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Resolved: The U.S. Lacks the Political Will to Outlaw Assault Weapons


Troy_337

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In 1855, a study conducted by Edward Jarvis concluded that, "the pauper class furnishes in ratio of its numbers, 64 times as many cases of insanity as the independent class." *

In light of recent catastrophic massacres in America it's now reasonable to conclude that learned helplessness is a feature of the collective American psyche thus preventing legislation designed to limit arms sales to a paranoid population.


[video=youtube;3XfqV0cnoq0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XfqV0cnoq0[/video]






*Edward Jarvis, M.D. (1803-1884)
Edward Jarvis may be called the first American psychiatric epidemiologist. He became a leading authority on vital statistics in the U.S. during the period 1850 to 1870.

Jarvis was born in Massachusetts and educated at Harvard (M.D., 1830). In 1840, at the request of educator Horace Mann, he published a book on health for use in schools, Practical Physiology for the Use of Schools and Families (Philadelphia, 1848) which was later translated into a number of languages, including Japanese.
Jarvis had studied the Federal Census for 1840 and found errors relating to the counting of mentally ill persons.

He became a member of the existing American Statistical Society and president for many years, and on behalf of the Society, he wrote a petition to Congress to revise procedures for gathering census data, entitled "Statistics of insanity in the U.S." (Boston Medical & Surgical Journal, v. 27, September 21, 1842). He later served as a consultant to the Census Bureau for the 1850, 1860, and 1870 census activities.

In 1860, Jarvis was an official delegate for the Statistical Society to an International Statistical meeting in England and visited asylums there. Psychiatric historian Gerald Grob wrote, "Jarvis contributed to a newer synthesis that merged medicine, morality and social science." (G. Grob, Edward Jarvis and the Medical World, Knoxville: Univ. of Tennessee Press, 1978, p. 221).
 
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Eire1976

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In 1855, a study conducted by Edward Jarvis concluded that, "the pauper class furnishes in ratio of its numbers, 64 times as many cases of insanity as the independent class."

In light of recent catastrophic massacres in America it's now reasonable to conclude that learned helplessness is a feature of the collective American psyche thus preventing legislation designed to limit arms sales to a paranoid population.
It's been said for some time that all these gun shootings are being cynicially used by certian interests in the US to bring in leglislation to outlaw personal weapons.

But all this will do will open up the legitimate good citizen to the whims of fully armed criminals who can always get weapons.
 

Analyzer

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Are they banned in this country ?

I wonder what the gardai would do in any case to implement such a ban.....
 

Levellers

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It's been said for some time that all these gun shootings are being cynicially used by certian interests in the US to bring in leglislation to outlaw personal weapons.

But all this will do will open up the legitimate good citizen to the whims of fully armed criminals who can always get weapons.
All these massacres have been carried out with legally held weapons. No bank robber, drug dealer, crook has gone on a rampage.

And your guns-for-defence argument. How come no spree killer has ever been stopped by a gun-toting civilian?
 

Hitch 22

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The weapon used in the Connecticut shooting was NOT an assault rifle.

A M-16 assault rifle used by the U.S. military is capable of semi-automatic fire (one bullet fire for every trigger squeeze), three round burst and fully automatic (the 30-round magazine used up if the trigger is held down).

The Bushmaster .223 meanwhile is solely a semi-automatic rifle which is why it is legal for civilian use.
 

cnocpm

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The weapon used in the Connecticut shooting was NOT an assault rifle.

A M-16 assault rifle used by the U.S. military is capable of semi-automatic fire (one bullet fire for every trigger squeeze), three round burst and fully automatic (the 30-round magazine used up if the trigger is held down).

The Bushmaster .223 meanwhile is solely a semi-automatic rifle which is why it is legal for civilian use.
If my child was shot multiple times with a .223 in a classroom,you can play verbal gymnastics all day long,I'll consider it ASSAULT with a deadly weapon.
 

seabhcan

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The weapon used in the Connecticut shooting was NOT an assault rifle.

A M-16 assault rifle used by the U.S. military is capable of semi-automatic fire (one bullet fire for every trigger squeeze), three round burst and fully automatic (the 30-round magazine used up if the trigger is held down).

The Bushmaster .223 meanwhile is solely a semi-automatic rifle which is why it is legal for civilian use.
Why are M-16s restricted? Surely that is unconstitutional.
 

Hitch 22

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All these massacres have been carried out with legally held weapons. No bank robber, drug dealer, crook has gone on a rampage.
In February 1997, two armed criminals clad in body armor and armed with two modified Norinco Type 56 S rifles, a modified Norinco Type 56 S-1, a semi automatic HK91, a modified Bushmaster Dissipator and 9mm Beretta Model 92FS INOX and thousands of rounds of ammunition took on scores of LAPD police officers, wounding eleven police and seven civilians before one was fatally wounded and the other was wounded and then took his own life.

The LAPD were armed mostly with 9mm handguns and they were only able to defeat the criminals when they took rifles and ammo from a gunstore. Since then LAPD officers armed themselves with heavier calibre pistols and also keep a semiautomatic rifle as a back up.

And your guns-for-defence argument. How come no spree killer has ever been stopped by a gun-toting civilian?
Spree killers HAVE been stopped by gun-totting civilians.

