Rejoining Commonwealth in return for a United Ireland



Malcolm Redfellow

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No they were not.

There were far more Catholics elected to Stormont than there ever were Protestants elected to the Dail.

The lack of knowledge of the NI electoral system,pre 1969 is quite astounding given the willingness to give opinions on it.
William Grant had been a shipwright (he rose to be minister for labour in the Andrews administration). In 1927 he declared to Stormont that he was one:
who never cared whether there was any Opposition in the House or not. I am glad to see them here, but if they went out of the House today I would have no regrets. I would not care if they never came back again.
Then, in February 1929, Craig introduced his Bill to abolish PR — just three months before the coming election. Sam Kyle, for NILP, knew what was being done. The Bill was:
deliberately designed to favour the Unionist Party in that it will make it all the more difficult for minorities to seek representation.
Along with that went the redrawing of constituencies. It worked: the UUP representation increased to 38, the Nationalists reduced to 11, Labour reduced to one seat, and the two independent Unionists evicted. Democracy in the Six Counties was so thoroughly de-mocked, the thirty-three Stormont seats (over two-thirds) were uncontested.
 
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I assume that excludes all those claiming "no religion", a cohort almost identical to the Protestant decline whilst Catholic numbers have been static for years?
I figured you would latch onto this post - seen as it's almost the 12th I was trying to throw you a line saving you from drowning in the ocean of facts about the NI goverment before the civil rights movement

Don't bite the hand that feeds ya
 

Gin Soaked

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We know enough of our past. As for whether joining the commonwealth is a good Idea? Not sure.

The only justification is a sop to the unionist tradition. Would the commonwealth games stop UVF knacks causing mayhem down south?

In short, we will need enough bribes and sops to contain the Loyalist scumbag fraternity. And is that even possible?

The GFA was underpinned by bribing both sides with jobs for the boys. Stormont has failed precisely because both sides need to have power.

There has been no integration in education. Young graduates in Queens are all post peace process kids yet most were educated separately. We wasted 20 years through cowardice.
 

Barroso

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You can check those stats for yourself.
I did.
There's a nice little list here.
To prove what a corrupt little place it was under the unionist regime, I'll take the Labour party stats.
1933. 8.5% of the votes, 2 seats (4% of seats)
1945. 18.5% of the votes, 2 seats (4% of seats)
1949. 7.1% of the votes, 0 seats (0% of seats)
1962. 25.4 of the votes, 4 seats (8% of seats)
1965. 20.4% of the votes, 2 seats (4% of seats)
These are just some of the starkest results.
While unionism mightn't have wanted any catholics around the place, it is clear that Labour was an equally big enemy and in parliamentary terms came off even worse.
I wonder what your justification for this would be, given that Labour was not an "enemy of the state"?
 

Newrybhoy

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I did.
There's a nice little list here.
To prove what a corrupt little place it was under the unionist regime, I'll take the Labour party stats.
1933. 8.5% of the votes, 2 seats (4% of seats)
1945. 18.5% of the votes, 2 seats (4% of seats)
1949. 7.1% of the votes, 0 seats (0% of seats)
1962. 25.4 of the votes, 4 seats (8% of seats)
1965. 20.4% of the votes, 2 seats (4% of seats)
These are just some of the starkest results.
While unionism mightn't have wanted any catholics around the place, it is clear that Labour was an equally big enemy and in parliamentary terms came off even worse.
I wonder what your justification for this would be, given that Labour was not an "enemy of the state"?
The first past the post system had the same effect on parties to this day.it was and is the UK way. They had a referendum to change it and it failed. Go figure.
 

Malcolm Redfellow

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I did.
There's a nice little list here.
[...]
I wonder what your justification for this would be, given that Labour was not an "enemy of the state"?
I was running through my mental list of NILP and lefty MPs at Stormont, until boredom set in:
  • 1925: Jack Beattie (Belfast E); Sam Kyle (Belfast N); William McMullen (Belfast W);
  • 1929: Jack Beattie (Pottinger);
  • 1933: Jack Beattie (Pottinger: expelled from NILP 1934); Harry Midgley (Dock);
  • 1938: Paddy Agnew (South Armagh)
  • 1941 by-election: Harry Midgley (Willowfield, created his own Commonwealth Labour Party 1942);
  • 1945: Jack Beattie (Pottinger — independent Labour, rejoined NILP in 1949); Hugh Downie (Dock); Robert Getgood (Oldpark); Harry Midgley (Willowfield — Commonwealth Labour);
  • 1946 by-election: Francis Hanna (Belfast Central);
  • 1949: Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour);
  • 1953: Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour); Murtagh Morgan (Dock);
  • 1958: David Bleakley (Victoria); Billy Boyd (Woodvale); Tom Boyd (Pottinger); Harry Diamond (Falls, as Republican Labour); Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark);
  • 1962: David Bleakley (Victoria); Billy Boyd (Woodvale); Tom Boyd (Pottinger); Harry Diamond (Falls, as Republican Labour); Gerry Fitt (Dock); Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark);
  • 1965: Tom Boyd (Pottinger); Harry Diamond (Falls, as Republican Labour); Gerry Fitt (Dock, as Republican Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark);
  • 1969: Paddy Devlin (Falls); Gerry Fitt (Dock, as Republican Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark).
And that's it, unless I missed a hero ...
 

