Political leaders' pay in small advanced EU countries v Ireland

patslatt

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Swedish ministers gets pay raise for Sweden

Annual pay from July 1st for the Swedish prime minister is €147,000 rounded and for cabinet ministers €118,000. Sweden's population is about double Ireland's and its welfare state far more advanced,as are the other EU welfare states below.

For EU comparisons,see http://www.eurofound.europa.eu/eiro/2009/12/articles/ie0912029i.htm Scroll down to "Eurozone Comparators" heading of a section where the second paragraph says the Taoiseach's pay was significantly ahead of the leaders of Austria,Belgium and Finland and the Netherlands,"with the head of government in Finland on just 75% of the Taoiseach's adjusted salary [were the adjustments done by Irish civil servants with a bias towards underestimating this gap?]. Similar results were found for other government ministers,with Austria being slightly ahead on salary."

"Government ministers in Belgium and Finland earned 88% and 83% of the Irish equivalent on an adjusted basis."

Given that all the states mentioned have more successful social welfare systems than Ireland's to manage,the case could be made that Irish government ministers and the Taoiseach should be paid less. However,it would be a good start to the December budget speech if Minister Lenihan cut ministerial salaries to bring them in line with the small countries,having regard to relative differences in GNP per capita,not our inflated,misleading GDP figures. That suggests a cut of about 20% in pay,a cut which could then be applied to all high salaries across the public sector, though with reduced cuts for the bottom half of the salary scales.
 
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CarnivalOfAction

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patslatt

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PaySwedish taxes for Ireland's shoddy welfare state and dysfunctional health care?

+1

And they have a progressive tax system. Colin Rapple shows how we could raise €18 billion more per year if we were taxed as in Sweden:

Colm’s columns » 2010» October
No thanks. And it is disingenuous to use GDP because it is iinflated by multinational transactions in intercompany pricing to divert profits here for the low Irish tax rate,profits that would be diverted elsewhere if Irish corporate taxes were increased.
 

anewbeginning

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Thankfully we are nearing the endgame in terms of FF basketcase economics and the endemic corruption that goes along with it, which includes paying themselves inflated wages and their friends also in public bodies.

If you tackle the FF corruption, you would solve most of Ireland's economic problems.

We really cannot turn a corner until FF are banished from power permanently.
 

stripey cat

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it would be a good start to the December budget speech if Minister Lenihan cut ministerial salaries to bring them in line with the small countries, having regard to relative differences in GNP per capita, not our inflated, misleading GDP figures. That suggests a cut of about 20% in pay, a cut which could then be applied to all high salaries across the public sector, though with reduced cuts for the bottom half of the salary scales.
Yeah right. Like that's going to happen.

 

Mossy Heneberry

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gayguy2000

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Sweden has tonnes of indigenous industry and world renowned brands. Ireland has nothing. We cannot compare ourselves with a successful country like Sweden.
The fact their leaders get paid less than ours is scandalous, but nothing will be donee because no one in Ireland really cares enough to protest.
They also don't have a culture of living off the state and never working or travellers.
 

locke

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Sweden has tonnes of indigenous industry and world renowned brands. Ireland has nothing. We cannot compare ourselves with a successful country like Sweden.
I wouldn't say we have none - Ryanair and Kerry Group are up there internationally.

However, I believe Sweden has either the most multi-nationals per capita of any country or is 2nd to The Netherlands (I can't remember exactly), so yes, they are well ahead of us there.
 

gayguy2000

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I wouldn't say we have none - Ryanair and Kerry Group are up there internationally.

However, I believe Sweden has either the most multi-nationals per capita of any country or is 2nd to The Netherlands (I can't remember exactly), so yes, they are well ahead of us there.
Do Ryanair create a lot of jobs/revenue for Ireland? Serious question.
Volvo, Scandia, IKEA, SAAB, Eriksson, are just some Swedish ones I can think of offhand!
 
M

MrFunkyBoogaloo

Swedish ministers gets pay raise for Sweden

Annual pay from July 1st for the Swedish prime minister is €147,000 rounded and for cabinet ministers €118,000. Sweden's population is about double Ireland's and its welfare state far more advanced,as are the other EU welfare states below.

For EU comparisons,see Government cuts pay of most public servants by up to 8% Scroll down to "Eurozone Comparators" heading of a section where the second paragraph says the Taoiseach's pay was significantly ahead of the leaders of Austria,Belgium and Finland and the Netherlands,"with the head of government in Finland on just 75% of the Taoiseach's adjusted salary [were the adjustments done by Irish civil servants?]. Similar results were found for other government ministers,with Austria being slightly ahead on salary."

"Government ministers in Belgium and Finland earned 88% and 83% of the Irish equivalent on an adjusted basis."

