Removing the Impending Doom for Ireland in not so easy steps

Malbekh

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2009
Messages
3,012
Moving on from the last thread we had the following synopsis:

  • 3rd highest debt per capita and we have no control over our currency
  • We pay €5bn more every year in interest than 10 years ago even including historic low interest rates
  • These repayments can only go upwards
  • Aging catastrophic demographics with a narrowing tax base
  • Brexit
  • Homogenising corporate taxes at an EU level to further cripple our tax take

Also, kind of forgot to mention that the cost of running this country can also, only go upwards. It's a bit like our health service, a case of diminishing returns. People seem to think that we make our health service better, they could be right, but the political willpower to effect the necessary changes will never be there.

So what you get is diminishing returns owing to a rapidly aging population and that people live longer, and the drugs to keep them living longer increase in cost and amount over time.

_________________________

But today we're going to talk about what can be done to fix these things. I'll outline a list of options that will make people froth at the mouth and call me all sorts of unpleasant things. That's fine by me. I'm not doing this to get attention, I'm doing it because I genuinely feel that this lovely little country is heading to perdition. I want to be to point to this thread when I'm 77 - if I'm still alive - and tell all my fellow citizens I told you so. Again, I will be called a lot of unpleasant things, because no-one likes Mr I TOLD YOU SO.

_________________________

First, some salient points. None of the below is ever going to happen. Regardless of whether there is any merit to my opinions, our culture has successfully brought about the worst political system of all time. Where politicians are hopelessly enmeshed in local politics and use national politics as a megaphone.

We will never have statesmen in this country because no-one is prepared to take the risks outlined below for the good of the nation, as this would mean the political wilderness for both themselves and their party. I would willingly sacrifice myself on the altar of benevolent dictatorship just to put some of these things into reality, knowing that at that time, I would be a pariah in this country, never to get credit for making real hard decisions, and not the forced upon ones we have seen from politicians since 2007.

Second, for the below to work we need it to start happening within the next 5 years. After those 5 years we will have two major problems. The first is that interest rates will have begun to rise eliminating our fiscal space, and the second is that the markets will start to call our bluff by shorting Ireland Inc.

Third, regardless of circumstances and how much I loathe the way the EU has gone from a mutual trading bloc to reduce paperwork and allow free trade and movement, to a federalist approach where one size fits all, and everything is weighted to the bigger countries, we *still* need to retain our membership of the EU and the Euro, on the basis that it is in our long term and economic interests.

__________________________

Shall we begin?

So our first proposal is.....

Borrow more money

Yes, that's right, after moaning about the national debt increasing five-fold in 10 years, I am recommending we borrow more money. Not sure how much, I reckon about €50 billion or so. The thinking behind this is that we need this money to ensure that we can survive about 5 years without having to borrow again from the markets. So this €50 billion can be used to pay off bonds that come up in that 5-year time-frame.

The reason why we need this money is that we require a bomb-proof economy that stops us from being bullied by the EU when we go to stage 2. Borrowing this money contravenes EU fiscal policies as laid down for this country. This is fine as we are going to ignore them. We'll ignore them in much the way the Italians, French and yes, even the Germans ignore fiscal rules when it suited them. Not to mention the recent quantitative easing because remember, the Eurozone will never, ever, print money.

So that's it, 50 billion borrowed, what happens next.

Take the ECB to court

So this involves us taking the ECB to the ECJ on the basis that they blackmailed us - specifically Jean-Claude Trichet - where we agreed to pay back every red cent to the bondholders of our rotten banks (specifically INBS + Anglo) or else have our credit supply cut off. This contradicted the stance of the IMF, who after all, have the actual experience in dealing with bankrupt countries.

As a consequence, this had an inflated effect on out national debt. Don't get me wrong, our national debt would have exploded anyway. We needed to borrow obscene amounts of money just for day-to-day finances. But in foresight and in hindsight, we all knew paying certain bondholders was unreasonable and unfair, the IMF said so, the ECB used threats to enforce their unreasonable position.

In addition, I also feel a case can be made for the punitive interest rates the ECB charged us by way of funding our debt. Interest rates so bad, Noonan was able to go to the markets and replace their high interest rates with far lower market ones.

