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New Centre for Public Inquiry - Yes or No?


Gael Nua

Active member
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
127
Came across this quote again from 2005 from Mary Harney:

“I think the idea of some group of citizens setting themselves up with absolutely no justification, to enquire into others, is something that I always thought was quite sinister and inappropriate.”

As there is now extreme justification for the establishment of a new CPI, surely Ms Harney would welcome its revivial.

Amongst its early work, the new CPI could start digging into the whole banking mess, politicians expenses, public sector waste etc. Do you agree the establishment of a new CPI is both neccessary and vitally important?
 


G

Gimpanzee

Came across this quote again from 2005 from Mary Harney:

“I think the idea of some group of citizens setting themselves up with absolutely no justification, to enquire into others, is something that I always thought was quite sinister and inappropriate.”

As there is now extreme justification for the establishment of a new CPI, surely Ms Harney would welcome its revivial.

Amongst its early work, the new CPI could start digging into the whole banking mess, politicians expenses, public sector waste etc. Do you agree the establishment of a new CPI is both neccessary and vitally important?
Not one bankrolled by a US billionaire, no matter how benevolent he might be.
 

He3

Moderator
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
17,094
Badly needed.

The Dáil and Seanad could have been a Centre for Public Inquiry. That concept has been nobbled by the tyranny of the majority in LH.
 

LowIQ

Active member
Joined
Feb 9, 2005
Messages
287
Came across this quote again from 2005 from Mary Harney:

“I think the idea of some group of citizens setting themselves up with absolutely no justification, to enquire into others, is something that I always thought was quite sinister and inappropriate.”

As there is now extreme justification for the establishment of a new CPI, surely Ms Harney would welcome its revivial.

Amongst its early work, the new CPI could start digging into the whole banking mess, politicians expenses, public sector waste etc. Do you agree the establishment of a new CPI is both neccessary and vitally important?
The fact that the CPI was shut down by that effin' lunatic McDowell speaks volumes. All functioning democracies subject their governments and agencies to independent scrutiny. We are a bunch of clowns in this country to have allowed this to happen.
 

soubresauts

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 2, 2007
Messages
3,090
The Dáil and Seanad could have been a Centre for Public Inquiry. That concept has been nobbled by the tyranny of the majority in LH.
Not only by FF-Greens, also by the sheer uselessness of FG and Labour, who are afraid to precipitate a general election since they know they would get a poisoned chalice.
 

Gael Nua

Active member
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
127
I'm surprised there is so little discussion on this. I would have thought that it is an excellent vehicle for weeding out the many, many, many inept, illegally complicit and morally substandard individuals placed in positions of trust in this country and yet barely a whimper of support or even a blackballing from the blind acolytes of the tripartite organisation within the Dáil.
 

pujols

Active member
Joined
Jun 7, 2010
Messages
275
And the legal basis for all this would be?
 

turdsl

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 2, 2008
Messages
26,085
Thankfully the electorate of his own constituency decided McDowell was not doing a good job for his constituents, end of Michael in politics.
 

corelli

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
4,478
Not one bankrolled by a US billionaire, no matter how benevolent he might be.
I have absolutely no issue with Feeney. The issue was the calibre of the person who was the head of the orginisation in Ireland. Now, you can make what you want of McDowell's releasing of confidential Garda information, but it did make some interesting listening.
 

goatstoe

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 30, 2009
Messages
2,071
The first thing a new CPI should do is investigate how McDowell got away with completely abusing his position by bringing down the first CPI. I guess the electorate have since then delivered justice on McDowell's political career anyway.
 

stanley

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
9,541
Not one bankrolled by a US billionaire, no matter how benevolent he might be.


If Chuck Feeney wants to finance a new CPI more power to his elbow, last time around they did some great work and Frank Connolly was not afraid to take on the Establishment.

Ahern did not like the CPI and set about to destroy it through McDowell, think Ahern met with Feeney direct to scuttle Connolly.

UL would be a penniless school but for the money Feeney has dropped on their laps and WOD hanging about all the time for the photo op as the donations roll in.
 
G

Gimpanzee

If Chuck Feeney wants to finance a new CPI more power to his elbow, last time around they did some great work and Frank Connolly was not afraid to take on the Establishment.

Ahern did not like the CPI and set about to destroy it through McDowell, think Ahern met with Feeney direct to scuttle Connolly.

UL would be a penniless school but for the money Feeney has dropped on their laps and WOD hanging about all the time for the photo op as the donations roll in.
I have no issue with Feeney. I think he has been a fantastic influence on this country.
I despise Bertie Ahern and think he was corrosive influence on this country.

Nonetheless, the idea that this state should rely on a watchdog organisation bankrolled by a single individual, never mind one who doesn't live here is a recipe for abuse.

As someone said above - what we need is to elect decent people to the Dáil and let it do the job it is supposed to do for the citizens of the state.
 
G

Gimpanzee

I have absolutely no issue with Feeney. The issue was the calibre of the person who was the head of the orginisation in Ireland. Now, you can make what you want of McDowell's releasing of confidential Garda information, but it did make some interesting listening.
In fairness to Feeney, as soon as he was satisfied Connolly could not refute the allegations in public he folded up the CPI tent. Feeney was the only one to emerge with credibility and integrity from the episode.
 

stanley

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Joined
Jun 20, 2007
Messages
9,541
I have no issue with Feeney. I think he has been a fantastic influence on this country.
I despise Bertie Ahern and think he was corrosive influence on this country.

