980s when I was retracing a trek that I used to make most Sundays as a kid out from Creggan in Derry and over Sherrif's Mountain down to a wee shop known as The Black Hut just inside County Donegal where I would buy my grandfather's favourite tobacco, Walnut Plug (he being from Clonakilty in Cork and having eventually settled in Derry).

I encountered a British Army foot-patrol on a back road about 400 yards inside Donegal arguing over their maps. I politely put them right - seeing as there were no road signs or other distinguishing features to enlighten them - and they turned about and trudged back uphill to a point where I distinctly heard one squaddie say as they examined the roadway "I'm telling you, the road definitely changes here. That side's tarmac, the other's concrete."

:)
 

TommyO'Brien

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Presumably it will be referred to a North-South body for agreement, with the British government indicating that it will accept whatever agreement is reached. That is the normal approach to solving disputes post the Belfast Agreement.

It could be jointly administered by the Northern Executive and the Irish Government.

On the British side, the procedure would be for the First Minister and Deputy First Minister to formally advise the Queen. As it is a territorial dispute, and therefore not within the powers of the Northern Executive, she would seek advice from the British Government, who would formally agree with the Executive stance.

Whatever agreement is reached with both states would be formally registered as a treaty between both states in the United Nations.
 

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