Road Rage Man Dies

captainwillard

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The guy who was a victim of road rage in leafy Sandymount of all places has died. Surely this deserves some moral outrage.
 


Irelands Call

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Nothing to do with Sandymount, it says he was local but he had to be from Irishtown or Ringsend going on his behaviour plus he had a Hurley in his boot.
 

Fr John Murphy

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The full story here is more complex than "road rage". The victim drank 10 pints of Guinness before gettin behind the wheel of a large 4x4. He intimidated the killer, eventually blocking him after an altercation. The killer had his 18 month old daughter in his car. The guys who recently kicked a Polish man to death "for a buzz" got 12 and 9 years - somw years suspended.

Hitting someone in the head with a hurley is obviously a crime. Although they both drove away, damage was inflicted as the victim
died a few days later. But is there not SOME difference in moral quality that should mean the sentences are different? The Polish man's killers went looking fir trouble and literally smashes their victim's head in. The victim in the Sandymount killing was a drunk and aggressive driver and the killer doesn't seem to have sought out trouble.

We can all agree the killing was wrong. But does anyone think he should get a heavier sentenxe than the Polish man's killers - which is what has happened?
 

amsterdemmetje

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The full story here is more complex than "road rage". The victim drank 10 pints of Guinness before gettin behind the wheel of a large 4x4. He intimidated the killer, eventually blocking him after an altercation. The killer had his 18 month old daughter in his car. The guys who recently kicked a Polish man to death "for a buzz" got 12 and 9 years - somw years suspended.

Hitting someone in the head with a hurley is obviously a crime. Although they both drove away, damage was inflicted as the victim
died a few days later. But is there not SOME difference in moral quality that should mean the sentences are different? The Polish man's killers went looking fir trouble and literally smashes their victim's head in. The victim in the Sandymount killing was a drunk and aggressive driver and the killer doesn't seem to have sought out trouble.

We can all agree the killing was wrong. But does anyone think he should get a heavier sentenxe than the Polish man's killers - which is what has happened?
A Hurley can be a deadly weapon especially when you repeatedly hit someone on the head with it. I have no sympathy for the guy hitting another human being with a weapon like that is an act of savagery and cowardice. Did he think it would make him a better man in the eyes of his daughter who was in the back seat. This guy was a coward and a thug and justice has been served.
 

MrPanda

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Given the circumstances - I think the sentence was very harsh.

e.g Eamonn Lillis got a lighter sentence despite pleading not guilty and trying to blame someone else

Hopefully sentence is reduced upon appeal.
 

Fr John Murphy

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I agree but I'm asking whether these guys should get 9 years:

Three jailed for 'savage' killing - The Irish Times - Fri, Mar 30, 2012

with one having a concurrent sentence for another crime and one having 3 years suspended.....

And this guy gets 12:

Man jailed over road rage killing - The Irish Times - Mon, Apr 23, 2012

?

I realise this will be misinterpreted as not seeing the "road rage" killing as serious. It is serious. Hr killed a man with a hurley. I get that. But my suspicion is that if he were a lawyer, doctor, dentist or other professional, as opposed to a crane driver, there'd be people pointing to the sentence as harsh when you look at other manslaughter sentences handed down.
 

Lonewolfe

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Given the circumstances - I think the sentence was very harsh.

e.g Eamonn Lillis got a lighter sentence despite pleading not guilty and trying to blame someone else

Hopefully sentence is reduced upon appeal.
Reduced? He hit the man in the head 8 times with a hurley stick. That's murder.
He got off lightly.
 

amsterdemmetje

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Given the circumstances - I think the sentence was very harsh.

e.g Eamonn Lillis got a lighter sentence despite pleading not guilty and trying to blame someone else

Hopefully sentence is reduced upon appeal.
We know what the circumstances were.The poor man who was killed didnt get out of his car with an axe or a wheel brace in his hand did he. The fact that he was well over the limit does not excuses the over reaction of the man who killed him.He battered him about the head with a hurl and as far as i know he was the one who was sober. Jesus Christ think about it for a minute ,your child is in the car and your beating a man to death in broad daylight for no reason other than road rage.
 

Fr John Murphy

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Where did it say he hit him 8 times in the head? Link? Haven't seen that level of detail about the attack.
 

