McWilliams Explains How FF Are Playing Politics With Peoples Savings

cozzy121

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I suppose it's to be expected, from a party who's leader bertie had such trouble with his own savings...

ECB bailout is the only card we have left to play | David McWilliams

Only massive financial aid from the ECB will rule out once and for all the prospect of a bank run in Ireland. Only a huge transfer of cash from the central bank — the economic equivalent of a blood transfusion — can stabilise the patient.
It is deeply frustrating to see a government playing politics with something so fundamental as people’s savings.
Bad enough to have been sold a pup in the boom about house prices and guff about how wealthy we all were, bad enough having tax rises to pay for Anglo, but to see trust eroded so significantly because of incompetence is dangerous.
So let’s look at the big picture. The ECB wants to offer us financial assistance to keep our banks open. Our banks need a huge injection of money. There are only two places this can come from because no one in their right mind will lend to them. The cash can only come from the Irish Government and the ECB. The Irish Government buy the new IOUs from the crippled banks and the national debt rises even more. This is more “cash for trash”. We might as well light a match under the money.
 


Tea Party Patriot

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I suppose it's to be expected, from a party who's leader bertie had such trouble with his own savings...

ECB bailout is the only card we have left to play | David McWilliams
The one thing I would have to say on this is why do people feel that the taxpayer should bail out their savings. They should not have their entire savings in Irish Banks they should be spread over a number of investments reducing the risk.

It is because of the knowledge that the state will bail out depositors at any cost that we have bad banks in the first instance.

To quote Peter Schiff: "people just walk into banks and deposit large sums of money without a thought as to how sound they are. Would you buy a car, a house or shares with the same lack of consideration. No"

The bad banks would not exist today if Irish depositors had not been trained to be so lazy by government putting guarantees in place that reward poor judgement.
 

nonpartyboy

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That is exactly what they are doing, the lowest form of scum. what exactly would they do if the ecb, said good luck ?nothing that's what, skip the country no doubt.
 

cozzy121

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The one thing I would have to say on this is why do people feel that the taxpayer should bail out their savings. They should not have their entire savings in Irish Banks they should be spread over a number of investments reducing the risk.

It is because of the knowledge that the state will bail out depositors at any cost that we have bad banks in the first instance.

To quote Peter Schiff: "people just walk into banks and deposit large sums of money without a thought as to how sound they are. Would you buy a car, a house or shares with the same lack of consideration. No"

The bad banks would not exist today if Irish depositors had not been trained to be so lazy by government putting guarentees in place that reward poor judgement.
Perhaps, but us stupid Irish, have always trusted our banks, in the same way were stupidly trust Fianna failure.
Unlike the U.S. we do not have a history of bank failures, that’s not a criticism, the U.S. has ways of dealing with such matters, we do not.
The US public, because of history teaching them not to trust banks, are far more savvy than us micks.
 

nonpartyboy

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The one thing I would have to say on this is why do people feel that the taxpayer should bail out their savings. They should not have their entire savings in Irish Banks they should be spread over a number of investments reducing the risk.

It is because of the knowledge that the state will bail out depositors at any cost that we have bad banks in the first instance.

To quote Peter Schiff: "people just walk into banks and deposit large sums of money without a thought as to how sound they are. Would you buy a car, a house or shares with the same lack of consideration. No"

The bad banks would not exist today if Irish depositors had not been trained to be so lazy by government putting guarentees in place that reward poor judgement.
You keep this up,it's total rubbish. If people don't have confidence in the bank's to deposit money, then you don't have a banking system, it's that simple. Due dilligence is the regulators and central banks job, not the granny with her few bob in savings.
 

Astral Peaks

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The one thing I would have to say on this is why do people feel that the taxpayer should bail out their savings. They should not have their entire savings in Irish Banks they should be spread over a number of investments reducing the risk.

It is because of the knowledge that the state will bail out depositors at any cost that we have bad banks in the first instance.

To quote Peter Schiff: "people just walk into banks and deposit large sums of money without a thought as to how sound they are. Would you buy a car, a house or shares with the same lack of consideration. No"

The bad banks would not exist today if Irish depositors had not been trained to be so lazy by government putting guarantees in place that reward poor judgement.
This is sheer rubbish!!
So the bank's difficulties are as a result of people lodging money in those same banks.

"Sorry Sir, your car is banjaxed, didnt you know you should never put fuel into it?"
 

Tea Party Patriot

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You keep this up,it's total rubbish. If people don't have confidence in the bank's to deposit money, then you don't have a banking system, it's that simple. Due dilligence is the regulators and central banks job, not the granny with her few bob in savings.
Any investor making an investment should have to bare the risk of that investment not the taxpayer. It should be the responsibility of the individual to safeguard their savings not the state.
 