Lastly, I know we had a restructured deal on the Anglo-Irish promissory note - but it hasn't gone away you know. Olli Rehn made a lot of promises on how Ireland's debt was going to be restructured to make paying it back re-affordable. After all, the ECB has printed around 1 trillion Euro for the purposes of QE. Our debt is small beer, but the principle from the ECB has been that we must pay a price regardless of a moral balance.

So yeah, let's take them to court...

Repayment of Bonds

In the meantime, while we're awaiting judgement from the ECJ, we refuse to pay the interest on any existing bonds bar the ones we just sold (the €50bn). After all, we won't know until the ruling what debts are good in that we should pay them back, and what debts are bad and should never have occurred in the first place.

This will drive all the great and the good in the EU mad. They will be furious with us. They would love to go out of their way and make an example of us, like they did to Greece (regardless of referendums - those are for the little people), or Cyprus or, in the coming months, UK.

Problem is, there's SFA they can do about as we are financially funded for 5 years. Unlike Greece, there's no financial baton they can beat us over. I'm sure we will get subtle and not-so-subtle threats like for example, a non-favourable Brexit, but can it be any worse for us as is already planned? Not to mention that certain EU states like Poland and Hungary are in a very dangerous place for EVER CLOSER UNION. The EU can't afford to have another rogue state sticking up for itself against a bullying majority - this will really spook the markets.

So I'm betting that a compromise can be reached, and this will happen because we are in a position of power because we are the mad Irish with nothing to lose. Our situation is going to be a slow death of a thousand budget cuts, or go out in a blaze of glory. What's more, there's a mechanism for leaving the EU/Euro/Whatever, but there's no mechanism to chuck nations out. We don't want to leave, so what are you going to do about it?

What we want from this is:

  • Removal of debt from INBS + Anglo-Irish + interest from our national debt
  • Acknowledgement that wrongs were done to the State
  • Removal of any threat from our corporate rate of tax or taxing of profits by country and not by origin of company

Which Brings Us To

The 5-year plan we need to short-circuit the country and start again. Briefly, I outline as follows...

1) Embrace technology. We need to go straight to the forefront of the holy trinity of the future of the car industry. That is, Electric Vehicles + Automated Level 4 driving + Car Pooling. By 2040, the national car fleet in most advanced countries will be about 25% of the current stock. People will see cars for what they are, a toxic, money bleeding liability. In order to move to this direction you need to embrace change.

To do this, you need to entice Elon Musk et al. to Ireland and build a car factory here. He also needs to build a solar roof panel factory here (to power the energy for EV's) and he also needs to build a powerwall factory here (to store the energy for the EV's). You need all three to make this succeed. You also need to stop any major road infrastructure as we are approaching peak vehicles, after 2020, volumes will start to decline and the current structure will be more than adequate.

What you need to throw money into is maglev and a fully automated Nav Grid that communicates to all the driver-less cars and makes car journeys what they should be. Automated. Productive. Cost efficient. This is the only way we'll get a proper 21st century transport system in this country where public transport makes sense.

2) Urban/Rural divide. For this we need a program that identifies rural areas that have value. Either as agricultural, scenic, historical, or tourism values. It does need some imagination too. For example, there are a lot of places that were considered dead-ends years ago that have been revived thanks to greenways and the Wild Atlantic Way.

All other places however, are of no consummate measurable value. Thus, they need to fade and wither on the vine. People can continue to live there, but no effort will be made to supply community services such as hospitals, doctors, social services, post offices and so forth. Alternative accommodation can be provided FOC in areas that have a commercial value and a weight of population that requires services in an economic way.

This is a heartless, disgusting Pol Pot reverse that would cause horrible scenes down the length and breadth of this country but needs must. If we want to bring the benefits of the state to the citizens, it has to be done on the basis of best value for money, especially with our challenges over demographics.

3) Major afforestation. With the transfer of the population from rural to increasingly urban areas, the land vacated should be allowed to return to their natural habitat (like 12th century stuff) with vast forests, bogs, marshes and wilderness that allows us to hit our carbon emission targets and also provides a serious tourist draw.

4) Pharmaceutical Sector. Instead of just charging corporation tax of varying joke amounts, we should offer joint ventures in drug research, especially antibiotics. The forthcoming epidemics of diseases resistant to current antibiotics represents a very serious threat to all. This joint strategy where taxes are exchanged for equity in drug research and government investment funds donate hugely to R&D is a win/win not least because in the long-term we get a share of the proceeds.

