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Rapid rise in 'sham marriages'

Dr Pat

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its relevant to you quote misleading articles to back up your argument.
For clarification purposes, do you believe in immigration controls and that the state has a right to impose them or are you a one-worlder?
 


The Preacher

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Those of you considering voting Labour should take into account that party's pro-amnesty positions which will only exacerbate the situation.
As opposed to Fianna Failure, who in keeping with their long and dishonourable tradition of taking kickbacks and bribes, will give anyone a passport once the brown envelope is big enough.
 

pinemartin

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For clarification purposes, do you believe in immigration controls and that the state has a right to impose them or are you a one-worlder?
i like to think of myself as a one worlder ( its nice in here) however I am in favour of immigration control. I believe that people that come here to live should do so to work or study. I think that other than taking out fair share of refugees that our intake should be confined to those that can contribute to our country.
 

Dr Pat

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i like to think of myself as a one worlder ( its nice in here) however I am in favour of immigration control. I believe that people that come here to live should do so to work or study. I think that other than taking out fair share of refugees that our intake should be confined to those that can contribute to our country.
Ok, thanks for being open. What's a fair share then and how would you define contribution to our country and align it with immigration permission?
 

jacko

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This is a matter of urgency as studies in the UK found that 75% of terrorist-plots originate in Pakistan. In that context, there is a threat that Islamist terrorists will exploit this loophole in order to either use Ireland as a base to attack other EU states, or else to attack targets in this republic. We shouldn't have to wait for that to happen (assuming it hasn't already) before taking action to prevent it by closing the loophole. The burden should be on would-be migrants to prove their bona-fides before coming here. Ireland doesn't owe anyone a better life except Irish citizens. It is naive in the extreme to assume that loopholes will not be exploited - not least loopholes as publicised as these.
and in the 1970s and 1980s 100% of terrorist plots against the UK originated in Ireland - should the UK have kicked out the 2 million Irish living there at the time ?
 

pinemartin

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Ok, thanks for being open. What's a fair share then and how would you define contribution to our country and align it with immigration permission?
those who work are contributing to our country so I would think that they are welcome. Fair share would depend on the economic state of the country and of irelands ability to provide for those refugees. Those that study in Ireland should be given a 2 year visa to stay after they complete their course. After that they should be considered on their ability to contribute to ireland. Of course we are talking about non eu people here as most eu citizens have the right to live and work here. contribute I suppose means provide for themselves , behave and generally be civilised, unlike lots of the natives who are negative in terms of what they do for society.
 

Dr Pat

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those who work are contributing to our country so I would think that they are welcome. Fair share would depend on the economic state of the country and of irelands ability to provide for those refugees. Those that study in Ireland should be given a 2 year visa to stay after they complete their course. After that they should be considered on their ability to contribute to ireland. Of course we are talking about non eu people here as most eu citizens have the right to live and work here. contribute I suppose means provide for themselves , behave and generally be civilised, unlike lots of the natives who are negative in terms of what they do for society.
Why should non-EU "students" who in many instances are using the visa system as a way to get into fulltime employment in Ireland be entitled to stay when there are so many Irish people out of work? Surely the first duty of the state is to its own citizens not to those from other countries? What limits would you put on these "students" working in the current economic climate.

As FT has pointed out, it seems that many of these bogus marriages are "students" who have overstayed their visas which suggests that there is a lack of bona fides on their part and they are in fact economic migrants. How does that square with young Irish people going on the dole?
 

FutureTaoiseach

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and in the 1970s and 1980s 100% of terrorist plots against the UK originated in Ireland - should the UK have kicked out the 2 million Irish living there at the time ?
Nothing the IRA ever did remotely compares to 911 in scale. The IRA killed 1800-1900 in 40 yrs, whereas Al Qaida killed 3,000 on 911. Despite the Left's fixation with Cultural-Relativism, it is not the same as what went before. Unlike the IRA, Al-Qaida generally don't give warnings, so we are dealing with an infinitely more theatening form of terrorism than what went before.
pinemartin said:
Those that study in Ireland should be given a 2 year visa to stay after they complete their course. After that they should be considered on their ability to contribute to ireland. Of course we are talking about non eu people here as most eu citizens have the right to live and work here. contribute I suppose means provide for themselves , behave and generally be civilised, unlike lots of the natives who are negative in terms of what they do for society.
"Contribute to Ireland" - that old catch-all chestnut to excuse amnesty by the one-worlders. :roll: 'Students' should not be allowed a further 2 yr stay when we have 13.5% unemployment and thousands of our own people having to emigrate. Liberalising an already soft system will only encourage more economic immigration, leading to competition for scarce work with Irish nationals. Charity begins at home. As a former colony rather than imperial power, Ireland doesn't owe a living to any other non-EEA nation.
 

fizzgig

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It can be easy to get residency through marriage or defacto relationship in Australia if you have a brain in your head. I met many Irish people there who got residency by using good forward planning. Even the obligratory intrusive interview can be dealt with if you're prepared. I feel myself if you're smart enough to get through the system, you're an asset to the country.
 

