Phil Hogan's CAP reform proposals

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
As a TD and Minister in Ireland Phil Hogan was know for a few questionable events - top of mind probably quashing investigations into planning irregularities and the, of course the brain fart that pretty much gave the reins back to FF - IW.

IW - a great idea - was so badly conceived by Hogan that it decimated FG's ability to return a majority in 2011 because it pretty much mobilised EVERYONE against it - it brought together everything people hate: jobs for the boys, Denis O'Brien, John Tierney, abusing a monopoly, waste, new tax.

Given Hogan's poor track record how confident are people that he won't now make a complete mess of the CAP by his reforms.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/1129/923551-cap_reform_proposals/
 


ThatsReasonable

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 9, 2017
Messages
373
Good, get the debate rolling on CAP.
Heard him on the radio yesterday banging on about environmentalism and biodiversity. Sure sign the real meat (NPI) is tough for the farmers going into the future with the absence of British funding for the CAP.

He did say he wants farm payments capped. I agree with that. I don't mind keeping small family farms in business, but making the 'ranchers' rich through handouts does stick in the craw.
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
On the face of it the proposals look reasonable - share the pot more fairly across the lower income farmers, but I guess there are a few questions on CAP that still need to be answered.

1 - are CAP payments the best use of EU tax payers money...is it practical to pay farmers just for being farmers?

2 - I can never get my head around the level of food imports INTO the EU from less regulated markets - we over regulate or food producers, pay them a subsidy and then allow cheaper imports to under cut them - when is this going to change?
 

irish_bob

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 9, 2008
Messages
7,545
providing more to small farmers doesnt actually make sense for the industry going forward , the dairy sector expansion is the number one priority going forward and these are in the main larger farmers or at least not small , cushioning small farms by distributing more to them will allow them to hold on to their land , this land is needed for dairy farmers to expand , the public should be in favour of this as large farmers actually do wash their own face , small farmers are reliant on handouts

i foresee a scheme in place where small farmers ( especially in the west of ireland ) are forced to plant trees in order to prevent a significant cut in subsidies , this dovetails with the need to reduce our carbon output while will allow expansion in the aforementioned dairy sector , small beef farms have no real future in this country
 
Last edited:

former wesleyan

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2009
Messages
25,620
One benefit of Brexit is that CAP reforms will probably get through. The last time it was tried - in favour of the small farmer - by Ray MacSharry - the Tory MP Henry Plumb stood up in Westminister and gave out yards about some Paddy " daring to tell a once great nation how to do its business ".
 

im axeled

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 24, 2010
Messages
29,289
Heard him on the radio yesterday banging on about environmentalism and biodiversity. Sure sign the real meat (NPI) is tough for the farmers going into the future with the absence of British funding for the CAP.

He did say he wants farm payments capped. I agree with that. I don't mind keeping small family farms in business, but making the 'ranchers' rich through handouts does stick in the craw.
a low number ranchers get the most of the payments, whats left is divvied up anoungst the vast majority of farmers
 

im axeled

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 24, 2010
Messages
29,289
providing more to small farmers doesnt actually make sense for the industry going forward , the dairy sector expansion is the number one priority going forward and these are in the main larger farmers or at least not small , cushioning small farms by distributing more to them will allow them to hold on to their land , this land is needed for dairy farmers to expand , the public should be in favour of this as large farmers actually their own face , small farmers are reliant on handouts

i foresee a scheme in place where small farmers ( especially in the west of ireland ) are forced to plant trees in order to prevent a significant cut in subsidies , this dovetails with the need to reduce our carbon output while allow expansion in the aforementioned dairy sector , small beef farms have no real future in this country
hereabouts it is the small farmers who are renting the idle land
 

CookieMonster

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2005
Messages
33,861
One benefit of Brexit is that CAP reforms will probably get through. The last time it was tried - in favour of the small farmer - by Ray MacSharry - the Tory MP Henry Plumb stood up in Westminister and gave out yards about some Paddy " daring to tell a once great nation how to do its business ".

He hasn't aged well:
 

Karloff

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 5, 2015
Messages
6,952
https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/1129/923551-cap_reform_proposals/

RTE gives two statements.

The communication paper also said that the granting of income support for farmers will be conditional on the delivery of enhanced environmental and climate obligations by farmers.

The document says that a transition to a more sustainable agriculture with environmental and climate obligations will be put at the heart of Europe's agriculture policy.
And

It says there is a need to reduce the regulatory burden on farmers of CAP - with EU member states becoming much more responsible and accountable for devising and policing farm support schemes in order to reduce red tape.
Which would seem to be contradictory.

Without red tape farmers would be polluting more, cutting down every tree and poisoning every wild creature. It's easy to speak about the importance of biodiversity but this govt do not care about the environment.
 

dundealing

Duplicate Account
Joined
Jan 22, 2017
Messages
599
Heard him on the radio yesterday banging on about environmentalism and biodiversity. Sure sign the real meat (NPI) is tough for the farmers going into the future with the absence of British funding for the CAP.

He did say he wants farm payments capped. I agree with that. I don't mind keeping small family farms in business, but making the 'ranchers' rich through handouts does stick in the craw.

do you really believe hogan or his friends have any interest in supporting the small farmers vs the likes of the bruton brothers or the larry scumman , of this world
 

dundealing

Duplicate Account
Joined
Jan 22, 2017
Messages
599
https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/1129/923551-cap_reform_proposals/

RTE gives two statements.



And



Which would seem to be contradictory.

Without red tape farmers would be polluting more, cutting down every tree and poisoning every wild creature. It's easy to speak about the importance of biodiversity but this govt do not care about the environment.

the environment you travel through when you leave your urban hovel was created by farmers , it is their land and they have a hell of a lot more knowledge and interest in their environment than day trippers like you
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
do you really believe hogan or his friends have any interest in supporting the small farmers vs the likes of the bruton brothers or the larry scumman , of this world
That's what's intriguing about his proposals...they're completely at odds with his ideology...is there a shell game going on here?
 

Analyzer

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
45,623
Can one possibly imagine any nEU empire Politbuto without a dodgy creep like Hogan ?

His track record in Irrland is highly questionnable. And now he gets to implement policy on others - exceot none of them elected him.

Phil Hogan is the essence of what is wrong with nEU imperial policy diktats.
 

Karloff

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 5, 2015
Messages
6,952
the environment you travel through when you leave your urban hovel was created by farmers , it is their land and they have a hell of a lot more knowledge and interest in their environment than day trippers like you
What created as in Gaia created? You probably represent the intelligence level of the type of farmer i complain about very well.
 

CookieMonster

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2005
Messages
33,861
That's what's intriguing about his proposals...they're completely at odds with his ideology...is there a shell game going on here?
He's not acting as a Irish govt minister now though, he's a European Commissioner.
 

ThatsReasonable

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 9, 2017
Messages
373
do you really believe hogan or his friends have any interest in supporting the small farmers vs the likes of the bruton brothers or the larry scumman , of this world
Fair point - he said he was supporting capped subsidies but then fudged the rest of the answer as to whether his plan had firm proposals in that regard.
 


Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top