5) Invest in the public sector. By this I mean pay doctors, nurses, guards, prison officers, teachers etc well above what they are paid now but only on performance. Encouraging the best of us to work in these jobs and paying them exceptionally well if they provide the services required is an absolute priority. The nation can only succeed based on the quality of the future generation, and that is not going to come from the private sector, ever.

6) Euthanasia. Sorry about this, but euthanasia needs to be made legal, so those of us who have an incurable disease or are just tired of living can go with dignity and grace. It also saves an obscene amount of money on medical costs. We need a mechanism that impartially looks at a persons age + medical history + expected lifespan and decides where that hip operation is worthwhile when you're 87 or is chemo is going to prolong your life and provide a measurable benefit. It's harsh, but that's the way it is.

7) Mass immigration. With a declining population you need immigration to make up the shortfall. Something easily sustainable in a country like ours with a low population for the area involved. But we don't want a Merkel-style immigration policy, we need a system that incorporates a multitude of races, ethnicity, colour whatever, as long as they are educated or want to be educated, or want to work. Canada, o Canada is a prime example of what can be done.

CBA on the spell checking and grammar, I'm tired now. These are my thoughts. So shoot me down Pieheads.
 


bagel

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Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
1,379
Interesting. I agree with much of it. Not sure about discontinuing road building though.
 

petro101

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Joined
Jul 4, 2013
Messages
29
Euthanasia? So an old person agrees to be euthanised. They receive a death drug. Then they change their mind at the last second. What's your response to that? Eh? Very slippery slope you're proposing.

Mass immigration? Are you nuts? Why do you think Trump got elected, or Brexit passed? White people are seeing their people and identity diluted and replaced in their own countries and have had enough. And its fools like you who are to blame. Seriously, how ************************************g dare you.
 

Edo

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Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
3,040
Ah Cheer up Malbeth..................go back to 2008-2009 threads on here and look at all the prophets of doom ( including meself it has to be said) and see how things have turned out.................even petrol is cheaper now than then...and Im still waiting for the inflation tidal wave i was promised a decade ago by long departed or renamed posters on this site.................its never really as bad as u think it is (unless you're a Sunderland football fan)

Start making the changes yourself...........little changes every day..............no point waiting for some kamikaze white knight to come over the horizon who is going to change everything.................but you could start by explaining your rain water harvesting system to the neighbours kids and how the planets water cycle works and the rest................little acorns and all that..

perspective and all that..............
 

Sheeple_Waker

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 14, 2017
Messages
388
Euthanasia? So an old person agrees to be euthanised. They receive a death drug. Then they change their mind at the last second. What's your response to that? Eh? Very slippery slope you're proposing.

Mass immigration? Are you nuts? Why do you think Trump got elected, or Brexit passed? White people are seeing their people and identity diluted and replaced in their own countries and have had enough. And its fools like you who are to blame. Seriously, how ************************************g dare you.
What's white identity snowflake?
 

JCR

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Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
6,241
I don't think becoming a financial pariah will solve much myself. Also, I'm pretty sure it was Timothy Geithner who insisted on bondholders being paid back. I don't agree with the narrative that we were bullied into it as much as landed ourselves in it.

As for any other long term plan, we need to invest in tech innovation so that if tax rates do become closer to being aligned we still are attractive to multinationals. We also need to insure people's income is not destroyed by a very strange housing market that doesn't make any sense at all.
 

HarshBuzz

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Joined
Feb 28, 2008
Messages
11,815
Lovely. Go out and borrow 50b but at the same time refuse to pay interest on some existing debt?.

Some. I love that. Some which of the bonds do you think we should stop paying interest on?

Irish Government Bonds | National Treasury Management Agency (NTMA)
Ssssh Samson

Mere practical details matter not to the OP! He's on his high horse and is going to ride it until it drops.

He's right about our political system to be fair.

Paying some of the best-paid and worst-performing PS in the world a lot more....is, errrrr, interesting.
 

GDPR

1
Joined
Jul 5, 2008
Messages
217,782
Borrow more money


Take the ECB to court


Repayment of Bonds


1) Embrace technology.
2) Urban/Rural divide.
3) Major afforestation.
5) Invest in the public sector.
6) Euthanasia.
7) Mass immigration.


Firstly; All ideas are good.
In that thinking about possible solutions is a good thing.