It was January 16, 2002 when Peter Odighizuwa came to campus. He had been suspended due to failing grades. Odighizuwa was angry and waving a gun calling on students to “come get me”. The students, seeing the gun, ran. A shooting spree started almost immediately. In seconds Odighizuwa had killed the school dean, a professor and one student. Three other students were shot as well, one in the chest, one in the stomach and one in the throat.

Many students heard the shots. Two who did were Mikael Gross and Tracy Bridges. Mikael was outside the school having just returned to campus from lunch when he heard the shots. Tracy was inside attending class. Both immediately ran to their cars. Each had a handgun locked in the vehicle.

Bridges pulled a .357 Magnum pistol and he later said he was prepared to shoot to kill if necessary. He and Gross both approached Odighizuwa at the same time from different directions. Both were pointing their weapons at him. Bridges yelled for Odighizuwa to drop his weapon. When the shooter realized they had the drop on him he threw his weapon down.
Classically Liberal: When mass killers meet armed resistance.

Now consider what happened in Virginia Tech.

Consider the horrific events at Virginia Tech. Again an armed man enters a “gun free zone”. He kills two victims and walks away long before the police arrive. He spends two hours on campus, doing what is unknown. He then enters another building on campus and begins shooting. He never encounters a police officer during this. And all the students and faculty present had apparently complied with the “no gun” policy of the university. So no one stopped him. NO ONE STOPPED HIM! And when he finished his shooting spree 32 people were dead. It was the killer who ended the spree. He took his own life and when the police arrived all they dealt with were the dead.
 

Ulster-Lad

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Ulster-Lad

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Why are M-16s restricted? Surely that is unconstitutional.
They are not restricted. Any fully automatic rifle, which the M-16 is, requires a Class 3 Federal Firearms Licence (FFL).
 

seabhcan

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In February 1997, two armed criminals clad in body armor and armed with two modified Norinco Type 56 S rifles, a modified Norinco Type 56 S-1, a semi automatic HK91, a modified Bushmaster Dissipator and 9mm Beretta Model 92FS INOX and thousands of rounds of ammunition took on scores of LAPD police officers, wounding eleven police and seven civilians before one was fatally wounded and the other was wounded and then took his own life.

The LAPD were armed mostly with 9mm handguns and they were only able to defeat the criminals when they took rifles and ammo from a gunstore. Since then LAPD officers armed themselves with heavier calibre pistols and also keep a semiautomatic rifle as a back up.



Spree killers HAVE been stopped by gun-totting civilians.



Classically Liberal: When mass killers meet armed resistance.

Now consider what happened in Virginia Tech.
Society as an arms race
 

Hitch 22

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If my child was shot multiple times with a .223 in a classroom,you can play verbal gymnastics all day long,I'll consider it ASSAULT with a deadly weapon.
A .22lr rifle commonly used to kill rabbits in Ireland could have killed all those kids just as easy.
.22lr weapons are legal in Ireland and is anybody considering banning them?
How about 12-gauge shotguns?
If you were a nutjob like Adam Lanza you could kill as many people as you wanted to in Ireland with legally held hunting weapons.
If there were no guns a killer could use a knife.
It would not be that difficult at all to stab a teacher and her entire class to death with a typical kitchen knife.
You could alternatively go to a petrol station and fill a few containers and toss them into the confines of a classroom and burn them alive.

Banning assault weapons will not stop mass murder.
 
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Tawdy

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A .22lr rifle commonly used to kill rabbits in Ireland could have killed all those kids just as easy.
.22lr weapons are legal in Ireland and is anybody considering banning them?
How about 12-gauge shotguns?
If you were a nutjob like Adam Lanza you could kill as many people as you wanted to in Ireland with legally held hunting weapons.
If there were no guns a killer could use a knife.
It would not be that difficult at all to stab a teacher and her entire class to death with a typical kitchen knife.
You could alternatively go to a petrol station and fill a few containers and toss them into the confines of a classroom and burn them alive.

Banning assault weapons will not stop mass murder.

But it will be a significant start!
 

emulator

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The weapon used in the Connecticut shooting was NOT an assault rifle.

A M-16 assault rifle used by the U.S. military is capable of semi-automatic fire (one bullet fire for every trigger squeeze), three round burst and fully automatic (the 30-round magazine used up if the trigger is held down).

The Bushmaster .223 meanwhile is solely a semi-automatic rifle which is why it is legal for civilian use.
Hitch

You really need to get out and about.... all this survivalist Guns&Ammo shíte will rot your head.

Get out and get a girlfriend....
 

Hitch 22

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But it will be a significant start!
There are hundreds of millions of guns in circulation. Gun laws aren't worth the paper they are written on. All they do is put obstacles in the way of law abiding civilians to protect themselves.
 

Tawdy

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There are hundreds of millions of guns in circulation. Gun laws aren't worth the paper they are written on. All they do is put obstacles in the way of law abiding civilians to protect themselves.


Nothing, absolutely nothing excuses the violence used by any armed person against any unarmed person. It is time for the guns to be taken from those that hold them. Let the authorites do thier jobs. Invoke the laws you say are not worth the paper they are written on. Make new laws. Get the guns away, put temption out of the way for all and for all time.
 
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