Legacy

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I may be stupid here but I was always under the impression that when one put their money into a bank it was for savings and that it was safe. I never looked at it as any type of risk investment. If I wanted to do that I would have bought Eircom shares....

The ordinary Joe Soap who may have a relatively modest sum saved in these banks are the ones who are worried. Those who have the ways and means and knowledge to move investments around are a different kettle of fish. I wouldnt even know where to start to 'spread risks' outside of this state.
 

cozzy121

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I may be stupid here but I was always under the impression that when one put their money into a bank it was for savings and that it was safe. I never looked at it as any type of risk investment.....
Yes, but if you vote fianna fail and allow a leader, the likes of bertie ahern, to run a country for over 12years, you must accept the fact that nothing is safe.
You sow the seed etc…
 

cferrie

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I may be stupid here but I was always under the impression that when one put their money into a bank it was for savings and that it was safe. I never looked at it as any type of risk investment. If I wanted to do that I would have bought Eircom shares....

The ordinary Joe Soap who may have a relatively modest sum saved in these banks are the ones who are worried. Those who have the ways and means and knowledge to move investments around are a different kettle of fish. I wouldnt even know where to start to 'spread risks' outside of this state.
Exactly, there's a distinct difference between savings and investments. As the financial regulator insists on telling us, "investments may rise and fall". Private savers have to have a reasonable expectation that their savings are secure. If they don't, the system fails.
 

Tea Party Patriot

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Exactly, there's a distinct difference between savings and investments. As the financial regulator insists on telling us, "investments may rise and fall". Private savers have to have a reasonable expectation that their savings are secure. If they don't, the system fails.
In case you havn't noticed the system has failed and for the very reason that the government is now protecting depositors money. If depositors had been more careful and aware of investing this wouldn't be necessary.

In case people are taking me up wrong it isn't the fault of ordinary people, it is the fault of our nanny state culture and also a failure in our education system which spends millions on compulsary Irish as opposed to educating people on the fundamentals of finance.
 

thetruthspeaks

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The one thing I would have to say on this is why do people feel that the taxpayer should bail out their savings. They should not have their entire savings in Irish Banks they should be spread over a number of investments reducing the risk.

It is because of the knowledge that the state will bail out depositors at any cost that we have bad banks in the first instance.

To quote Peter Schiff: "people just walk into banks and deposit large sums of money without a thought as to how sound they are. Would you buy a car, a house or shares with the same lack of consideration. No"

The bad banks would not exist today if Irish depositors had not been trained to be so lazy by government putting guarantees in place that reward poor judgement.
Did you go to Peter's talk last Friday night at Kilkenny?
because he made the same analogy with regard to banks and microwave ovens.
Problem is it assumes that people have access to perfect information about the banks and I don't need to tell you about their tendancy to lie about things.
Finding out about a microwave or other consumer product is a different matter altogether as you can easily check the spec to see if you are being sold a lemon or not.
I made this point to Philippe Legrain (who shared the platform with Peter) and he was in total agreement with me.
Don't get me wrong I'm agreement with a lot of what Peter has to say about things but as regards his views on deposit insurance I believe that he is misinformed about this.
 
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Akrasia

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Where did these people get their savings from?
 

Tea Party Patriot

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Did you go to Peter's talk last Friday night at Kilkenny?
because he made the same analogy with regard to banks and microwave ovens.
Problem is it assumes that people have access to perfect information about the banks and I don't need to tell you about their tendancy to lie about things.
Finding out about a microwave or other consumer product is a different matter altogether as you can easily check the spec to see if you are being sold a lemon or not.
I made this point to Philippe Legrain (who shared the platform with Peter) and he was in total agreement with me.
Don't get me wrong I'm agreement with a lot of what Peter has to say about things but as regards his views on deposit insurance I believe that he is misinformed about this.
1. If a bank is found to be misleading the market and presenting false figures then the directors should be prosecuted.

2. We need to ingrain a culture in Ireland of spreading risk. Even leaving bank depositors aside how many people have lost their life savings by putting all the eggs in one basket by buying a second property, by only investing in bank shares, by sticking ridgely to one business area and never diversifying?

Unfortunatly Ireland is a young nation outside of a small section of society when it comes to having surplus wealth to invest and we are now reaping the fruits of having a poorly educated populus when it comes to protecting themselves against risk. I am not blaming the people here I am blaming the failure of our schools and our state to properly ensure their understanding of this.

And the real truth of the matter when it comes to letting bad banks go is that deposits would go with them. If AIB and BOI went in the morning you would still have Ulster Bank and a miriad of others willing to step up and fill the void. Ulster already has a full retail network in place throughout Ireland so there wouldn't be a problem there as we are led to believe.

The reality of it is that depositors will again be bailed out, however going forward risk should to be transfered to them in the long term and they will have to be educated on this.
 


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