Secondly; Some ideas are also daft, but that comes with the process.


I have one based on merging 3 of your own; Tourism, Afforestation & Euthanasia.

At the point where we have some decent forests, instead of offering a death pill we offer a sporting chance by letting the old codgers loose in the new forest and inviting tourists to a hunt, a free breakfast, full Irish, for every head and a free last but vigorous ride for any old duffer who makes it out the other side, what a way to go eh?
 

Socratus O' Pericles

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Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
32,914
Firstly; All ideas are good.
In that thinking about possible solutions is a good thing.

Secondly; Some ideas are also daft, but that comes with the process.


I have one based on merging 3 of your own; Tourism, Afforestation & Euthanasia.

At the point where we have some decent forests, instead of offering a death pill we offer a sporting chance by letting the old codgers loose in the new forest and inviting tourists to a hunt, a free breakfast, full Irish, for every head and a free last but vigorous ride for any old duffer who makes it out the other side, what a way to go eh?
A sort of latter day Death Race 2000, I like it.
 

Finbar10

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Joined
Dec 3, 2008
Messages
2,556
Firstly; All ideas are good.
In that thinking about possible solutions is a good thing.

Secondly; Some ideas are also daft, but that comes with the process.


I have one based on merging 3 of your own; Tourism, Afforestation & Euthanasia.

At the point where we have some decent forests, instead of offering a death pill we offer a sporting chance by letting the old codgers loose in the new forest and inviting tourists to a hunt, a free breakfast, full Irish, for every head and a free last but vigorous ride for any old duffer who makes it out the other side, what a way to go eh?
Three birds with one stone. Now that's some creative thinking! :) As Socratus alluded to, think of the incredible TV rights also! If nothing else, would distract the populace from grim future dystopian realities ;)
 

GDPR

1
Joined
Jul 5, 2008
Messages
217,782
Three birds with one stone.
I admire your balls Sir, I have to say, but speaking for myself I wouldn't be up to that, not even now and certainly not when I'm on my last legs.

If it could be spread over two weeks now, I might be in with a shout, recovery not being what it used to be.
 
Last edited:

Spirit Of Newgrange

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Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
4,602
didnt iceland tell all their creditors to go jump off a glacier ?
 

Wagmore

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Joined
Sep 17, 2015
Messages
14,098
Moving on from the last thread we had the following synopsis:

  • 3rd highest debt per capita and we have no control over our currency
  • We pay €5bn more every year in interest than 10 years ago even including historic low interest rates
  • These repayments can only go upwards
  • Aging catastrophic demographics with a narrowing tax base
  • Brexit
  • Homogenising corporate taxes at an EU level to further cripple our tax take

Also, kind of forgot to mention that the cost of running this country can also, only go upwards. It's a bit like our health service, a case of diminishing returns. People seem to think that we make our health service better, they could be right, but the political willpower to effect the necessary changes will never be there.

So what you get is diminishing returns owing to a rapidly aging population and that people live longer, and the drugs to keep them living longer increase in cost and amount over time.

_________________________

But today we're going to talk about what can be done to fix these things. I'll outline a list of options that will make people froth at the mouth and call me all sorts of unpleasant things. That's fine by me. I'm not doing this to get attention, I'm doing it because I genuinely feel that this lovely little country is heading to perdition. I want to be to point to this thread when I'm 77 - if I'm still alive - and tell all my fellow citizens I told you so. Again, I will be called a lot of unpleasant things, because no-one likes Mr I TOLD YOU SO.

_________________________

First, some salient points. None of the below is ever going to happen. Regardless of whether there is any merit to my opinions, our culture has successfully brought about the worst political system of all time. Where politicians are hopelessly enmeshed in local politics and use national politics as a megaphone.

We will never have statesmen in this country because no-one is prepared to take the risks outlined below for the good of the nation, as this would mean the political wilderness for both themselves and their party. I would willingly sacrifice myself on the altar of benevolent dictatorship just to put some of these things into reality, knowing that at that time, I would be a pariah in this country, never to get credit for making real hard decisions, and not the forced upon ones we have seen from politicians since 2007.

Second, for the below to work we need it to start happening within the next 5 years. After those 5 years we will have two major problems. The first is that interest rates will have begun to rise eliminating our fiscal space, and the second is that the markets will start to call our bluff by shorting Ireland Inc.

