Opposition Responses to 4 Year Plan

Superlepreachaun

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After today, Brian Cowen, (Ireland's PM) remains the highest-paid country leader in Europe and he is cutting welfare and the minimum wage. Go figure!
The hilarious thing is these top execs in the public and private sector will tell you that if you pay peanuts you get monkeys and good wages are necessary as an incentive to get good workers...then they'll tell you the minimum wage needs to go down.
 


Squire Allworthy

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I would have thought that the position of the opposition parties would have been to oppose on the basis that there should be an election first and a strong government to propose and implement the plan for remoulding of the Irish economy in the coming 5 years.

They should also ask the Greens to support them in a collective vote of no confidence.

Basically why on earth are FF hanging about ? Their time is up. Party is over.
 

needle_too

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I'd been wondering where FG's one was. But nothing issued yet. Enda did speak to the traditional (old) media earlier. But nothing else.
Is silence not the most perfect expression of scorn?

Or has that subtlety been lost on P.ie'ers too?
 

He3

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Does anyone believe the annual 2.75% growth assumption is reasonable?

These lads don't for a start:

However, financial markets had doubts about the plan with yields on 10-year Irish Government bonds widening.

"It doesn't seem all that realistic to me," said Stephen Lewis, chief economist at Monument Securities. "It seems they're planning very stringent fiscal measures and yet they expect the economy to grow against that background. That seems highly unlikely."

James Nixon, chief European economist at Societe Generale, said: "It's a staggeringly austere budget, the cuts are deep and it will hurt. The main thing that stands out is that they still expect the economy to grow by 2.7pc over the next 4 years but it's hard to see how that can be true."


Ireland unveils austere €15bn budget to cut deficit - Telegraph
 

Baron von Biffo

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It will be interesting to see how FG differential themselves from this plan as they agree with the numbers. Labour are also not very far on the number, they just want to delay the pain which means more borrowing.
Kenny is on RTE news now saying he's got permission from the European Commission to change 'individual elements' of the plan but they appear to be broadly happy with it.
 

Watch The Break

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Fine Gael's James O'Reilly dodging the question of a bondholder haircut on The Last Word. In other words, we can expect more of the exact same from them. This is hopeless. There is no political alternative.
 

Squire Allworthy

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The hilarious thing is these top execs in the public and private sector will tell you that if you pay peanuts you get monkeys and good wages are necessary as an incentive to get good workers...then they'll tell you the minimum wage needs to go down.
+1

I am always loathe to suggest reducing the pay of the least well off, but there are problems with competitiveness in Ireland. There are ways of addressing that in relation to productivity and tax exposure.


That said the wages of certain legal types etc etc. seems to grow exponentially and the costs of government mistakes over shadow the collective cost of all those on minimum wage.

IMO the main burden on the economy is in fact the government.
 

patslatt

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Calls for job creating stimulus by Fine Gael and Labour. Pretended cuts.

Yeah plenty of points to attack and soundbytes to make unless they are contemplating support....
Stimulus calls by the opposition are an easy criticism because they don't have to commit to much and can repackage old projects as new,such as the restructuring of FAS.

That said,stimulus is hard to do effectively given bloated levels of government spending,the near completion of the most important infrastructure projects and long planning delays in getting projects shovel ready. Tax cuts are usually more effective and quicker but instead massive tax increases are being imposed,raising doubts about the plan to cut €3 in spending for every €1 in tax increases. Is this the old political trick of making pretended cuts in pretended planned future increases in spending that would never be affordable?

The best jobs stimulus plan is for the government to improve its fiscal management through cuts,not taxes, and improve on its dreadful inefficiency in many departments such as health care.
 

Watch The Break

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Everyone outside the government seems to be saying the four year plan will wreck the economy, an underlying economy that is fairly highly rated by the international financial community.

Absolutely bizarre that we have a plan that is completely unworkable, and none of our main political parties will come out and say it.
 

justme1

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Kenny is probably doing a crash course in economics for the 20th time !!
Yes FF SCUM TRAITORS (by the way it's not just SF voters who think this now) are giving it to him.
 
D

Duth Ealla

No it doesn't. Simply shows that Kenny doesn't trust one side of the negotiations (the government) to tell him the truth about the question, so he asked the other side.

I hope Kenny has the common sense to realise he should not necessarily trust the other side either.
IMF/EU are not our friends in this. They are out business partners
 

Watch The Break

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Fine Gael are making it perfectly obvious that they won't make any tough call. Everything about them so far is suggesting what I feared about them - they are going to pursue the exact same route as Fianna Fail.

Looks like the default is going to be out of necessity rather than choice, presumably after tens of billions more have been poured into the dead banks.
 

wee slabber

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Fine Gael are making it perfectly obvious that they won't make any tough call. Everything about them so far is suggesting what I feared about them - they are going to pursue the exact same route as Fianna Fail.

Looks like the default is going to be out of necessity rather than choice, presumably after tens of billions more have been poured into the dead banks.
Jesus, when will people realise they (Kenny et al) can do nothing unless you vote them in. Kenny et al are assuming they have it wrapped. They are already displaying a certain smugness. Use the power of your vote. You can vote for Labour, SF, independents, etc. Vote in a tactical way. Kenny (or anyone else) is nothing without the Peoples' vote.
 
D

Duth Ealla

No they're not - they are vampires that are going to suck every available penny from working class people in this country.
yeah thats the point I am making. thy are not here for us but for the Eurozone. Ireland collapse, or zombie recovery is not an issue for them.
 

Goban Saor

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Good man yourself , nothing like a little lofty intellectualism to inform this debate.
From the line quoted she doesnt add anything to any debate.

Did you read all of Labour's reaction?

Doubt it somehow.
No I didnt. General forum etiquette is that the OP has to select areas of interest for us to debate. The bit he highlighted wasnt useful.
 

Watch The Break

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Jesus, when will people realise they (Kenny et al) can do nothing unless you vote them in. Kenny et al are assuming they have it wrapped. They are already displaying a certain smugness. Use the power of your vote. You can vote for Labour, SF, independents, etc. Vote in a tactical way. Kenny (or anyone else) is nothing without the Peoples' vote.
You're completely right, but realistically that's the next taoiseach and they have no real alternatives. That's all I'm saying.

Interestingly, there is absolutely nothing being said about banking sector reform by anyone. Obviously it's a little hectic this week, but does anyone know of any plans advocated by any of the main opposition parties to do anything about regulating the sector? Obviously it'll have to be rebuilt first :D but they've had two years. Any inkling of an idea from any of them? I'm guessing no.
 

civilserpant

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Fine Gael's James O'Reilly dodging the question of a bondholder haircut on The Last Word. In other words, we can expect more of the exact same from them. This is hopeless. There is no political alternative.
Wasn't my reading of what he said at all, plus, no pary is going to admit that, months out from taking power. Its something you announce AS you're doing it. He didn't rule it out.
 

civilserpant

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Fine Gael are making it perfectly obvious that they won't make any tough call. Everything about them so far is suggesting what I feared about them - they are going to pursue the exact same route as Fianna Fail.

Looks like the default is going to be out of necessity rather than choice, presumably after tens of billions more have been poured into the dead banks.
sigh, if you listened to Cooper you'd have heard O'Reilly say FG would have their own proposals shortly along with the budget proposals.

What did you hear from Labour???
 


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