JacquesHughes

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I was running through my mental list of NILP and lefty MPs at Stormont, until boredom set in:
  • 1925: Jack Beattie (Belfast E); Sam Kyle (Belfast N); William McMullen (Belfast W);
  • 1929: Jack Beattie (Pottinger);
  • 1933: Jack Beattie (Pottinger: expelled from NILP 1934); Harry Midgley (Dock);
  • 1938: Paddy Agnew (South Armagh)
  • 1941 by-election: Harry Midgley (Willowfield, created his own Commonwealth Labour Party 1942);
  • 1945: Jack Beattie (Pottinger — independent Labour, rejoined NILP in 1949); Hugh Downie (Dock); Robert Getgood (Oldpark); Harry Midgley (Willowfield — Commonwealth Labour);
  • 1946 by-election: Francis Hanna (Belfast Central);
  • 1949: Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour);
  • 1953: Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour); Murtagh Morgan (Dock);
  • 1958: David Bleakley (Victoria); Billy Boyd (Woodvale); Tom Boyd (Pottinger); Harry Diamond (Falls, as Republican Labour); Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark);
  • 1962: David Bleakley (Victoria); Billy Boyd (Woodvale); Tom Boyd (Pottinger); Harry Diamond (Falls, as Republican Labour); Gerry Fitt (Dock); Francis Hanna (Belfast Central, as independent Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark);
  • 1965: Tom Boyd (Pottinger); Harry Diamond (Falls, as Republican Labour); Gerry Fitt (Dock, as Republican Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark);
  • 1969: Paddy Devlin (Falls); Gerry Fitt (Dock, as Republican Labour); Vivian Simpson (Oldpark).
And that's it, unless I missed a hero ...
Respect, Sir. Anyone who can rattle that list off the top of their head has sacrificed much ( chiefly having a life).
 

JacquesHughes

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History is a nightmare from which I am trying to wake up....not go back into with the Commonwealth.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Still can't find any reference to how much we are being offered.
 

Dame_Enda

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How do nationalists feel about these remarks by former UUP leader Mike Nesbitt? Would a United Ireland result in perpetual coalitions with former Northern Unionists, and how would you feel about that?

Likewise to Unionists, would that reassure you about your rights in a United Ireland?

 

Round tower

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How do nationalists feel about these remarks by former UUP leader Mike Nesbitt? Would a United Ireland result in perpetual coalitions with former Northern Unionists, and how would you feel about that?

Likewise to Unionists, would that reassure you about your rights in a United Ireland?


If the figures shown here was the results of a 32 county GE in Ireland, yes tey would with the DUP and the UUP having a a combined figure of around 40 TD's
 

between the bridges

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How do nationalists feel about these remarks by former UUP leader Mike Nesbitt? Would a United Ireland result in perpetual coalitions with former Northern Unionists, and how would you feel about that?
Well the ra heads would have a fit!! can ye imagine 800 years of moppery ending with a PUL Tánaiste!!!

But the ironic paradox of OWC is that some scenarios are no UI with a SF FM or a UI with Unionists in power...

Likewise to Unionists, would that reassure you about your rights in a United Ireland?
NO, full power sharing, what's good for the gander tis good for the duck...
 
D

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Well the ra heads would have a fit!! can ye imagine 800 years of moppery ending with a PUL Tánaiste!!!

But the ironic paradox of OWC is that some scenarios are no UI with a SF FM or a UI with Unionists in power...



NO, full power sharing, what's good for the gander tis good for the duck...

PUL Tanaiste would be grand - As for the P - lots of great Protestant Irishmen over the years who fought for their country
The UL would no longer be relevant in a UI
 

belcoo666

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Well the ra heads would have a fit!! can ye imagine 800 years of moppery ending with a PUL Tánaiste!!!

But the ironic paradox of OWC is that some scenarios are no UI with a SF FM or a UI with Unionists in power...



NO, full power sharing, what's good for the gander tis good for the duck...
You are more than welcome to power sharing , in Scotland . Stay here and behave nicely or die . Personally i would hope you choose the latter .
 

between the bridges

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You are more than welcome to power sharing , in Scotland . Stay here and behave nicely or die . Personally i would hope you choose the latter .
Oh look at the sophisticated bog hopper wishing people dead on the interweb, anywho is the shoe shop in Belcoo still adding the TGIF* labels?...






*Toes Go In First...
 

Mickeymac

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Well the ra heads would have a fit!! can ye imagine 800 years of moppery ending with a PUL Tánaiste!!!

But the ironic paradox of OWC is that some scenarios are no UI with a SF FM or a UI with Unionists in power...



NO, full power sharing, what's good for the gander tis good for the duck...

Amazing the way sectarian bigots bring one's religion to the fore in such discussion...….I guess you guys can't help it.😁
 

lff12

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Would Southern Irish people be willing to rejoin the Commonwealth as part of a deal to get a United Ireland by consent?

While not a fan of the Commonwealth, I would consider it.

Also same question to NI Catholics and Protestants.
There is more than one question in there.
 


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