Lonewolfe

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Where did it say he hit him 8 times in the head? Link? Haven't seen that level of detail about the attack.
It was on RTE radio this evening. He admitted to his girlfriend that he hit the man about 8 times in the head.

So, perhaps the one that knocked him to the ground then 7 more.
 

DuineEile

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The man who died brought his trouble on himself. Blind drunk and aggressive and behind the wheel of a car. Nevertheless, beating someone with a Hurley is the act of a savage. I question the leniency of other sentences, but think the sentencing here was about right. The man died after all.

D
 

Sync

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Where did it say he hit him 8 times in the head? Link? Haven't seen that level of detail about the attack.
The link you provided says "several".

Man facing jail for fatal road rage hurley attack on motorist - The Irish Times - Tue, Apr 17, 2012

Ms Kennedy told the court that witnesses said Donohoe looked “possessed” as he hit the car and then attacked Mr Bates at the junction of Sandymount Road and Tritonville Road on September 26th, 2010.He was hitting the victim’s car “in a menacing way” for two to three minutes before Mr Bates got out with his hands raised above him. He was struck several times, falling to the ground, while Donohoe shouted and swore aggressively.

Mr Bates and Donohoe – who was on bail at the time for arson and criminal damage over a family dispute – drove away from the scene and a witness reported the assault to the Garda.

Det Garda Barry Walsh, Irishtown Garda station, said that when Donohoe was interviewed the day after the assault, he said: “I hope he f***ing dies, he got what he deserves.”
No remorse, brutal attack, sentence seems fine.
 

Lonewolfe

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Where did it say he hit him 8 times in the head? Link? Haven't seen that level of detail about the attack.
Can't find a link on it just now. You could always listen back to DriveTime on RTÉ Radio

Here's something from the RTE news website:

When Mr Bates got out of his car, Donohue hit him on the left side of his head with the hurley and he fell to the ground.

A witness said Donohue was like a man possessed and continued to hit Mr Bates on the head while he lay on the ground.
 

Fr John Murphy

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I'll listen back to Drivetime. Surpeised it hasn't got more coverage. The sentencing system in this country is hard to understand.
 

stoichkov

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this sentence is not wrong. the sentences given to the two toerags who helped their friend to kill lukasz rzeszutko are wrong.
 

mr_anderson

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The full story here is more complex than "road rage". The victim drank 10 pints of Guinness before gettin behind the wheel of a large 4x4.
The problem for me is, before the whole series of events began, the 'victim' should not have been behind the wheel to begin with.
Yes, he in no way deserved to die, but he lit the fuse and so, in my mind, is at least partly responsible.

If a sober driver is exceeding the speed limit and ploughs into a drunk driver, killing him, who is to blame... the driver who is going too fast, or the driver who shouldn't be on the road in the first instance ?


IMO, blame has to be shared.
 

theloner

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I could understand a slap on the arse or even a clip round the ear with a hurling stick if a boozed up moron was acting the pillock in his 4x4 and I felt intimidated or threatened whilst going about my own business, accompanied by my daughter. However, killing a boozed up moron with excessive force calls into question the attackers temper and judgement. All of my understanding and sympathy for the first victim of this incident (the attacker) goes out the window by the third of forth swing of his hurley stick, particularly with the daughter a witness to it.

P.S. Holy smokes, just noticed when reading the link it's 395 Euro for a yearly subscription to the Irish Times, who the hell does that?
 

amsterdemmetje

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The problem for me is, before the whole series of events began, the 'victim' should not have been behind the wheel to begin with.
Yes, he in no way deserved to die, but he lit the fuse and so, in my mind, is at least partly responsible.

If a sober driver is exceeding the speed limit and ploughs into a drunk driver, killing him, who is to blame... the driver who is going too fast, or the driver who shouldn't be on the road in the first instance ?


IMO, blame has to be shared.
Who do you think acted worse,the man who is dead or the man who beat him to death?.The killer is in jail now, his life ,his family's life and the family of the victim ruined.All because of a moment of madness we are told. Ive had incidents on the road, moments where i wish to god you could get out of yer car and give a guy a piece of yer mind, but it passes in a flash. This guy took the time to arm himself with a hurl and beat a guy senseless, while his child was sitting in the car.To me there is only one person to blame for the victims death, the guy who swung the hurl 8 times on an another mans head.
 


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