Post 8th Discussion

Lumpy Talbot

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No
That'll be some civil servant taking the piss.
 


RossN

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I wouldn't be surprised if the three day reflection period is abolished soon and I'm sure we won't hear a peep from Simon Coveney when it happens.
 

MsDaisyC

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I wouldn't be surprised if the three day reflection period is abolished soon and I'm sure we won't hear a peep from Simon Coveney when it happens.
Is he Minister for Health now?
 

Catapulta

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6666 abortions in Republic in 2019, not including 400 Irish abortions in the UK. Not hugely different from before repeal. 6542 were in first 12 weeks.


So about 2% had something to do with what all the palaver was about from the 'pro-choice' side then?

We just eliminated over 6,500 humans from the Irish Population

- for no good reason!

I think this figure is far higher than what was happening before this legislation was introduced and women were 'forced' to go to England to get an Abortion.

It's not like the Pro Life side didn't point all this out mind

- not that I get any satisfaction from saying it...:confused:
 

Catapulta

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Press release - Ruth Coppinger
Abortion figures in line with expectations, but some women still forced to travel
30 June 2020

Speaking after the release of official figures showing that 6,666 people accessed safe legal abortions in Ireland in the first year, abortion rights campaigner, Ruth Coppinger, said the figures were in line with expectations, but should be analysed now to see who is being left behind.

“6,666 pregnant people were able to get legal, safe abortions with their own GP or hospital in 2019 and not shunned or forced out of their own country. That is a cause for huge satisfaction for those women and for the thousands of people who fought so long and hard for repeal of the 8th Amendment,” said the former socialist TD who moved a number of repeal Bills and who served on the Oireachtas Committee which proposed legal change.

“The figures are broadly in line with expectations. In 2017, 3,019 travelled to the UK giving an Irish address. But it’s well known many don’t give Irish addresses at all, while others travelled to countries such as the Netherlands. On top of this, an estimated 1,800 Irish people requested abortion pills that year from Women On Web and Women Help Women, two online telemedicine services.”

“It’s clear from organisations supporting women that many are still being forced to travel, however, which is not in line with the Citizens Assembly recommendations or the spirit of the huge vote for repeal.

“This includes pregnant people with medical conditions who couldn’t access abortion on health grounds or due to severe but non fatal abnormalities, as well as others who had unsuccessful medical abortions or where delays led to them going over the 12 weeks. These women and couples were forced to make very expensive and painful journeys, when they should be treated in their own country.

“A review of the legislation is imminent. Many are fearful the conservative composition of this coalition will lead to no change. It will be vital that youth, women’s and pro choice organisations campaign hard to bring home to TDs the need for reforms of the law and for expansion of services throughout the country. Nobody should be left behind. “
Ruth says:
“The figures are broadly in line with expectations. In 2017, 3,019 travelled to the UK giving an Irish address. But it’s well known many don’t give Irish addresses at all, while others travelled to countries such as the Netherlands. On top of this, an estimated 1,800 Irish people requested abortion pills that year from Women On Web and Women Help Women, two online telemedicine services.”

Even if all those claiming an Irish address who got an Abortion in England in 2018 were actually Irish

- and even if all those who ordered abortion pills from these people over there actually took them

- that is somewhere around 4,800 terminations of a Human Life

However the official figure for 2019 is actually 6666

- an almost 50% increase in one year!

We have now created a Society where the value of a Human Life is Trash to be cut out of a woman, put in a plastic bag

- and sent to the Incinerator .....🔥
 

MsDaisyC

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So about 2% had something to do with what all the palaver was about from the 'pro-choice' side then?

We just eliminated over 6,500 humans from the Irish Population

- for no good reason!

I think this figure is far higher than what was happening before this legislation was introduced and women were 'forced' to go to England to get an Abortion.

It's not like the Pro Life side didn't point all this out mind

- not that I get any satisfaction from saying it...:confused:
For no reason that antichoicers accept. You don't control women and girls anymore and I get that you're frustrated and all, but every single woman and girl had a reason good enough for themselves, and these days, that's all that matters.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
The numbers aren't likely to be accurate as they'll only record terminations via the hospital system. We've had only ballpark figures for the number of Irish women going to the UK for terminations because the system there could only record an Irish national if they gave a name and address in Ireland at the clinic in London or Manchester. Chances are that the official numbers are understated because of the number of Irish women who went to the UK, stayed at a cousin's, aunt's, friend's house and gave that address to the clinic.