Third, regardless of circumstances and how much I loathe the way the EU has gone from a mutual trading bloc to reduce paperwork and allow free trade and movement, to a federalist approach where one size fits all, and everything is weighted to the bigger countries, we *still* need to retain our membership of the EU and the Euro, on the basis that it is in our long term and economic interests.

__________________________

Shall we begin?

So our first proposal is.....

Borrow more money

Yes, that's right, after moaning about the national debt increasing five-fold in 10 years, I am recommending we borrow more money. Not sure how much, I reckon about €50 billion or so. The thinking behind this is that we need this money to ensure that we can survive about 5 years without having to borrow again from the markets. So this €50 billion can be used to pay off bonds that come up in that 5-year time-frame.

The reason why we need this money is that we require a bomb-proof economy that stops us from being bullied by the EU when we go to stage 2. Borrowing this money contravenes EU fiscal policies as laid down for this country. This is fine as we are going to ignore them. We'll ignore them in much the way the Italians, French and yes, even the Germans ignore fiscal rules when it suited them. Not to mention the recent quantitative easing because remember, the Eurozone will never, ever, print money.

So that's it, 50 billion borrowed, what happens next.

Take the ECB to court

So this involves us taking the ECB to the ECJ on the basis that they blackmailed us - specifically Jean-Claude Trichet - where we agreed to pay back every red cent to the bondholders of our rotten banks (specifically INBS + Anglo) or else have our credit supply cut off. This contradicted the stance of the IMF, who after all, have the actual experience in dealing with bankrupt countries.

As a consequence, this had an inflated effect on out national debt. Don't get me wrong, our national debt would have exploded anyway. We needed to borrow obscene amounts of money just for day-to-day finances. But in foresight and in hindsight, we all knew paying certain bondholders was unreasonable and unfair, the IMF said so, the ECB used threats to enforce their unreasonable position.

In addition, I also feel a case can be made for the punitive interest rates the ECB charged us by way of funding our debt. Interest rates so bad, Noonan was able to go to the markets and replace their high interest rates with far lower market ones.

Lastly, I know we had a restructured deal on the Anglo-Irish promissory note - but it hasn't gone away you know. Olli Rehn made a lot of promises on how Ireland's debt was going to be restructured to make paying it back re-affordable. After all, the ECB has printed around 1 trillion Euro for the purposes of QE. Our debt is small beer, but the principle from the ECB has been that we must pay a price regardless of a moral balance.

So yeah, let's take them to court...

Repayment of Bonds

In the meantime, while we're awaiting judgement from the ECJ, we refuse to pay the interest on any existing bonds bar the ones we just sold (the €50bn). After all, we won't know until the ruling what debts are good in that we should pay them back, and what debts are bad and should never have occurred in the first place.

This will drive all the great and the good in the EU mad. They will be furious with us. They would love to go out of their way and make an example of us, like they did to Greece (regardless of referendums - those are for the little people), or Cyprus or, in the coming months, UK.

Problem is, there's SFA they can do about as we are financially funded for 5 years. Unlike Greece, there's no financial baton they can beat us over. I'm sure we will get subtle and not-so-subtle threats like for example, a non-favourable Brexit, but can it be any worse for us as is already planned? Not to mention that certain EU states like Poland and Hungary are in a very dangerous place for EVER CLOSER UNION. The EU can't afford to have another rogue state sticking up for itself against a bullying majority - this will really spook the markets.

So I'm betting that a compromise can be reached, and this will happen because we are in a position of power because we are the mad Irish with nothing to lose. Our situation is going to be a slow death of a thousand budget cuts, or go out in a blaze of glory. What's more, there's a mechanism for leaving the EU/Euro/Whatever, but there's no mechanism to chuck nations out. We don't want to leave, so what are you going to do about it?

What we want from this is:

  • Removal of debt from INBS + Anglo-Irish + interest from our national debt
  • Acknowledgement that wrongs were done to the State
  • Removal of any threat from our corporate rate of tax or taxing of profits by country and not by origin of company

Which Brings Us To

The 5-year plan we need to short-circuit the country and start again. Briefly, I outline as follows...

1) Embrace technology. We need to go straight to the forefront of the holy trinity of the future of the car industry. That is, Electric Vehicles + Automated Level 4 driving + Car Pooling. By 2040, the national car fleet in most advanced countries will be about 25% of the current stock. People will see cars for what they are, a toxic, money bleeding liability. In order to move to this direction you need to embrace change.

