Make Cork Greater .. to counter balance Dublin

robut

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Had to be done :D ... BUT a genuine serious thing to consider for our country? .. THE DUBLIN COUNTER BALANCE

I remember in Urban Geography in College it was always said that a major city in any country. especially smaller countries needs a counter balance. To date in Ireland this has not happened.

For such a small country is it healthy for its economy to have such a large and growing concentration of population and business / jobs up the east coast in Dublin?

Should Irelands 2nd city be this counter balance?

However their are utterances that the current 2nd city should not be that counter balance. That it should be Limerick or Galway?

Limerick can be a counterbalance to Dublin, says Chamber : Limerick Post Newspaper

Just because Cork is the 2nd city does it in fact deserve to remain that and be the Dublin counter balance? Is it geographically good for this even in a small country like Ireland?

"The population of Cork City and its immediate suburbs was 208,669 according to the 2016 census, with in excess of 300,000 in the Metropolitan Cork area." ( via https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cork_(city)#Demographics )

Plenty of room for expansion AND Cork also has the second largest natural harbour in the world by navigational area. Another vastly under utilized resource by Ireland?

Home - Cork City Development Plan

Cork City Development Plan 2015‐2021



Of course factored into this is the ever promised but never delivered Cork to Limerick motorway & maybe the same to Waterford to complete the ring?
 


Schuhart

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Invest in Cork City? Fine.

But what's a counter balance? I've an interest in regional development, but I've never understood what this "balancing" act is meant to mean.

I suspect it means nothing at all.
 

dizillusioned

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Goal 2???

What a load of BS. This is waffle. Where in ANY city in the world is social inclusion going to come into it? This is purely aspirational rubbish.

Cork is never going to be a counter balance. The economy of Dublin will always be number one. Cork should be expanded but that requires a HUGE amount of infrastructure. Currently the airport is not supporting enough flights for that to happen.
 

robut

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Goal 2???

What a load of BS. This is waffle. Where in ANY city in the world is social inclusion going to come into it? This is purely aspirational rubbish.

Cork is never going to be a counter balance. The economy of Dublin will always be number one. Cork should be expanded but that requires a HUGE amount of infrastructure. Currently the airport is not supporting enough flights for that to happen.
In bold I THOROUGHLY agree with you. In my OP I never proposed that Dublin should ever be knocked from Number one, it will always be.

The counter balance idea is not to knock Dublin off its perch, its about making a city like Cork another alternative for economic growth etc in Ireland. FDI and all that not just, in the main, attracted to Dublin

http://www.corklocalgovernmentreview.ie/submissions/Pádraig MacConsaidín.pdf

The Centre for Planning Education and Research in University College Cork has been examining the boundary issue for a number of years, and has concluded, as outlined above, that a metropolitan solution to bring Cork in line with other mid-sized European cities and regions would be beneficial.

While the centre and in particular Dr Will Brady have advocated the reform, offering a metropolitan Cork as a counter balance to Dublin in the southern region, Cork must also accept and recognise its status as a second city, abandon ambitions of competing with Dublin in term of certain types of tourism, growth and investment. Instead, Cork should take a more targeted approach to the
development of the city and its surrounds by focusing on development which would be more appropriate for a city and region of its size.

This was discussed at length at a conference on Cork as a second city, held in the last number of years and which heard from local businesses, politicians and experts from other cities who held a similar second city status.
 

gleeful

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We could use that 13 billion from Cork's Apple gaff to build a TGV from Dublin to Cork - 40 minutes door to door.

That would help spread some industry farther afield from Dublin.
 

Dame_Enda

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Cork urgently requires flood defences. When I was last there in 2002 there was a lane that was effectively an open sewer near Oliver Plunkett St. I hope it has been fixed?
 

dizillusioned

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In bold I THOROUGHLY agree with you. In my OP I never proposed that Dublin should ever be knocked from Number one, it will always be.