Given that all the states mentioned have more successful social welfare systems than Ireland's to manage,the case could be made that Irish government ministers and the Taoiseach should be paid less. However,it would be a good start to the December budget speech if Minister Lenihan cut ministerial salaries to bring them in line with the small countries,having regard to relative differences in GNP per capita,not our inflated,misleading GDP figures. That suggests a cut of about 20% in pay,a cut which could then be applied to all high salaries across the public sector, though with reduced cuts for the bottom half of the salary scales.
For TDs a cut of 40% would be better, considering they cut the amount of hours they're required to sign in, yet still get paid for, by 20%. A cut of 20% in the budget for TDs would just cancel out the previous 20% increase and leave them, technically, paid the same as before. Although that would be an improvement on the current conditions it needs to be more.

http://www.politics.ie/oireachtas/135727-tds-senators-work-120-days-instead-150-a.html
 

Odyessus

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Swedish ministers gets pay raise for Sweden

Annual pay from July 1st for the Swedish prime minister is €147,000 rounded and for cabinet ministers €118,000. Sweden's population is about double Ireland's and its welfare state far more advanced,as are the other EU welfare states below.

For EU comparisons,see Government cuts pay of most public servants by up to 8% Scroll down to "Eurozone Comparators" heading of a section where the second paragraph says the Taoiseach's pay was significantly ahead of the leaders of Austria,Belgium and Finland and the Netherlands,"with the head of government in Finland on just 75% of the Taoiseach's adjusted salary [were the adjustments done by Irish civil servants?]. Similar results were found for other government ministers,with Austria being slightly ahead on salary."

"Government ministers in Belgium and Finland earned 88% and 83% of the Irish equivalent on an adjusted basis."

Given that all the states mentioned have more successful social welfare systems than Ireland's to manage,the case could be made that Irish government ministers and the Taoiseach should be paid less. However,it would be a good start to the December budget speech if Minister Lenihan cut ministerial salaries to bring them in line with the small countries,having regard to relative differences in GNP per capita,not our inflated,misleading GDP figures. That suggests a cut of about 20% in pay,a cut which could then be applied to all high salaries across the public sector, though with reduced cuts for the bottom half of the salary scales.

As I am sick of pointing out, everyone in the public service in Ireland, not just politicians, is paid way more than the European average.

Of course we should cut politicians' pay; but the savings made from this would be just a drop in the ocean.

All
public service pay and pensions must be cut by at least 10% over the next four years, and the same goes for welfare payments, to save real money.


P.S. And yes, I know all these have already been cut, but we need to go further.
 

patslatt

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Two cheers

Sweden has tonnes of indigenous industry and world renowned brands. Ireland has nothing. We cannot compare ourselves with a successful country like Sweden.
The fact their leaders get paid less than ours is scandalous, but nothing will be donee because no one in Ireland really cares enough to protest.
They also don't have a culture of living off the state and never working or travellers.
Guinness, whisky brands which are growing fast,Kerry Foods brands,tax shelter for global finance,global marketer for US high tech and pharma-not bad. But we need more indigeneous entrepreneurs who don't sell out too soon to big business.
 

patslatt

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Work ethic in Sweden

Sweden has tonnes of indigenous industry and world renowned brands. Ireland has nothing. We cannot compare ourselves with a successful country like Sweden.
The fact their leaders get paid less than ours is scandalous, but nothing will be donee because no one in Ireland really cares enough to protest.
They also don't have a culture of living off the state and never working or travellers.
The reason the Swedes cut taxes in the 1990s was that the young generation had been losing the work ethic,preferring a nice state subsidised life style. The economy stagnated through the 80s.
 

patslatt

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Do Ryanair create a lot of jobs/revenue for Ireland? Serious question.
Volvo, Scandia, IKEA, SAAB, Eriksson, are just some Swedish ones I can think of offhand!
Volvo,Saab and Eriksson have been in financial difficulties and lost market share.
 

Panopticon

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Volvo,Saab and Eriksson have been in financial difficulties and lost market share.
More to the point, they were founded in the late 1800s/early 1900s, when Sweden was the 1st-3rd wealthiest country in the world. Since the 1920s, they have been drawing down on their capital and spending it on their welfare state, while they slip down the rankings.

Sweden's dirty little secret is that they only seem better than everyone else because they're spending down the early-20th century capital reserve they got to keep by co-operating with Nazi Germany.
 
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Do Ryanair create a lot of jobs/revenue for Ireland? Serious question.
Volvo, Scandia, IKEA, SAAB, Eriksson, are just some Swedish ones I can think of offhand!
Volvo - owned by Ford before being flogged to Chinese
Scandia - Danish or maybe you thinking of
Skandia - acquired by Old Mutual in 2006
Ikea - Swedish
Ericsson - Swedish
SAAB - owned by GM now owned by Spyker
 

unaetoile

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no more taxes...all we are doing is throwing more good money into bad management - SIPTU/HSE slush accounts, politician's gravy train, fas, bloated overpaid semi states, bureaucratic/admin heavy HSE, overpaid RTE 'celebs', quangos of croynism, civil service elite (and union bosses likewise)....the gap in the exchequer would vastly benefit if all this misspending, lack of accountability, entitlement culture was ended!! And then only then considered taxes on the individual, water rates etc. etc etc.....the buck stops at the top now!
 

DeGaulle 2.0

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For TDs a cut of 40% would be better, considering they cut the amount of hours they're required to sign in, yet still get paid for, by 20%. A cut of 20% in the budget for TDs would just cancel out the previous 20% increase and leave them, technically, paid the same as before. Although that would be an improvement on the current conditions it needs to be more.

http://www.politics.ie/oireachtas/135727-tds-senators-work-120-days-instead-150-a.html
Sweden has 349 TDs for 9 million people. They have exactly the same ratio of TD per population as we do.
 


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