Martin Naughton's prescription

Kevin Parlon

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IT reports on Dr. Naughton's prescription for the restoration of our country.

Top industrialist wants Dáil halved and overseas aid ended - The Irish Times - Fri, Dec 03, 2010

Summary:

1. Cut the Dail in half
2. Look at abolishing the Army in its current form and the Seanad
3. Stop borrowing money to give away in overseas aid

Seems like common sense to me. But then, he's only a billionaire who kept a manufacturing business thriving in Ireland from the 70's, 80's and into today. What would he know?

A "National Unity" Government would be the way to respond to this crisis, but we've a snowball's chance in sydney at that.
 


Squib

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IT reports on Dr. Naughton's prescription for the restoration of our country.

Top industrialist wants Dáil halved and overseas aid ended - The Irish Times - Fri, Dec 03, 2010

Summary:

1. Cut the Dail in half
2. Look at abolishing the Army in its current form and the Seanad
3. Stop borrowing money to give away in overseas aid

Seems like common sense to me. But then, he's only a billionaire who kept a manufacturing business thriving in Ireland from the 70's, 80's and into today. What would he know?

A "National Unity" Government would be the way to respond to this crisis, but we've a snowball's chance in sydney at that.
Did he pay the top rate of tax on all of his income? I fuking doubt it!
 

Kevin Parlon

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Did he pay the top rate of tax on all of his income? I fuking doubt it!
1. What basis do you have for that assertion
2. What's that got to do with it?

Typical Irish begrudgery.
 

jackryan

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Ok lets get things into perspective!! however bad we are those who are receiving our overseas aid are alot alot worse off!! I love the way how everyone who call for cuts never seem to call for cuts which effect themselves or their own special interest groups!!
 
M

MrFunkyBoogaloo

Ok lets get things into perspective!! however bad we are those who are receiving our overseas aid are alot alot worse off!! I love the way how everyone who call for cuts never seem to call for cuts which effect themselves or their own special interest groups!!
And that of course is the gaping flaw in Mr Naughton's proposals. Socialism for the rich. Capitalism for the rest.

But sssh! Don't tell Kevin. He'll call you a begruder. :rolleyes:
 

Nonsence & lies

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Yep another in favour of minimum wage cuts, which accounts for 50000 workers, but as has been made quite obvious now with all talk of base rates etc. The real aim is the jlc and rea rates which i'm sure likely includes several hundred thousand staff, some being paid time and a third by all accounts on a sunday (criminal a whole €12), or worse still maybe €13 euro for working a night shift.

If this is the real aim of goverment and eu/imf. Would it be wide of the mark to say that if you cut another euro an hour from these groups on top of all other taxes, your adding another couple of hundred thousand people to the 'Insolvent category' which in turn leads to more job losses in shops, broadband, reataurants, cinemas, pubs etc etc simply because yours adding many thousands to the list with less coming in than going out.

But this appears to be plausible to policy makers. Chaos and the first IRA like organisations tasked with killing the rich and industrial leaders is coming very soon. PM and let me know were to donate!

At least that'll provide jobs for all the ex soldiers once we get rid of the army. The Irish equivalent of 'blackwater' to protect the affluent.
 

martino

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And another thing, the way things are going we might need an army yet.
 

Kevin Parlon

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Funky,

People like Naughton preoccupy themselves with the generation of wealth. People like yourself preoccupy themselves with how to distribute the wealth of others. The two sides will never agree, so maybe to keep things from becoming a shouting match, we might discuss the merits (or lack thereof) of his proposals?

Jack: It's hard to defend an aid program in times of crisis (who borrows to give to charity?) especially when the aid program is often criticised by aid agencies and when the likes of Uganda who receive our aid operate modern airforces.
 

Didimus

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Trust him, he's a doctor.
It would be nice to see some costings of these proposed changes, and some worked out plan how for example we move to a slim downed Dail . And how much a militia would cost us. And why we shouldn't in this country have a little nervousness about such an idea.
We need changes to the political system no doubt, we also need tighter controls on unnecessary spending.
Top of the head solutions like this however are just throwing shapes.
And by making out that our problems are caused simply by flabby cost control measures that a tough nut business man like Dr (trust him , he's a doctor) Naughton would sort out by being , eh, a tough nut is to divert attention away from the real problems.
 

jackryan

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Funky,

People like Naughton preoccupy themselves with the generation of wealth. People like yourself preoccupy themselves with how to distribute the wealth of others. The two sides will never agree, so maybe to keep things from becoming a shouting match, we might discuss the merits (or lack thereof) of his proposals?