The counter balance idea is not to knock Dublin off its perch, its about making a city like Cork another alternative for economic growth etc in Ireland. FDI and all that not just, in the main, attracted to Dublin

http://www.corklocalgovernmentreview.ie/submissions/Pádraig MacConsaidín.pdf
Unfortunately robut, Cork has so many issues (and I am not going to actually admit I like the place.. :) ) It would be great to have as a second hub, but access time is crucial along with infrastructure, two things that are actually missing in Cork. Flights are important, prestige (capital city) for many firms is paramount....E.g. Del Boys Robin Reliant.. New York, Paris, London, Cork???

While I would love to see Cork grown in a proper manner both economically and socially, I doubt if this will ever happen. Proper planning in Ireland is an oxymoron.
 

PC Principle

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Had to be done :D ... BUT a genuine serious thing to consider for our country? .. THE DUBLIN COUNTER BALANCE

I remember in Urban Geography in College it was always said that a major city in any country. especially smaller countries needs a counter balance. To date in Ireland this has not happened.

For such a small country is it healthy for its economy to have such a large and growing concentration of population and business / jobs up the east coast in Dublin?

Should Irelands 2nd city be this counter balance?

However their are utterances that the current 2nd city should not be that counter balance. That it should be Limerick or Galway?

Limerick can be a counterbalance to Dublin, says Chamber : Limerick Post Newspaper

Just because Cork is the 2nd city does it in fact deserve to remain that and be the Dublin counter balance? Is it geographically good for this even in a small country like Ireland?

"The population of Cork City and its immediate suburbs was 208,669 according to the 2016 census, with in excess of 300,000 in the Metropolitan Cork area." ( via https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cork_(city)#Demographics )

Plenty of room for expansion AND Cork also has the second largest natural harbour in the world by navigational area. Another vastly under utilized resource by Ireland?

Home - Cork City Development Plan

Cork City Development Plan 2015‐2021



Of course factored into this is the ever promised but never delivered Cork to Limerick motorway & maybe the same to Waterford to complete the ring?
Irish Gov has been trying that country-wide since the 1920's and has been failing miserably.

How is this new?

Cork will never attract the same (international) investment as Dublin so its a non starter straight away unless there is a indigenous miracle.
 

Spanner Island

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Invest in Cork City? Fine.

But what's a counter balance? I've an interest in regional development, but I've never understood what this "balancing" act is meant to mean.

I suspect it means nothing at all.
It's nuts this obsession with balancing...

Same in the UK with their north/south nonsense... although it's probably not quite as nuts there seeing as they've a population of 65 million and therefore should be able to accommodate several major cities...

We've got 5.5 million people or thereabouts... a smaller population than many cities... and we have to listen to nonsense about counter balancing Dublin...

FFS we're doing well to have Dublin... which doesn't compete with Cork or Limerick or Galway etc.

It competes with other cities around the world...

I'm not opposed to cities developing here but they should be as niche cities as opposed to constantly obsessing with counter balancing with Dublin...

Cork is due a €1 billion docklands development I believe... which hopefully will do well...

Extending the airports runway length might be an idea at some point too...

And post-Brexit Rosslare could probably be developed for intra EU freight direct to the Continent which Waterford should probably pick up some benefit from...

But if Dublin is neglected in order to try and force spread investment then the country will suffer as the investment will simply go to other countries...
 

Norman Bates

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Unfortunately robut, Cork has so many issues (and I am not going to actually admit I like the place.. :) ) It would be great to have as a second hub, but access time is crucial along with infrastructure, two things that are actually missing in Cork. Flights are important, prestige (capital city) for many firms is paramount....E.g. Del Boys Robin Reliant.. New York, Paris, London, Cork???

While I would love to see Cork grown in a proper manner both economically and socially, I doubt if this will ever happen. Proper planning in Ireland is an oxymoron.
Funny that. Anyway, I always looked on Belfast as the second city ... :evil:
 

mr_anderson

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Invest in Cork City? Fine.

