• It has come to our attention that some users may have been "banned" when they tried to change their passwords after the site was hacked due to a glitch in the old vBulletin software. This would have occurred around the end of February and does not apply after the site was converted to Xenforo. If you believe you were affected by this, please contact a staff member or use the Contact us link at the bottom of any forum page.

Michael Noonan Admits The Promissory Notes Arrangement Was Totally Illegal - Today with Pat Kenny 8/2


YouKnowWhatIMeanLike

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
7,211
Michael Noonan Admits The Promissory Notes Arrangement Was Totally Illegal - Today with Pat Kenny 8/2

in case you missed this last week on February 8. Pat Kenny led a very insightful interview with Finance Minister Michael Noonan (09:55) on RTE about the details of the Anglo Irish Bank / IBRC promissory notes deal. Noonan admits that the initial Anglo Irish Bank promissory notes deal by the then Fianna Fáil government was totally illegal.

lots of detail here about the new promissory notes arrangement as well. Mario Draghi ECB and Jörg Asmussen an executive board member of the ECB and former deputy finance minister of Germany helped to push the deal through for Ireland. Noonan clearly confirms the fiscal nature of the deal and how it will improve the fiscal situation in Ireland. Now that explains the allergic reaction by the Bundesbank.
 
Last edited:

venusian

Well-known member
Joined
May 26, 2011
Messages
6,936
in case you missed this last week on February 8. Pat Kenny led a very insightful interview with Finance Minister Michael Noonan on RTE about the details of the Anglo Irish Bank / IBRC promissory notes deal. Noonan admits that the initial Anglo Irish Bank promissory notes deal by the then Fianna Fáil government was totally illegal.

lots of detail here about the new promissory notes arrangement as well. Mario Draghi ECB and Jörg Asmussen an executive board member of the ECB and former deputy finance minister of Germany helped to push the deal through for Ireland. Noonan clearly confirms the fiscal nature of the deal and how it will improve the fiscal situation in Ireland. Now that explains the allergic reaction by the Bundesbank.
Excellent! It means that if a case is taken against the legality of the Promissory notes it strengthens it hoping to get the whole non-democratic deal thrown out....Er! hasn't isn't someone trying that at the moment???
 

hiding behind a poster

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Messages
48,240

DownTheyGo

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
5,314
It remains a rare treat when Mom cooks dinner from time to time still so I took great pleasure talking politics tonight together after watching the 6pm news. Mom asked me to explain the whole banking debt business. The easiest way was to simply emphasise how the country can vote through referendum on Judge salaries and pay but when it comes to multi billion Euro bank debts, were you given a say?! Democracy in action is a curious beast. Noonan can spout off all he likes about the original PN deal but passing the buck to future generations is no more legal than any contention he makes with regard to the original deal.
 

hiding behind a poster

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Messages
48,240
It remains a rare treat when Mom cooks dinner from time to time still so I took great pleasure talking politics tonight together after watching the 6pm news. Mom asked me to explain the whole banking debt business. The easiest way was to simply emphasise how the country can vote through referendum on Judge salaries and pay but when it comes to multi billion Euro bank debts, were you given a say?! Democracy in action is a curious beast. Noonan can spout off all he likes about the original PN deal but passing the buck to future generations is no more legal than any contention he makes with regard to the original deal.
Maybe next time you can try explaining the Constitution to your mother. Mind you, it'd help to know it yourself first.
 

YouKnowWhatIMeanLike

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
7,211
Excellent! It means that if a case is taken against the legality of the Promissory notes it strengthens it hoping to get the whole non-democratic deal thrown out....Er! hasn't isn't someone trying that at the moment???
it's a through ball for Donnelly, Ross and Hall. one can only wonder why Michael admits that on national radio. also the details about german government officials directly influencing the ECB is less then charming. is Michael trying to setup the ECB with a trap for a bigger deal?
 
Last edited:

Man or Mouse

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
7,110
it's a through ball for Donnelly, Ross and David Hall. one can only wonder why Michael admit that. also the details about german government officials directly influencing the ECB is less then charming. is Michael trying to setup the ECB with a bigger trap for a bigger deal?
If we hadn't been conditioned to mediocrity we could hope. But then again we know what we know..............
 

Half Nelson

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
21,717

YouKnowWhatIMeanLike

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
7,211
If we hadn't been conditioned to mediocrity we could hope. But then again we know what we know..............
it's a pretty "smart" move by Michael, Weidmann had to come forward and reveal his position on the deal. so much for unanimously taking note. as Michael says during the interview the new deal is illegal as well. what's Michael up to?
 
