Putin's Revenge -- Are we back in a new cold war? American side of the story on RTE player

Shpake

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
5,282
https://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/putins-revenge-30004999/10814949/

The above link is the second part a docu on Vladimir Putin. Regrets that RTE have taken down the first part.:(
Long story short, Putin feels hard done by because Nato promised Gorby not to expand eastwards to but apparently reneged on the promise. Also Putin got mighty paranoid at the fall of the Arab dictatorships during the Arab spring, believing (I suppose) that his turn would come sooner or later. He solve this problem by wiping out the political opposition.
Putin, it seems, went back on (Gorby or Yeltsin)'s promise of recognizing Ukraine's border in return for surrendering their nuclear weapons... but that's just my two cents.

This episode in the above link gives the American side of how in the run-up to the latest Presidential election how Trump beat Hillary. Disturbing is that the CIA maintain that Putin in person (not merely some subordinate in the Kremlin)was behind the hacking, fake news and the strategically timed release of information so as to influence the outcome.
That black-and-white photo of Obama and Putin almost growling at one another is apparently where Obama is telling Putin that he knows that he, Putin was behind it all.
It makes for scary viewing. But people who have an interest in politics, whether it's just pot-holes in Kilorglin or constituency matters in Dun Leary/Rathdown should be kinda aware of whats going on in the world outside.
And it's nothing cheery. Expect some sort of new cold war times ahead.
 


bormotello

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 8, 2008
Messages
12,336
https://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/putins-revenge-30004999/10814949/

The above link is the second part a docu on Vladimir Putin. Regrets that RTE have taken down the first part.:(
Long story short, Putin feels hard done by because Nato promised Gorby not to expand eastwards to but apparently reneged on the promise. Also Putin got mighty paranoid at the fall of the Arab dictatorships during the Arab spring, believing (I suppose) that his turn would come sooner or later. He solve this problem by wiping out the political opposition.
Putin, it seems, went back on (Gorby or Yeltsin)'s promise of recognizing Ukraine's border in return for surrendering their nuclear weapons... but that's just my two cents.

This episode in the above link gives the American side of how in the run-up to the latest Presidential election how Trump beat Hillary. Disturbing is that the CIA maintain that Putin in person (not merely some subordinate in the Kremlin)was behind the hacking, fake news and the strategically timed release of information so as to influence the outcome.
That black-and-white photo of Obama and Putin almost growling at one another is apparently where Obama is telling Putin that he knows that he, Putin was behind it all.
It makes for scary viewing. But people who have an interest in politics, whether it's just pot-holes in Kilorglin or constituency matters in Dun Leary/Rathdown should be kinda aware of whats going on in the world outside.
And it's nothing cheery. Expect some sort of new cold war times ahead.
Reminds me old Soviet Pravda-style propaganda just before collapse of USSR
Similar music, similar voices, similar attempts to present conspiracy theories as a hard facts
 

bormotello

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 8, 2008
Messages
12,336
BTW
Newly Declassified Documents: Gorbachev Told NATO Wouldn't Move Past East German Border | The National Interest, December 12, 2017
Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev was given a host of assurances that the NATO alliance would not expand past what was then the East German border in 1990 according to new declassified documents.

Russian leaders often complain that the NATO extended an invitation to Hungary, Poland and what was then Czechoslovakia to joint the alliance in 1997 at the Madrid Summit in contravention of assurances offered to the Soviet Union before its 1991 collapse. The alliance has dismissed the notion that such assurances were offered, however, scholars have continued to debate the issue for years. Now, however, newly declassified documents show that Gorbachev did in fact receive assurances that NATO would not expand past East Germany.
 

gerhard dengler

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 3, 2011
Messages
46,739
https://www.rte.ie/player/ie/show/putins-revenge-30004999/10814949/

The above link is the second part a docu on Vladimir Putin. Regrets that RTE have taken down the first part.:(
Long story short, Putin feels hard done by because Nato promised Gorby not to expand eastwards to but apparently reneged on the promise. Also Putin got mighty paranoid at the fall of the Arab dictatorships during the Arab spring, believing (I suppose) that his turn would come sooner or later. He solve this problem by wiping out the political opposition.
Putin, it seems, went back on (Gorby or Yeltsin)'s promise of recognizing Ukraine's border in return for surrendering their nuclear weapons... but that's just my two cents.