But what's a counter balance? I've an interest in regional development, but I've never understood what this "balancing" act is meant to mean.

I suspect it means nothing at all.

Dublin can send Cork all it's social welfare tenants to ''balance'' out the populations.
 

ruserious

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Cork is a net provider to the Irish State and as such, we don't actually need the rest of Ye. We have a magnificent agricultural and fisheries base and great manufacturing industry. Did you know over half the worlds supply of both Viagra and TicTacs are made in Cork (just don't mix em up!).
 

dizillusioned

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Funny that. Anyway, I always looked on Belfast as the second city ... :evil:
You would..... :) (notice I didn't say anything about being a geographically located slang for English person)

Seriously, the imbalance is basically down to geographical location. Belfast and Dublin are close to the British mainland and closer to Europe. While I know that flight has decreased this importance, it will never completely diminish the importance of Capital City.

I have read back through the points that were made and it is all too academic and aspirational. Real cities develop based on need, those that do not, perish..;)
 

Betson

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Cork urgently requires flood defences. When I was last there in 2002 there was a lane that was effectively an open sewer near Oliver Plunkett St. I hope it has been fixed?
Aren't you a Wexican? did you not go down there this weekend to support your county?
 

gleeful

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Cork urgently requires flood defences. When I was last there in 2002 there was a lane that was effectively an open sewer near Oliver Plunkett St. I hope it has been fixed?
Cork used to be a city of canals like Venice. In the 18th Century, the canals were filled in because of sanitary problems. But no wonder its always flooded.
 

Sweet Darling

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We could use that 13 billion from Cork's Apple gaff to build a TGV from Dublin to Cork - 40 minutes door to door.

That would help spread some industry farther afield from Dublin.
Cut the bulls%^t in the non Leinster places about Pylons, Gas pipes, etc, and they should attract jobs
 

Nemesiscorporation

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Had to be done :D ... BUT a genuine serious thing to consider for our country? .. THE DUBLIN COUNTER BALANCE

I remember in Urban Geography in College it was always said that a major city in any country. especially smaller countries needs a counter balance. To date in Ireland this has not happened.

For such a small country is it healthy for its economy to have such a large and growing concentration of population and business / jobs up the east coast in Dublin?

Should Irelands 2nd city be this counter balance?

However their are utterances that the current 2nd city should not be that counter balance. That it should be Limerick or Galway?

Limerick can be a counterbalance to Dublin, says Chamber : Limerick Post Newspaper

Just because Cork is the 2nd city does it in fact deserve to remain that and be the Dublin counter balance? Is it geographically good for this even in a small country like Ireland?

"The population of Cork City and its immediate suburbs was 208,669 according to the 2016 census, with in excess of 300,000 in the Metropolitan Cork area." ( via https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cork_(city)#Demographics )

Plenty of room for expansion AND Cork also has the second largest natural harbour in the world by navigational area. Another vastly under utilized resource by Ireland?

Home - Cork City Development Plan

Cork City Development Plan 2015‐2021



Of course factored into this is the ever promised but never delivered Cork to Limerick motorway & maybe the same to Waterford to complete the ring?
Actually there needs to be investment in Cork, Limerick, Galway, Athlone, Sligo and Letterkenny to balance the economy of the entire island. The Dublin 1st and Cork gets a few scraps while the rest of the country rots mentality needs to be tackled.

Also the line that goes through the heads of planners, politicians and most others it seems, from Drogheda to Tuam needs to be erased, as there are lands north of that, which are not inhabited by monsters, werewolfs, vampires, serpents, zombies, etc.

There also needs to be twin high speed rail from Dublin, through Dublin airport to Belfast and a branch line from Dublin airport to Monaghan, through Omagh, splitting at Strabane for Derry and Letterkenny.

That would be the start of creating a faster growing, more balanced economy.
 


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