Last edited:

hiding behind a poster

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Messages
48,240
A typical moronic HBAP response. Stop, stop now, before carrying on to make a bigger fool than you already are.
No, your previous post makes it patently obvious that you've little if any understanding of Bunreacht na hEireann.
 

DownTheyGo

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
5,314
No, your previous post makes it patently obvious that you've little if any understanding of Bunreacht na hEireann.
I have a problem with any government bundling mountains of debt onto future generations. All FG did was pass the buck. No writedown, no real relief of any kind on the PN deal. It's a scapegoat deal and people are seeing it for what it is.... a big white elephant.
 

hiding behind a poster

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Messages
48,240
Citizen has no legal standing to take promissory note case, court rules | Irish Examiner
Maybe you can explain the reasoning behind that because, apparently, nobody else can.
Lots of people can, and lots of people have. Basically you can't take a case on behalf of someone else, and the case Hall made wasn't about the legality of the creation of the Promissory Notes themselves, but a claim that TDs had a constitutional right to vote on such a procedure. But not being a TD, he had no right to take the case, as his own rights hadn't been compromised - just like if I feel that you've been libelled, for example, I can't sue.
 

hiding behind a poster

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Messages
48,240
I have a problem with any government bundling mountains of debt onto future generations. All FG did was pass the buck. No writedown, no real relief of any kind on the PN deal. It's a scapegoat deal and people are seeing it for what it is.... a big white elephant.
There was never gonna be a writedown, as the ECB cannot write down debt. As for the rest, we've gained substantial relief - by reducing the interest payments and pushing the capital way way back, to a time when it'll be far less significant. But since we're on the subject of bundling debt onto future generations, how to you feel about the €100 billion bill we're passing on to future generations because only spending what we take in feels too much like hard work?
 

oggy

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 28, 2009
Messages
8,958
Why in the name of whatever people get worked up about the PN is way beyond me. It was a convenient way of putting together even if it was technically illegal. Governments will do what governments have to do and the ECB who dont like it can go jump in the nearest river. Our government got peed off with the PN and told anyone unhappy with their plans to jump in the same river The number of pages in the Bill passed by Dail last week alone tells us the PN was for the high jump no matter what the detractors. It was expedient to raise the PN and it was expedient and timely to get rid. Foe eff sake lets move on to something more important like making sure the deficit is wiped out out over the couple of years so we can sytart taking growth and jobs seriously
 

YouKnowWhatIMeanLike

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
7,211
Why in the name of whatever people get worked up about the PN is way beyond me. It was a convenient way of putting together even if it was technically illegal. Governments will do what governments have to do and the ECB who dont like it can go jump in the nearest river. Our government got peed off with the PN and told anyone unhappy with their plans to jump in the same river The number of pages in the Bill passed by Dail last week alone tells us the PN was for the high jump no matter what the detractors. It was expedient to raise the PN and it was expedient and timely to get rid. Foe eff sake lets move on to something more important like making sure the deficit is wiped out out over the couple of years so we can sytart taking growth and jobs seriously
that was the plan to move on but by going public and raising all sorts of issues Michael was literally asking for trouble. this is not a coincidence. Weidmann could now be forced to support a case against the ECB action. a very strange move by Michael. Derek Scally echoed that sentiment as well on the Finucane show earlier today. Michael may have just lost it.
 

Dearghoul

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 8, 2013
Messages
8,623
Lots of people can, and lots of people have. Basically you can't take a case on behalf of someone else, and the case Hall made wasn't about the legality of the creation of the Promissory Notes themselves, but a claim that TDs had a constitutional right to vote on such a procedure. But not being a TD, he had no right to take the case, as his own rights hadn't been compromised - just like if I feel that you've been libelled, for example, I can't sue.
The balance of the judgement was not about Locus Standi but that things had already gone too far for a worthwhile investigation of the merits of the claim i.e. it was all a bit late, thats a lay person with nightclasses' take on it.
 

YouKnowWhatIMeanLike

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 13, 2011
Messages
7,211
The balance of the judgement was not about Locus Standi but that things had already gone too far for a worthwhile investigation of the merits of the claim i.e. it was all a bit late, thats a lay person with nightclasses' take on it.
the case was in "good" hands, if you listen to Michael and the schedule outlined for the deal, the hearing of the case had been conveniently placed on the calendar to prevent any action. imo
 

blindjustice

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2007
Messages
763
Top