Jack: It's hard to defend an aid program in times of crisis (who borrows to give to charity?) especially when the aid program is often criticised by aid agencies and when the likes of Uganda who receive our aid operate modern airforces.
I accept Our overseas aid needs to be strictly monitored! but sure if you were to use that critera I presume u wood agree that we should never have received 1 cent from Europe over the years?? we did receive billions did we not?
 

MASURIAN1

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Sense at last

Whatever about Naughton's views on the army or the minimum wage, he's sure right about overseas aid. This is one of the first times this has been raised in the mainstream media and by a member of the "establishment". It's a national disgrace that at the behest of a small self-interested lobby group of aid-nicks we will have to borrow well over half a billion in 2011 to just give away, so we can be like the big boys and strut around the international philanthropy stage. We're after all the country that gives the "highest per capita aid in the world", and aren't we great, except no one asked the taxpayer if they wanted this distinction. Our German friends only give half the percentage that we do of our GDP, fancy that!
 

Didimus

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I accept Our overseas aid needs to be strictly monitored! but sure if you were to use that critera I presume u wood agree that we should never have received 1 cent from Europe over the years?? we did receive billions did we not?
And the Irish Aid programme is actually rated highly for its effectiveness.
Ireland (2009) DAC Peer Review - Main Findings and Recommendations

But linking the aid programme to the austerity programme is a red herring. Those who do not believe in the merits of such a programme believe so no matter how much money we have.
 

jackryan

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Whatever about Naughton's views on the army or the minimum wage, he's sure right about overseas aid. This is one of the first times this has been raised in the mainstream media and by a member of the "establishment". It's a national disgrace that at the behest of a small self-interested lobby group of aid-nicks we will have to borrow well over half a billion in 2011 to just give away, so we can be like the big boys and strut around the international philanthropy stage. We're after all the country that gives the "highest per capita aid in the world", and aren't we great, except no one asked the taxpayer if they wanted this distinction. Our German friends only give half the percentage that we do of our GDP, fancy that!
Congrats to the germans for their generosity of spirit! they were always known for that and continue to be!!!!
 

Didimus

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Whatever about Naughton's views on the army or the minimum wage, he's sure right about overseas aid. This is one of the first times this has been raised in the mainstream media and by a member of the "establishment". It's a national disgrace that at the behest of a small self-interested lobby group of aid-nicks we will have to borrow well over half a billion in 2011 to just give away, so we can be like the big boys and strut around the international philanthropy stage. We're after all the country that gives the "highest per capita aid in the world", and aren't we great, except no one asked the taxpayer if they wanted this distinction. Our German friends only give half the percentage that we do of our GDP, fancy that!
What are you actually suggesting? Should we abolish aid altogether?
 

Kevin Parlon

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I accept Our overseas aid needs to be strictly monitored! but sure if you were to use that critera I presume u wood agree that we should never have received 1 cent from Europe over the years?? we did receive billions did we not?
The comparison is invalid for reasons too many and too obvious to mention. Aid should be pared back. That and political reform through halving the size of the dail are probably the points I would agree most strongly with. I think the "standing down the army" stuff, is more shoot from the hip shape throwing as somone else pointed out.
 

Kevin Parlon

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But linking the aid programme to the austerity programme is a red herring. Those who do not believe in the merits of such a programme believe so no matter how much money we have.
It's not black and white. There's degree. And I think it uncontroversial for it to be examined in the prevailing circumstances. Bull headedly dismissing it as a red herring is as stubborn, unthinking and as ideologically based position as "no aid, ever".
 

Kevin Parlon

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What are you actually suggesting? Should we abolish aid altogether?
How about getting it to the level of a country who doesn't currently have the IMF in for starters? Why not make a case for it's maintenance at current levels? If there's a good reason to keep it at the levels it is, please share.
 

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I accept Our overseas aid needs to be strictly monitored! but sure if you were to use that critera I presume u wood agree that we should never have received 1 cent from Europe over the years?? we did receive billions did we not?
We're going to pay it all back now to their bondholders and then some. AID for the Eurozone !
 

Didimus

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It's not black and white. There's degree. And I think it uncontroversial for it to be examined in the prevailing circumstances. Bull headedly dismissing it as a red herring is as stubborn, unthinking and as ideologically based position as "no aid, ever".
It has been examined. It has been cut back. There is already an inbuilt cut back mechanism as it is pegged as a % of our gdp.
The progamme is reviewed by the Organisation for Economic Development and generally gets positively reviewed.
 

MASURIAN1

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Perhaps we should ask the people how they'd like their money to be spent. I'm a democrat and would accept their verdict, what I can't accept is the aidistas spending their money for them without even asking. Let's ask...but if we don't then let's be a bit cautious and keep our percentage spend below that of our German friends.
 


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