At least with abortion permitted in Ireland under certain circumstances we'll start to get some real data at last. Something no one has had at all during the entire 30 years-odd period between the installation and removal of the 8th.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Mind you, to the O'Taliban Irish women are completely and philosophically incapable of right-thinking in this area. During the debate in Ireland it was remarkable how often the O'Taliban baldly explained that women are notoriously unreliable and untrustworthy (something that is intrinsic to their 'philosophy' by the way). It was around the issue of how termination might be accessed on medical grounds. At one point O'Reilly as Health Minister was trying to arrange a kangaroo court panel of 'Friends of the Hospital' a woman would have to negotiate when requesting a termination on physical or mental health grounds, with the idea she'd have to negotiate that, be cross-examined by this panel of official apostles in the most appalling way. Because women are prone to lying to get what they want, of course. They can't help themselves. It is Satan working through them :)

Then of course there was the issue at Galway where Jamesie's thoughts ran to a local panel of pals of Fine Gael to pick its way through the Halappanavar issue. It was just astonishing the speed with which any of these issues became more about what the neighbours might think than having any concern for the people who suffered the fall-out of Galway and the dreadful Halappanavar case.

The more I think back on the desperate attempts by intellectual luddites to prevent the real world intruding on their flower arrangements the more astonished I get at the naked bullsh*t that was on exhibit on the island politically since 1983 and long before it.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
I suppose we are well known for our cheery fondness for bullsh*t. But it appears to me that if you hold on to bullsh*t for too long it turns toxic and brings only a form of political sepsis from a certain point onwards.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
I wish I'd kept the Anti-Amendment leaflets from 1983. It was the first bit of political debate I recall being involved in and because there was a long run up over a few years of fairly awful debate before the 8th referendum itself it covered a period of about 18 months to 2 years in the run up to the calling of the referendum and I think I was still just 18 when the vote itself came around.

Even going door to door with simple leaflets explaining why the 8th would be bad law earned some serious abuse at the doors. Doors slammed in the face when it was explained you were Anti-Amendment campaigners, called 'murderer', not for the first or or last time even though strangely enough no one can produce any body. Habemus no corpus.

Those leaflets we were carrying around were fairly prophetic, I know that much. Pity it took thirty years to unwind that total constitutional imprisonment imposed on the Irish people by agents of a foreign power. Rome.
 

Clanrickard

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Press release - Ruth Coppinger
Abortion figures in line with expectations, but some women still forced to travel
30 June 2020

Speaking after the release of official figures showing that 6,666 people accessed safe legal abortions in Ireland in the first year, abortion rights campaigner, Ruth Coppinger, “
Who?
 

making waves

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Ruth says:
“The figures are broadly in line with expectations. In 2017, 3,019 travelled to the UK giving an Irish address. But it’s well known many don’t give Irish addresses at all, while others travelled to countries such as the Netherlands. On top of this, an estimated 1,800 Irish people requested abortion pills that year from Women On Web and Women Help Women, two online telemedicine services.”

Even if all those claiming an Irish address who got an Abortion in England in 2018 were actually Irish

- and even if all those who ordered abortion pills from these people over there actually took them

- that is somewhere around 4,800 terminations of a Human Life

However the official figure for 2019 is actually 6666

- an almost 50% increase in one year!

We have now created a Society where the value of a Human Life is Trash to be cut out of a woman, put in a plastic bag

- and sent to the Incinerator .....🔥
Says the xenophobic, misogynist, racist gombeen
 

RossN

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Is he Minister for Health now?
No but he is the spineless little tool who was a great help to the the Pro-Choice side by persuading reluctant 'Yes' voters and fence sitters that the three day wait was some sort of major concession instead of a politicalpolitical figleaf to disguise the fact he'd surrendered completely.

As I said I'm sure that after all that he won't make a peep when it comes up for review.
 

making waves

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I wish I'd kept the Anti-Amendment leaflets from 1983. It was the first bit of political debate I recall being involved in and because there was a long run up over a few years of fairly awful debate before the 8th referendum itself it covered a period of about 18 months to 2 years in the run up to the calling of the referendum and I think I was still just 18 when the vote itself came around.

Even going door to door with simple leaflets explaining why the 8th would be bad law earned some serious abuse at the doors. Doors slammed in the face when it was explained you were Anti-Amendment campaigners, called 'murderer', not for the first or or last time even though strangely enough no one can produce any body. Habemus no corpus.

Those leaflets we were carrying around were fairly prophetic, I know that much. Pity it took thirty years to unwind that total constitutional imprisonment imposed on the Irish people by agents of a foreign power. Rome.
serious abuse and physical assaults - and the anti-choice fundamentalists spent nearly 40 years attempting to block every piece of progressive legislation that was attempted. They are still at it today - Foley is going to dig in and attempt to continue blocking the badly needed Objective Sex Education Bill.
 

RossN

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Says the xenophobic, misogynist, racist gombeen
While Coppinger is a horrible person and I'd agree she's racist and xenophobic against Americans and Israelis I'm not sure she's specifically misogynist rather than just generally awful to people regardless of gender.
 

making waves

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While Coppinger is a horrible person and I'd agree she's racist and xenophobic against Americans and Israelis I'm not sure she's specifically misogynist rather than just generally awful to people regardless of gender.
very funny
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
The number of the Beast.
Very likely a number that was originally something like 6,659 and some civil servant who could have been on either side of the debate decided to take the mickey with a bit extra smoothing to get it to 6,666.

Probably pissing themselves laughing at the in-joke.
 


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