#Polexit next .. or as others have said ( in article comments ) #krakout .. ???

raetsel

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 5, 2017
Messages
9,083
There you are onto a controversial point. If an eu citizen works say six months? 12? say two years?, four years?... and then goes unemployed... is he entitled to be on the scratcher for life? I don't think it has been fully ironed out.
This needs to be scrutinised regardless of whether its an EU immigrant or a local, but I suspect that it is actually less of a problem with EU immigrants who have had the motivation to go abroad to find work in the first place. We know from our own experience that it requires a high level of motivation to move to another country to find work. The lazy ones tend to be the ones who stay at home when they lose their jobs.
 


BelCanto

New member
Joined
Sep 13, 2017
Messages
4
I have a young Polish colleague at work, and her presentation is somewhat different.

It is a generational issue - the younger generation are pro-EU, and very much like its cosmopolitanism and freedoms. Older people hanker for some lost era of stability and certainty that PiS is promising them.

If the need is to change the judicial system, then the democratic process is to achieve a national consensus across as many parties as possible, not just the dictation of a single party that may not even command a majority. There is no national consensus, just a power-grab.

I would not trust Polish TV shows since the government has largely taken control of the TV stations to broadcast propaganda, so do not expect a balanced presentation. You can be sure some of the "callers" are like the sockpuppets and Russian trolls we get here.
Tusk's party has ridiculed PiS as being the "Poor Man's Party" for years, so a lot of young Poles would not like to be associated with the party as it is not a trendy city-party (one of their goals is to make sure each Pole will be able to get a job within 30km of their place of birth and family- economic migration should not be a must). This perception has changed in Poland in the last 2 years as the government is doing a decent job and is very progressive when it comes to economy, but yes I am aware ex-pats have a different view and would try to adjust to the opinion they read in English speaking media. Please note also young Polish people long for justice.

As for callers, don't dismiss people if you haven't heard their stories. I am too new of a member to be able to post links or youtube videos, however they exist, case after case of someone's life ruined by a court decision. They deserve something better than a banana republic.
 

BelCanto

New member
Joined
Sep 13, 2017
Messages
4
If they are basing their new system on ones that are already operating in other EU countries -why are the EU reacting like this?
This is a very good question. There are some groups who benefit from corrupt judges. Also going forward, we can expect PiS to continue with a clean-up in other areas and economical changes based on their election promises. This is not in everybody's interest, they have been buying back state assets in the last 2 years (good for the country, bad for some investors).

I miss a balanced view in the Western media on the topic. Poland has experienced a big brain-drain in the last years. The EU in the single market are of course positive for the country, but not everybody is made for immigration and some changes are needed to allow people without connections and money a fair chance in their own country.
 

Volatire

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 25, 2012
Messages
13,643
Fighting now on Eastern and Western fronts.

Plus ça change ..
 

Clanrickard

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
33,387
Poland have a smaller economy than Netherlands or Sweden, so they would hardly be missed.

The country is a net gainer from the EU so would not even have the poor hand the British have. Poland heading off to make free trade deals independently of the EU? Don't think so.

I hope they are not that stupid, but you would never know.
Poland is tipped to be the 4th biggest economy by 2040. They would be missed big time.
 

The_SR

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Messages
18,036
This is a very good question. There are some groups who benefit from corrupt judges. Also going forward, we can expect PiS to continue with a clean-up in other areas and economical changes based on their election promises. This is not in everybody's interest, they have been buying back state assets in the last 2 years (good for the country, bad for some investors).

I miss a balanced view in the Western media on the topic. Poland has experienced a big brain-drain in the last years. The EU in the single market are of course positive for the country, but not everybody is made for immigration and some changes are needed to allow people without connections and money a fair chance in their own country.
And pis aren't giving jobs to the lads? They aren't giving money to one religious group?
 

valamhic

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 31, 2011
Messages
19,476
Ireland needs to look to a new relationship with Britain and Poland after the ending of the EU
 

ionsniffer

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 27, 2014
Messages
7,162
Ireland needs to look to a new relationship with Britain and Poland after the ending of the EU
what relationship with Poland?

how exactly does Poland benefit your average Irish person?

Pretty one sided affair as far as I can see. Poles come here. end of story.
 

gerhard dengler

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 3, 2011
Messages
46,739
EU's inability, it's unwillingness more accurately, to reform itself is becoming it's own undoing.

The other problem is the EU's inability to not interfere in the internal affairs of member countries.
 

eoghanacht

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Messages
32,410
#

The EU treaties limit "Polish sovereign affairs" as they do German, French, ... sovereign affairs.

So long as the Polish people (not their Government) wish to stay in the EU, their Government must comply with the treaties.
You wouldn't think you'd have to lead a poster by the nose on such basics.

This place is getting more like Facebook.
 

flavirostris

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
24,570
EU's inability, it's unwillingness more accurately, to reform itself is becoming it's own undoing.

The other problem is the EU's inability to not interfere in the internal affairs of member countries.
You can compare this to the EU reaction to the events in Catalonia recently. The EU said and did nothing, even with the pictures of women being dragged through the streets by their hair. Now they are screeching about Poland.
 

gerhard dengler

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 3, 2011
Messages
46,739
You can compare this to the EU reaction to the events in Catalonia recently. The EU said and did nothing, even with the pictures of women being dragged through the streets by their hair. Now they are screeching about Poland.
Let the EU screech and moan. The EU is a racket. It does not respect democracy, or respect national sovereignty.

The notion of imposing a "one size fits all" fix across the peoples of Europe was, and is proving to be, absurd.

The fact that this imposition is being piloted by a small coterie of unelected, unaccountable, stooges adds insult to injury.
 

sic transit

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
25,397
You can compare this to the EU reaction to the events in Catalonia recently. The EU said and did nothing, even with the pictures of women being dragged through the streets by their hair. Now they are screeching about Poland.
The Catalan thing was deemed an illegal vote by Spain so they were always going to ignore it and even Madrid, eventually, acknowledged the harshness of the police response. Polish situation is very different in that it is the state they have issues with and their efforts to bring courts under the control of the government.
 

sic transit

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
25,397
Let the EU screech and moan. The EU is a racket. It does not respect democracy, or respect national sovereignty.

The notion of imposing a "one size fits all" fix across the peoples of Europe was, and is proving to be, absurd.

The fact that this imposition is being piloted by a small coterie of unelected, unaccountable, stooges adds insult to injury.
The so-called unelected are approved and dare I say voted for by the European Parliament which we do vote for.
 

gerhard dengler

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 3, 2011
Messages
46,739
The so-called unelected are approved and dare I say voted for by the European Parliament which we do vote for.
I don't recall being given a ballot paper with Junckers name upon it.

Did you get a ballot paper with Junckers name on it?
 

sic transit

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
25,397
I don't recall being given a ballot paper with Junckers name upon it.

Did you get a ballot paper with Junckers name on it?
Well if you voted in the Euro elections you did, by proxy, the same way you gave our TDs permission to carry on as they have, in our name. The only things we truly vote directly on are referenda.
 

gerhard dengler

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 3, 2011
Messages
46,739
gerhard dengler said:
I don't recall being given a ballot paper with Junckers name upon it.

Did you get a ballot paper with Junckers name on it?
Well if you voted in the Euro elections you did, by proxy, the same way you gave our TDs permission to carry on as they have, in our name.
So you didn't get a ballot paper with Junckers name on it, either.
 

sic transit

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
25,397
So you didn't get a ballot paper with Junckers name on it, either.
You really have no grasp of representative democracy and how it works. Your vote vests the power in others to make those decisions.
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top