This episode in the above link gives the American side of how in the run-up to the latest Presidential election how Trump beat Hillary. Disturbing is that the CIA maintain that Putin in person (not merely some subordinate in the Kremlin)was behind the hacking, fake news and the strategically timed release of information so as to influence the outcome.
That black-and-white photo of Obama and Putin almost growling at one another is apparently where Obama is telling Putin that he knows that he, Putin was behind it all.
It makes for scary viewing. But people who have an interest in politics, whether it's just pot-holes in Kilorglin or constituency matters in Dun Leary/Rathdown should be kinda aware of whats going on in the world outside.
And it's nothing cheery. Expect some sort of new cold war times ahead.
I did watch this series on RTE, and I noted that the programme was made by PBS.

As you say it is an interesting programme to watch, and as you accurately say the narrative does suggest that the "Arab Spring" was alleged to have spooked Putin. Whether the programmes narrative is accurate or not in that regard, I don't know.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
22,622
DDSS.................... Different day, same 5hit.

US Intelligence waging a pysops war using its proxies in the media to spout drivel so thy can justify bigger budgets.

Same morons gave us Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria and want endless war to suit US MIC.

Journalists lost the will many years ago to call people out on this garbage.
 

Wagmore

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 17, 2015
Messages
14,149
I expect it's nonsense.

I won't bother to watch it.
I watched about 10mins when it was screened.Looked like rank pro-Dem, pro globalist propaganda.Zero nuance as Putin painted as panto villain
Whiny ladyboy libs like John Podesta yabbering about how he was hacked in a manner that would make your average Nigerian prince blush. Putin didn't write those incriminating emails John boy.If you watch, look out for the phony pro EU, anti Putin agenda.Putin distrusts EU.That makes two of us.Awful stuff.
 

Wagmore

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 17, 2015
Messages
14,149

Shpake

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
5,282
The country of origin of the thousands of emails and hacks can easily be traced.
The high-point is the allegation that the CIA or National Security Agency or whoever it was were able to find out that Putin personally was active behind the scenes. In other words they have some sort of informant in Putin's inner-circle. That's my understanding of what they were saying. Naturally the CIA are not going to blow the fellow's cover by calling him as a witness just to show Putin up. :|

To see the two heads of state growling at one another like two big dogs, and both with such an unshakeable aura of self-righteousness was something blood-curdling. I'm sorry I can't get the photo itself up
This is the link:
https://www.google.ie/search?q=putin+obama+meeting&rlz=1C1GCEA_enIE776IE776&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=JZqYyM5aW54plM%3A%2CoSHrOVXuR25ZmM%2C_&usg=__mrDmKIj_-JEsygd9q9O20Guk1ow=&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi26rH0o5TYAhUcM8AKHcouAGIQ9QEIPjAC#imgdii=3DOU1xoH2aeKRM:&imgrc=JZqYyM5aW54plM:

What I don't know is the degree to which the American side penetrated the Russian side. I just don't know the whataboutery. what the US did to the Russians which provoked the Russians to influence the elections.
Perhaps something to do with the US efforts to get the Ukraine into the EU sphere of influence.
 

Wagmore

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 17, 2015
Messages
14,149
The country of origin of the thousands of emails and hacks can easily be traced.
The high-point is the allegation that the CIA or National Security Agency or whoever it was were able to find out that Putin personally was active behind the scenes. In other words they have some sort of informant in Putin's inner-circle. That's my understanding of what they were saying. Naturally the CIA are not going to blow the fellow's cover by calling him as a witness just to show Putin up. :|

To see the two heads of state growling at one another like two big dogs, and both with such an unshakeable aura of self-righteousness was something blood-curdling. I'm sorry I can't get the photo itself up
This is the link:
https://www.google.ie/search?q=putin+obama+meeting&rlz=1C1GCEA_enIE776IE776&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=JZqYyM5aW54plM%3A%2CoSHrOVXuR25ZmM%2C_&usg=__mrDmKIj_-JEsygd9q9O20Guk1ow=&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi26rH0o5TYAhUcM8AKHcouAGIQ9QEIPjAC#imgdii=3DOU1xoH2aeKRM:&imgrc=JZqYyM5aW54plM:

What I don't know is the degree to which the American side penetrated the Russian side. I just don't know the whataboutery. what the US did to the Russians which provoked the Russians to influence the elections.
Perhaps something to do with the US efforts to get the Ukraine into the EU sphere of influence.
Maybe because they knew that if Satan's little helper got elected it meant war.Putin doesn't buy the Democrat/EU/ Globalist agenda. Putin did us all a favour by putting a halt to their gallop.They hat him with the same ferocity they hate Trump.Don't buy the BS
 

Shpake

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
5,282
Maybe because they knew that if Satan's little helper got elected it meant war.Putin doesn't buy the Democrat/EU/ Globalist agenda. Putin did us all a favour by putting a halt to their gallop.They hat him with the same ferocity they hate Trump.Don't buy the BS
I think it didn't go as simply or as smoothly as you are portraying it. Putin wanted payback time on Hillary, but to actually unseat her in the presidential election went way beyond his wildest expectations. The roosky side managed to hack the Democratic national headquarters and spent months rooting around in their hard drives collecting and collating the info. Then releasing it at strategic times.
Of course somebody was doing something the same on the anti-trump side: Recall that video of Trump boasting of how he grabbed ladies by the goolies. Then the other side of the "he said, she said" drama appears promptly with all the ladies that Bill had or tried to have a fling with. It was a pantomine or a Punch-and-Judy show. Well don't get to upset about it. If we are anything approaching the level of political scientists it's our job to figure out the trail and what the players did now that all the dust has settled.
 

