Re-thinking Asylum


JacquesHughes

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2013
Messages
1,122
Yesterday was an historic day for the EU- the first mass return of 'refugees' from the EU to a (hastily declared) 'safe' but unattractive country (Turkey) which has contracted a treaty with the EU to accept them, oiled along with inducements for the State of Turkey. The 202 returned had declined to make claims for asylum. 130 were from Pakistan, and others from Iraq, Iran, Morocco and other countries. Another 2800 asylum seekers have remained on Lesbos in order to pursue their claim individually through whatever process the Greek authorities can set up for such vast numbers (1 million last year).
Migrants returned to Turkey from Greece under EU deal - BBC News

In compensation the first selected Syrian refugees have been flown to Germany from refugee camps in Turkey- their number capped at 72000 per year.
EU asylum laws have apparently not been changed, but the principles have been distorted. The only hope for 'success' of the policy is that a 'culture of expectation' is being changed throughout many Asian and African countries, so that millions are less confident that irregular travel to Europe will have a personally good outcome.

Comment: It has been necessary 'in the end' (but actually, we're nowhere near the end) to recognise (as should have been done all along) the special position of the Syrian refugees; but much, much more should be done to stabilise huge populations in the Third World which see little reason to stay at home. Some of them are:

- shelter in a European country should be temporary (for the duration of the crisis) not permanent
- asylum should be for that presenting persecuted individual, not automatically for his entire family
- university fees should not be 'paid' but funded as loans with an expectation of being repaid
- legal challenges to a government decision to refuse asylum should be heard in a safe country outside europe

- the countries producing bona fide refugees should be getting comprehensively thumped by smart sanctions
- the countries producing economic migrants should be getting effective help to relocate economic activity eg agriculture from Europe to those countries
- foreign policies (intervention etc) by European countries should consider their likely destabilising effect upon vulnerable populations
( I have not been able to think up a way to protect those vulnerable in our own society from direct competition for subsidised social housing. The concept of such housing probably needs rethought.)



-
 

nonpartyboy

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 24, 2006
Messages
6,857
And yet we had 250 people a month mainly from the indian sub continent arriving from the uk to claim asylum last year, because we run a joke of a system. Then we have the fake brides and the fake students.

Our immigration system is a shambles, plain and simple.
 

Kershaw

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 26, 2011
Messages
8,041
The beaches and bazaars of Sharm El Sheikh used to be bustling with tourists enjoying the Egyptian sun.

But after a decade of political turmoil and the downing of a Russian holiday jet last year, killing all 224 passengers, tourists are staying away and the Red Sea resort resembles a ghost town.

Sharm El Sheikh appears little more than a ghost town after attack on Russia airliner | Daily Mail Online

Could be a good location to shelter the migrants until the war is over and they can return home.

Last year an Egyptian billionaire wanted to buy a Greek island to house the migrants. This mirrored Australia's policy which resulted in their asylum number claims drop like a rock.
Egyptian billionaire approaches Greek island owners with offer to buy land for refugees | Europe | News | The Independent

The latest news is Greece has halted deportations to Turkey after they all put in claims for asylum in Greece.
Migrant crisis: Greece halts deportations to Turkey - BBC News
 

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
51,855
We will continue to have a shambles of an asylum system until we renegotiate or withdraw from the 1952 Refugee Convention which in no way takes into account the ease of international air travel and the freedom of movement in the EU.

Let in:
- people fleeing genocide, war, political persecution or natural disaster in a neighbouring country.

Keep out:
- Nationals of safe countries. This group should be summarily deported and not allowed apply for asylum. The Refugee Convention may be an obstacle here as it bans collective expulsions.

- Sex offenders, drug dealers, weapons traffickers, bank robbers and violent criminals.
 
Last edited:

Kershaw

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 26, 2011
Messages
8,041
And yet we had 250 people a month mainly from the indian sub continent arriving from the uk to claim asylum last year, because we run a joke of a system. Then we have the fake brides and the fake students.

Our immigration system is a shambles, plain and simple.
That's what I can't understand. Why aren't they applying Dublin rules and kicking them back to the UK? They're only coming here from there once there once their application is denied there.
 

P.ieire

Active member
Joined
Sep 22, 2015
Messages
123
Looks like a bad PR stunt, run of the mill for the multicultists. There's no change and nobody could seriously believe there was any effort to stop the invasion.
 

Half Nelson

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
21,745
We will continue to have a shambles of an asylum system until we renegotiate or withdraw from the 1952 Refugee Convention which in no way takes into account the ease of international air travel and the freedom of movement in the EU.

Let in:
- people fleeing genocide, war, political persecution or natural disaster in a neighbouring country.

Keep out:
- Nationals of safe countries. This group should be summarily deported and not allowed apply for asylum. The Refugee Convention may be an obstacle here as it bans collective expulsions.