Nonetheless, the idea that this state should rely on a watchdog organisation bankrolled by a single individual, never mind one who doesn't live here is a recipe for abuse.

As someone said above - what we need is to elect decent people to the Dáil and let it do the job it is supposed to do for the citizens of the state.

Nail, hammer and head, it does not matter who you elect to the Dail, the FF'er gombeen men will be there already as they keep getting re-elected and it is a way of life to them and their voters.

Fact it you are being abused daily by the FF'ers but it has so become the norm, most of it you cant see or feel anymore.

"Recipe for abuse", FF'ers would not have it, they and only they have the divine right to abuse the Irish people for their gain, they must have told some porkies to get Feeney to stop the money supply last time.
 

Finbar10

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Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
2,424
Can't see why Irish citizens shouldn't be able to inquire into the organizations of their own state and behaviour of its politicians. Justice Feargus Flood and the chairperson of UCC amongst others were on the board for God's sake, certainly didn't sound like some sinister cabal. There might be an issue regarding outside finance. But this wasn't some shadowy billionaire with an unknown agenda. This was Chuck Feeney, Irish American philanthropist, who already has given oodles of his own money to Ireland. Doesn't mean he can't do wrong. But still, the whole incident of CPI's closure was just plain grubby. And the fact that he withdrew funding after Bertie had a quiet word in his ear to put him straight even indicates more strongly that he had no ill intent. Speaks volumes for Irish politics. Our politicians didn't like the idea of such a centre, didn't like it one bit at all. Michael McDowell hiding behind Dáil privilege seemed shabby and deeply cynical to me at the time. If they had any real evidence why not attempt to actually prosecute Frank Connolly? Seems like either the evidence they had didn't amount to a hill of beans or alternatively maybe they were afraid of the international embarrassment taking such an case might have caused?

Irish citizens should be perfectly entitled to set up such a centre and ask hard questions about the state. After all our investigative journalists are supposed to do the same job. Of course such a centre would have to be very careful about what it says. Just like newspapers it would be subject to the laws of libel etc.. Highly likely that it would be subjected to numerous court cases, whether justified or merely spurious/intimidatory. Would really need some wealthy individual with deep deep pockets and a strong resolve to keep it going in the face of such pressure. I doubt there's any wealthy individual with the required wealth who would be prepared to go up against the wrath of the Irish establishment in this way. Much as we might need such a centre I don't think we're ever going to get one. I think Chuck Feeney was well intentioned but also very naive when agreeing to fund such a centre here.
 

Cael

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Joined
Jun 19, 2006
Messages
13,343
Came across this quote again from 2005 from Mary Harney:

“I think the idea of some group of citizens setting themselves up with absolutely no justification, to enquire into others, is something that I always thought was quite sinister and inappropriate.”

As there is now extreme justification for the establishment of a new CPI, surely Ms Harney would welcome its revivial.

Amongst its early work, the new CPI could start digging into the whole banking mess, politicians expenses, public sector waste etc. Do you agree the establishment of a new CPI is both neccessary and vitally important?
Depends on how its funded. If the funding can be "got to" by state power, then its of no real use.
 

Cael

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 19, 2006
Messages
13,343
In fairness to Feeney, as soon as he was satisfied Connolly could not refute the allegations in public he folded up the CPI tent. Feeney was the only one to emerge with credibility and integrity from the episode.
The thing is that if you dont have journos like Connolly, i.e. if you just hire the types that never do anything that would upset the establishment, then there is no point in having a CPI.
 

Finbar10

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
2,424
And the legal basis for all this would be?
Free speech? I can't see why such an outfit couldn't be on the same legal basis in terms of reporting as a newspaper. And we certainly don't have any problems with foreign billionaires whatever their backgrounds funding these. And just like a newspaper such a centre would have the same need to be careful of libel laws and plenty of funding to defend themselves in the courts.
 

Barnacle

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
854
I think a start would be to grant the PAC further powers as they are presently very restricted in what they can ask. Bernard Allen has been asking for this for years and has been totally shot down. If something is a "Ministerial decision" the PAC currently cannot question it. However, I don't think that the PAC should be made up of TD's as to investigate matters properly a great deal of time and commitment is required and with the amount of scandals we have in this country, this is a full time job. A separate body may be a solution but they would have to have strong powers legally to allow them to fully investigate matters, make determinations and apportion blame. The Abbey-Lara ruling is a problem.
 

Panopticon

Well-known member
Joined
May 27, 2009
Messages
5,576
Came across this quote again from 2005 from Mary Harney:

“I think the idea of some group of citizens setting themselves up with absolutely no justification, to enquire into others, is something that I always thought was quite sinister and inappropriate.”

As there is now extreme justification for the establishment of a new CPI, surely Ms Harney would welcome its revivial.

Amongst its early work, the new CPI could start digging into the whole banking mess, politicians expenses, public sector waste etc. Do you agree the establishment of a new CPI is both neccessary and vitally important?
Yeah. Let's not hire a journalist who used a fake passport to get into a drugs haven and warzone to run it.

The fact that the CPI was shut down by that effin' lunatic McDowell speaks volumes. All functioning democracies subject their governments and agencies to independent scrutiny. We are a bunch of clowns in this country to have allowed this to happen.
McDowell did not shut it down; it shut itself down after it lost all credibility, namely there was very good evidence that the guy who ran it was committing serious crimes.

If McDowell stopped a dubious person getting free rein to run a private yet official-sounding body with God knows what motives, then he "did the state some service", and more than the usual complainers around here have done in any case.
 

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