Telstar 62

Well-known member
Joined
May 28, 2013
Messages
26,604
Kleptocrat thug and war criminal Putin has called an election for March.

I wonder who'll win??;)
 

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
54,521
As a longtime critic of Putin on politics.ie, I fail to see convincing evidence that anyone linked to his regime (as opposed to people claiming to be) made contact with anyone from the Trump campaign during the election.

On the Putin regime itself I think it needs to be handled with care. I support sanctions but also engagement, such as when the CIA helped stop a terror attack in Russia in the last few days, and the agreement on a ceasefire in Syria.

I am also not sure it was Russia - or anyone - that hacked Hillarys emails. In recent days the DOJ has released documents showing that originally Comey was only going to say it was "possible".

One thing that will not work is trying to force political change in Russia. We need containment but also cooperation. So that means NATO needs to bolster its frontline states with permanent garrisons and US weaponry, and help upgrade Eastern European armies particularly with the Javelin anti tank launchers that Ukraine has been begging for. The Russians used anti tank weapons against Georgia in 2008 to great effect.
 
Last edited:

Catalpast

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2012
Messages
25,560
If Vlad had been in the Kremlin then calling the shots it would not have happened

- from a geopolitical POV the period 1989-2000 was an absolute Disaster for Russia

It was the equivalent to losing a Major War in terms of territory and spheres of influence lost




Russia Today

And you want to know why Vlad wakes up in a cold sweat at 4 O'clock in the morning.....:shock:

Check your Sir Halford Mackinder:

The Heartland Theory of Geopolitics:

Mackinder summarised his theory as:
"Who rules East Europe commands the Heartland;
who rules the Heartland commands the World-Island;
who rules the World-Island commands the world."
(Mackinder, Democratic Ideals and Reality, p. 150)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Geographical_Pivot_of_History
 
Last edited:

Ardillaun

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 4, 2010
Messages
12,074
It all depends on how Russia sees its future. Why not be a normal country like Germany and try and make conditions better for your citizens?
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
22,622
As a longtime critic of Putin on politics.ie, I fail to see convincing evidence that anyone linked to his regime (as opposed to people claiming to be) made contact with anyone from the Trump campaign during the election.

On the Putin regime itself I think it needs to be handled with care. I support sanctions but also engagement, such as when the CIA helped stop a terror attack in Russia in the last few days, and the agreement on a ceasefire in Syria.

I am also not sure it was Russia - or anyone - that hacked Hillarys emails. In recent days the DOJ has released documents showing that originally Comey was only going to say it was "possible".

One thing that will not work is trying to force political change in Russia. We need containment but also cooperation. So that means NATO needs to bolster its frontline states with permanent garrisons and US weaponry, and help upgrade Eastern European armies particularly with the Javelin anti tank launchers that Ukraine has been begging for. The Russians used anti tank weapons against Georgia in 2008 to great effect.
Russians didn't influence the election.

Democrats and their Media / Financial friends saw WAR with Russia as next step.
It was to be started by getting Ukraine fully armed and they were to be the spark.

In 2014 Ukraine had maximum 15000 fully trained competent soldiers.......... this figure was well known, not just by Washington but by Moscow and everybody else.

Had Russia wished they could have taken huge areas of Ukraine pushing from with only escape area heading West into Poland and Hungary. Nothing happened............... there was no rush of Russian troops to border.

HRC was in pay of Military Industrial Complex who need profits from war, not getting elected disturbed this, so claims of treason are way the MSM can stop any raproachment with Russia to reduce tension.

People are so sucked into it just like Iraq 2003 and when all evidence shows nothing it doesn't stop the continued shrilling.

US electorate saw HRC for what she was and voted Trump, the idea that Russia somehow got area where Democrats have won for decades to suddenly vote GOP is laughable.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
22,622
Germany is a normal Country?:shock:

Ask the Russians....
Germany see US for what it is..................... its why Germany has been in forefront of getting Russian gas into EU.

Joschka Fischer called Iraq propoganda for what it was in 2003, a LIE and this was before the Invasion.
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top