- Sex offenders, drug dealers, weapons traffickers, bank robbers and violent criminals.
The EU is lumbered with limp-wristed x-factor wannabes for leaders, who are unable to face the harsh reality that hundreds of thousands of migrants cannot be simply dumped into established societies without causing serious problems for the natives and for the migrants.
The solo run by Merkel will yet establish her as one of the worst political leaders in Europe.
And still, instead of a plan, we're now seeing a panicked reaction, as reality begins to dawn.

An immigration policy should never be a matter of simply walking into a country, regardless of the numbers involved.

The EU has never grown up and consequently it is facing collapse amid the ruins of its own childish, unbending 'principles'.

A message for EU Leaders - "Grow tf up!"
 

JacquesHughes

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2013
Messages
1,122
Austria is not waiting for the European Commission to solve this one.

On 26 April the Austrian parliament passed 'tough' new asylum laws, establishing the government's power to close Austria's borders to many (possibly all; it's a bit unclear) asylum seekers during an influx 'emergency'.
Migrant crisis: Austria passes controversial new asylum law - BBC News

Outraged MEPs in the euro parliament seem to be focussing their opposition on the possibility of Austria building a fence around the Brenner pass entry point (from Italy) in anticipation of this summer's arrivals from Libya.
MEPs urge Juncker to stand against Austria border fence – EurActiv.com
 

Fir Bolg

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 8, 2006
Messages
837
We will continue to have a shambles of an asylum system until we renegotiate or withdraw from the 1952 Refugee Convention which in no way takes into account the ease of international air travel and the freedom of movement in the EU.

Let in:
- people fleeing genocide, war, political persecution or natural disaster in a neighbouring country.

Keep out:
- Nationals of safe countries. This group should be summarily deported and not allowed apply for asylum. The Refugee Convention may be an obstacle here as it bans collective expulsions.

- Sex offenders, drug dealers, weapons traffickers, bank robbers and violent criminals.
This is the only logical solution to the problem. The Geneva convention on refugees is completely out dated and was set up under different climate to accommodate displaced European people within Europe after WW2. It was never intended to import millions of people from different continents into Europe and the resulting chaos that ensues.
 

Analyzer

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
46,277
The EU commisariat in Brussels is presided over by idiots like Big Fill, Jean Caude W@nker etc.

Then you have Merkel + Hollande = Merde.

The consequences are a series of disasters.
 

truthandjustice

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 25, 2011
Messages
1,778
On 26 April the Austrian parliament passed 'tough' new asylum laws, establishing the government's power to close Austria's borders to many (possibly all; it's a bit unclear) asylum seekers during an influx 'emergency'.
Migrant crisis: Austria passes controversial new asylum law - BBC News

Outraged MEPs in the euro parliament seem to be focussing their opposition on the possibility of Austria building a fence around the Brenner pass entry point (from Italy) in anticipation of this summer's arrivals from Libya.
MEPs urge Juncker to stand against Austria border fence – EurActiv.com
Countries such as Greece and Italy don't care about the numbers of new arrivals as the illegal immigrants only want to pass through Italy and Greece. The fact that the Italians and Greeks object to razor wire fences being erected by the Macedonia or Austria government proves this.
 

atkin8

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2012
Messages
1,953
The EU commisariat in Brussels is presided over by idiots like Big Fill, Jean Caude W@nker etc.

Then you have Merkel + Hollande = Merde.

The consequences are a series of disasters.
Not to mention Peter ,Mary and Michael .
 

JacquesHughes

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2013
Messages
1,122
'Unstopable tide of humanity' , now ebbing.
Empty beaches in Lesbos - BBC News

5000 people per day had been risking their lives to land on Lesbos. On a recent day, that number was zero. On another day it was 4. The actions of the Turkish authorities have been effective; more effective than seemed possible one month ago. Will there be a 'water-bed' effect elsewhere?
 

BACKTOBASICS

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 22, 2014
Messages
2,913
Do we not have a shared immigration database with the UK? Surely if they apply here after being refused there, then that should appear on our system?
Without checking, the answer would be no. You are looking for efficiency and forward thinking - that's a bit much to expect - even our local dangerous criminals are not on a database (going on a recent murder case).

The IW quango is another example - spending 80 million and producing a shambles. They did this, despite piggy-backing on an already established and efficient commercial water billing system presently being run by the local authorities.
 
Last edited:

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
51,855
Good to hear that the plan to scrap direct provision is not in the Programme for Government. So long AOR.
 

peader odonnell

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 12, 2007
Messages
3,500
So the never ending appeals keep them in the Direct Provision they say is awful ,what a bunch of chancers.
 

peader odonnell

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 12, 2007
Messages
3,500

peader odonnell

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 12, 2007
Messages
3,500
Thought the judge had a vested interest ,and of course he lives miles from them ,not next door to them like here.
 
Top