FutureTaoiseach

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It can be easy to get residency through marriage or defacto relationship in Australia if you have a brain in your head. I met many Irish people there who got residency by using good forward planning. Even the obligratory intrusive interview can be dealt with if you're prepared. I feel myself if you're smart enough to get through the system, you're an asset to the country.
On the contrary: if you play the system you have proven yourself to be a fraud and therefore a liability to your new country.
 

pinemartin

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Why should non-EU "students" who in many instances are using the visa system as a way to get into fulltime employment in Ireland be entitled to stay when there are so many Irish people out of work? Surely the first duty of the state is to its own citizens not to those from other countries? What limits would you put on these "students" working in the current economic climate.
The state encourages these students to come to Ireland so that they can prop up the underfunded eduction system and lots of dodgy colleges. The lack of bona fides is with the nature of some of these courses. They should be properly regulated and accredited. Irish college businesses want these students so they can make money. Some are economic migrants some are not.the students are already limited in the amount of time they can work and they dont get a work visa after.Ireland wants it both ways as usual, we want to get lots of money from students for these educational institutions but we dont want to give anything back. we cant have it both ways as there are plenty of countries with lots better to offer than ireland.

As FT has pointed out, it seems that many of these bogus marriages are "students" who have overstayed their visas which suggests that there is a lack of bona fides on their part and they are in fact economic migrants. How does that square with young Irish people going on the dole?
where did he say that? I would imagine that all your papers would have to be in order for you to get married. You are saying that you are allowed to get married in ireland when you dont have a valid visa. Is that correct?
 

pinemartin

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Nothing the IRA ever did remotely compares to 911 in scale. The IRA killed 1800-1900 in 40 yrs, whereas Al Qaida killed 3,000 on 911. Despite the Left's fixation with Cultural-Relativism, it is not the same as what went before. Unlike the IRA, Al-Qaida generally don't give warnings, so we are dealing with an infinitely more theatening form of terrorism than what went before."Contribute to Ireland" - that old catch-all chestnut to excuse amnesty by the one-worlders. :roll: 'Students' should not be allowed a further 2 yr stay when we have 13.5% unemployment and thousands of our own people having to emigrate. Liberalising an already soft system will only encourage more economic immigration, leading to competition for scarce work with Irish nationals. Charity begins at home. As a former colony rather than imperial power, Ireland doesn't owe a living to any other non-EEA nation.
Ireland dosnt owe a living to anyone not even irish people. lots of irish people wont work or will forever leech off the state. This is a much bigger problem and much harder to deal with than a few hundred bogus marriages.
 

Trampas

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Ireland dosnt owe a living to anyone not even irish people. lots of irish people wont work or will forever leech off the state. This is a much bigger problem and much harder to deal with than a few hundred bogus marriages.

It is.......and that is all the more reason why we should deal with those marriages as a priority.
 

JN_V2.0

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It can be easy to get residency through marriage or defacto relationship in Australia if you have a brain in your head. I met many Irish people there who got residency by using good forward planning. Even the obligratory intrusive interview can be dealt with if you're prepared. I feel myself if you're smart enough to get through the system, you're an asset to the country.


smart, real smart.
 

pinemartin

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That view is far from universal and is certainly not shared by a large number of our unemployed.
well many of the unemployed wont do the jobs that our immigrants do. My idea is certainly not shared by all but lots of people have no problem with immigrants.
 

Dr Pat

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1. The state encourages these students to come to Ireland so that they can prop up the underfunded eduction system and lots of dodgy colleges. The lack of bona fides is with the nature of some of these courses. They should be properly regulated and accredited. Irish college businesses want these students so they can make money. Some are economic migrants some are not.the students are already limited in the amount of time they can work and they dont get a work visa after.Ireland wants it both ways as usual, we want to get lots of money from students for these educational institutions but we dont want to give anything back. we cant have it both ways as there are plenty of countries with lots better to offer than ireland.



2. where did he say that? I would imagine that all your papers would have to be in order for you to get married. You are saying that you are allowed to get married in ireland when you dont have a valid visa. Is that correct?
1. Yes, but you and I know that the 20 hour a week system is not really enforced and it amounts to discrimination against native Irish workers in the market - there is widespread abuse of the system by unscrupulous economic migrants who want to get into the Ireland as part of the EU to work. Please reconcile this with your support (presumably) for Irish workers

2. Also what is the effect of these non-EU natives on finite resources and the community at large? What are the longterm implications? Why do we have to take them? Provide evidence that they are a benefit to the country by staying on in employment or are they merely a burden to satisfy the prevailing pc multiculturalism orthodoxy?


Have a look at his earlier posts on this thread. As to the visa situation, the use of bogus marriages does seem to be a tactic used by overstayers.
 

bob3344

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well many of the unemployed wont do the jobs that our immigrants do. My idea is certainly not shared by all but lots of people have no problem with immigrants.
The solution is to alter the welfare system to get the professional layabouts working, not loosen up the immigration system.

Otherwise you end up like the uk where millions have not worked in over a decade.

What happens if the immigrants are spongers too ?

Nigerians - over 60% unemployment at the height of the boom.
 

FutureTaoiseach

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Ireland dosnt owe a living to anyone not even irish people. lots of irish people wont work or will forever leech off the state. This is a much bigger problem and much harder to deal with than a few hundred bogus marriages.
Newstalk said that number has tripled in yrs so it's not simply a matter of a couple of hundred longterm. These are only the detected sham-marriages. And I disagree with your comments on the State's obligations to Irish citizens. Charity begins at home and the interests of the Irish nation should come first. I reject the anti-democratic supranational one-worlder agenda to foist something on us without our consent.
 

Dr Pat

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Newstalk said that number has tripled in yrs so it's not simply a matter of a couple of hundred longterm. These are only the detected sham-marriages. And I disagree with your comments on the State's obligations to Irish citizens. Charity begins at home and the interests of the Irish nation should come first. I reject the anti-democratic supranational one-worlder agenda to foist something on us without our consent.
+1.
 


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