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Paradoxically, high nursing pay causing shortages of nurses

patslatt

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It is rumored that the government will be more generous on nurses' pay claims than other public sector pay claims in order to alleviate staff shortages in A&E. However, there is reason to believe that very high Irish nurses' pay by EU standards,an average of about €55,000 a year, undermined hospital budgets,resulting in reduced recruitment and nursing staff shortages in A&E. These staff shortages have resulted in highly stressful working conditions which make it difficult to retain staff and recruit new staff.

Logically, cuts in pay would solve understaffing but that's not politically possible.Pay cuts of about 20% could be used to increase recruitment of maybe 30% more nurses,young nurses in the low pay grades. One possibility is to confine any pay increases to the nurses in A&E but that would meet heavy resistance from unions that enforce equal pay for all regardless of specialties shortages.

THe future will see continuing chaos in A&Es until the public becomes so angry the government will be forced to stand up to the health service unions. In the next five years, the illnesses of an ageing population will overwhelm some A&Es and result in frequent denials of services to the seriously ill.
 
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Analyzer

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How come you never ask questions about the money wasted providing bailouts to banks who pay their former bosses fat pensions ?
 

ger12

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What about cuts to higher levels of pay? Or increasing taxation full stop on higher levels of pay?

An average nurses pay is €31,334 not €55,000 a year. Nurse Managers on wards/Nurse Specialists working Monday to Friday might get 55K at the top of the scale. Advanced Nurse Practitioner's get more, hardly surprising seeing as they share a workload with doctors.

Maybe you'd like to see no extra payments for working a week of night duty? Or weekends?

https://www.inmo.ie/salary_information

The current crisis in staffing levels btw is one created by a policy decision by James Reilly to enslave newly qualified nurses.
 

Civic_critic2

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Do all nurses make 55,000 a year? Never knew it was so high. Is that why they've been particularly inert in taking action over A&E conditions that are frankly appalling, despite some verbal hot air now and again? They are essentially collaborative at this stage while posturing that they are salt-of-the-earth working under 'very trying' conditions.
 

ger12

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Do all nurses make 55,000 a year? Never knew it was so high. Is that why they've been particularly inert in taking action over A&E conditions that are frankly appalling, despite some verbal hot air now and again? They are essentially collaborative at this stage while posturing that they are salt-of-the-earth working under 'very trying' conditions.
Do you believe everything you read on P.ie?
https://www.inmo.ie/salary_information
 

damus

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100 unfilled vacancies in OLOL....so do we increase or decrease the pay to attract nurses in to those posts?
 

ger12

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100 unfilled vacancies in OLOL....so do we increase or decrease the pay to attract nurses in to those posts?
In Drogheada?

Nah ... just close the hospital ... sorted ...
 

amist4

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What about cuts to higher levels of pay? Or increasing taxation full stop on higher levels of pay?

An average nurses pay is €31,334 not €55,000 a year. Nurse Managers on wards/Nurse Specialists working Monday to Friday might get 55K at the top of the scale. Advanced Nurse Practitioner's get more, hardly surprising seeing as they share a workload with doctors.

Maybe you'd like to see no extra payments for working a week of night duty? Or weekends?

https://www.inmo.ie/salary_information

The current crisis in staffing levels btw is one created by a policy decision by James Reilly to enslave newly qualified nurses.
Does that average pay you are quoting include all allowances, reasonable overtime and normal shift rates?
 

damus

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In Drogheada?

Nah ... just close the hospital ... sorted ...
And keeping with tradition up that neck of the woods, the day before the planned closure they'd call it off only to put it back on the table two days later.
 

damus

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What about cuts to higher levels of pay? Or increasing taxation full stop on higher levels of pay?

An average nurses pay is €31,334 not €55,000 a year. Nurse Managers on wards/Nurse Specialists working Monday to Friday might get 55K at the top of the scale. Advanced Nurse Practitioner's get more, hardly surprising seeing as they share a workload with doctors.

Maybe you'd like to see no extra payments for working a week of night duty? Or weekends?

https://www.inmo.ie/salary_information

The current crisis in staffing levels btw is one created by a policy decision by James Reilly to enslave newly qualified nurses.
And ironically the unions who negotiated and signed up to HR.
 

patslatt

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How come you never ask questions about the money wasted providing bailouts to banks who pay their former bosses fat pensions ?
I mention the bank bailut of ~ €40 billion occasionally, as I do the ~ €120 billion in today's money in unfunded future public sector pension entitlements. €120 bn would need to be invested but instead the pensions are paid out of taxes. Thanks for billions, taxpayers!
 

ger12

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Does that average pay you are quoting include all allowances, reasonable overtime and normal shift rates?
Nope.

Should all workers, or just nurses, be excluded from receiving allowances, reasonable overtime and normal shift rates?
 

ger12

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And ironically the unions who negotiated and signed up to HR.
Ah yes, the famous HR that were are to credit the great new leader of the Labour Party with ... Fantastic country aren't we ...
 

ger12

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And keeping with tradition up that neck of the woods, the day before the planned closure they'd call it off only to put it back on the table two days later.
Aye, with a back room brawl between the Minister, the DoH top man and the HSE official.
 

wombat

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Why focus on nurses? the real need is for top class consultants who don't come cheap but who are not as media friendly.
 

patslatt

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What about cuts to higher levels of pay? Or increasing taxation full stop on higher levels of pay?

An average nurses pay is €31,334 not €55,000 a year. Nurse Managers on wards/Nurse Specialists working Monday to Friday might get 55K at the top of the scale. Advanced Nurse Practitioner's get more, hardly surprising seeing as they share a workload with doctors.

Maybe you'd like to see no extra payments for working a week of night duty? Or weekends?

https://www.inmo.ie/salary_information

The current crisis in staffing levels btw is one created by a policy decision by James Reilly to enslave newly qualified nurses.
INACCURATE PAY DATA
OECD show far higher pay than the INMO link above. OECD data shows Irish nurses pay about 40% higher than UK nurses' pay on a US$ ppp basis, purchasing power parity.
 

ger12

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INACCURATE PAY DATA
OECD show far higher pay than the INMO link above. OECD data shows Irish nurses pay about 40% higher than UK nurses' pay on a US$ ppp basis, purchasing power parity.
That's the pay scale in 2016.
 

damus

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Who'd have thought it....the high pay of nurses is the reason why they cannot recruit and retain staff in ED. Now what's the reason across the entire hospital system?
 

amist4

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Nope.

Should all workers, or just nurses, be excluded from receiving allowances, reasonable overtime and normal shift rates?
Did I suggest that?

I think it is reasonable to assume a career in nursing entails nursing hours and not 9-5. Therefore to quote a salary devoid of the premiums associated with those hours is fundamentally dishonest and entirely self serving.
 


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