To do this, you need to entice Elon Musk et al. to Ireland and build a car factory here. He also needs to build a solar roof panel factory here (to power the energy for EV's) and he also needs to build a powerwall factory here (to store the energy for the EV's). You need all three to make this succeed. You also need to stop any major road infrastructure as we are approaching peak vehicles, after 2020, volumes will start to decline and the current structure will be more than adequate.

What you need to throw money into is maglev and a fully automated Nav Grid that communicates to all the driver-less cars and makes car journeys what they should be. Automated. Productive. Cost efficient. This is the only way we'll get a proper 21st century transport system in this country where public transport makes sense.

2) Urban/Rural divide. For this we need a program that identifies rural areas that have value. Either as agricultural, scenic, historical, or tourism values. It does need some imagination too. For example, there are a lot of places that were considered dead-ends years ago that have been revived thanks to greenways and the Wild Atlantic Way.

All other places however, are of no consummate measurable value. Thus, they need to fade and wither on the vine. People can continue to live there, but no effort will be made to supply community services such as hospitals, doctors, social services, post offices and so forth. Alternative accommodation can be provided FOC in areas that have a commercial value and a weight of population that requires services in an economic way.

This is a heartless, disgusting Pol Pot reverse that would cause horrible scenes down the length and breadth of this country but needs must. If we want to bring the benefits of the state to the citizens, it has to be done on the basis of best value for money, especially with our challenges over demographics.

3) Major afforestation. With the transfer of the population from rural to increasingly urban areas, the land vacated should be allowed to return to their natural habitat (like 12th century stuff) with vast forests, bogs, marshes and wilderness that allows us to hit our carbon emission targets and also provides a serious tourist draw.

4) Pharmaceutical Sector. Instead of just charging corporation tax of varying joke amounts, we should offer joint ventures in drug research, especially antibiotics. The forthcoming epidemics of diseases resistant to current antibiotics represents a very serious threat to all. This joint strategy where taxes are exchanged for equity in drug research and government investment funds donate hugely to R&D is a win/win not least because in the long-term we get a share of the proceeds.

5) Invest in the public sector. By this I mean pay doctors, nurses, guards, prison officers, teachers etc well above what they are paid now but only on performance. Encouraging the best of us to work in these jobs and paying them exceptionally well if they provide the services required is an absolute priority. The nation can only succeed based on the quality of the future generation, and that is not going to come from the private sector, ever.

6) Euthanasia. Sorry about this, but euthanasia needs to be made legal, so those of us who have an incurable disease or are just tired of living can go with dignity and grace. It also saves an obscene amount of money on medical costs. We need a mechanism that impartially looks at a persons age + medical history + expected lifespan and decides where that hip operation is worthwhile when you're 87 or is chemo is going to prolong your life and provide a measurable benefit. It's harsh, but that's the way it is.

7) Mass immigration. With a declining population you need immigration to make up the shortfall. Something easily sustainable in a country like ours with a low population for the area involved. But we don't want a Merkel-style immigration policy, we need a system that incorporates a multitude of races, ethnicity, colour whatever, as long as they are educated or want to be educated, or want to work. Canada, o Canada is a prime example of what can be done.

CBA on the spell checking and grammar, I'm tired now. These are my thoughts. So shoot me down Pieheads.
Just what the country needs-crackpot ideas from a godless Green fanatic.Bet you'd love a dictatorship-only way your crew of neurotic hysterics will ever get in power again.Are you Eamon Ryan in disguise
 

Malbekh

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2009
Messages
3,012
Hello Edo.

It's nice to see you again. I hope you and yours are well. I don't get down about this, it's as inevitable as death and taxes. So I make the most of things as they are. It's the kids I worry about.
 

Malbekh

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2009
Messages
3,012
Just what the country needs-crackpot ideas from a godless Green fanatic.Bet you'd love a dictatorship-only way your crew of neurotic hysterics will ever get in power again.Are you Eamon Ryan in disguise
No indeed I am not, thanks for your insightful comments. Allow me to give you a handy tip. Rather than just C&P the OP - particularly a very wordy one, why not edit it down to the top sentence, delete the rest and just put in the word ''snip''. Makes things much easier for everyone before we move onto your wise and erudite comments.
 


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