Roll Over Leo bullied into paying back Anglo bondholders


SPN

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Hang on a second, our credit rating WAS destroyed.
Because;

a) We were spending 150% of tax revenues, three years later, and had no plan to balance the books.

b) As asset prices kept collapsing, the losses on the balance sheets of the banks got bigger, wiping out more risk capital, leaving a bigger hole for the state to fill. You will recall that we borrowed €2.5 Billion from the Troika to cover the estimated hole as at the end of 2010, but we also had access to an additional €15 Billion from the Troika if there were any more losses that needed to be replaced.

c) The markets weren't keen on European Sovereign Bonds at that time because Angela Merkel was talking about making them significantly more risky to buy.

Any one of those problems, on their own, would have caused problems, but the three of them together was a perfect storm (of our own making - see FFailure ponzi scheme economics circa 2002-2007)
 

SPN

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It was damaged to a point that made borrowing at sustainable rates impossible for us - I wouldn't call that destroyed, as we never hit junk status or went as far down as countries who showed little or no inclination to fix their deficits,
FG/AmateurFF ran up €65 Billion of excessive deficits in 2011, 2012 and 2013.

I'm not aware of any other Government in the first world that was able to run up such massive deficits in such a short period of time, never mind a goverment that was able to rack up such monumental deficits just to fund current spending (keeping the tough filled for the insiders).




More to the point is that had FG started picking and choosing which debts it suited them to service on taking office, we'd have been right down there with the junk brigade in jig time.
Most of the outstanding bonds were under UK law. FG could do nothing, even if it might have been within the terms of the October 12th 2008 meeting of the EU Council of Ministers. Only a UK High Court Judge could decide whether the bonds were liable to be repaid or not.



Mind you it would've prevented the housing crisis.
FG ran deficits totalling close to €100 Billion since coming to power in 2011.

The interest paid on all this borrowing (just the interest) would fix the housing crisis, the water infrastructure crisis, and make a good start on fixing the climate change crisis, but FG chose to píss the borrowed money away on current spending instead.
 

venusian

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So... we have threads on imaginary "invasions" and warped, US politics...

Taoiseach rejects ‘roll over Leo’ claim in Anglo bondholder payout row

...but none on our own Government giving bust-bank gamblers their money back after losing it on a scam.

Between this and endorsing the actions of KBC and the UVF, the Blueshirts and their enablers in FF and the fake left have signed their death warrant.

Discuss.
Why do you imagine that Vacuous Windbag Varadkar was bullied? FFG's track record and Leo the political liar par excellance, support and utterances in the Dail has only given aid and succor to gangster banksters and foreign vulture funds along with their thug henchmen :mad2:

Here's is two faced Leo in action "not another cent"
[video=youtube;WQrhBIuSCmM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQrhBIuSCmM[/video]
 

bonkers

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It was damaged to a point that made borrowing at sustainable rates impossible for us - I wouldn't call that destroyed, as we never hit junk status or went as far down as countries who showed little or no inclination to fix their deficits, but it's a relatively moot point. More to the point is that had FG started picking and choosing which debts it suited them to service on taking office, we'd have been right down there with the junk brigade in jig time.

Mind you it would've prevented the housing crisis.
Your corrupt party knew, yet again, how to look after Denis O Brien.
 

bonkers

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You can't pick and choose which debts appeal to you and which ones don't when you go into government, you know. Anyway such a policy would, if implemented, have destroyed our credit rating, led to the ending of ELA from the ECB which was keeping our banks and by extension our economy afloat by lending short term money to them at low rates in order to fix their balance sheets, let to much higher interest charges on our debt, would have let to much greater cutbacks and much steeper "austerity". Oh, and a full banking collapse.

The annoying thing about this is that you know all that. You're not stupid, but every so often it suits you to pretend to be.
There was no austerity for FGs friends. No doubt you were one of them.
 

devoutcapitalist

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The bank crash wasn't the fault of the ordinary people, who comprise the state.

The bailout, totaling 440bn from 16 countries, was forced on us. All that was needed was for bondholders to take their losses, and for government to increase taxes on wealth, corporations and high-income earners.

We got no referendum or say in having this loan on makey-uppy gambling losses forced on us.
Your proposal to increase taxes on wealth, higher income earners and corporations would have 1) Likely resulted in an exodus of wealthy peopke leaving Ireland and 2) Corporations leaving Ireland. This would have decimated the tax base as there would be less tax revenue to pay for services and welfare recipients.

As for Varadkar he's a spoofer and talked a good game in opposition.
 

Fr. Ted Crilly

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Why do you imagine that Vacuous Windbag Varadkar was bullied? FFG's track record and Leo the political liar par excellance, support and utterances in the Dail has only given aid and succor to gangster banksters and foreign vulture funds along with their thug henchmen :mad2:

Here's is two faced Leo in action "not another cent"
[video=youtube;WQrhBIuSCmM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQrhBIuSCmM[/video]
Seemingly he never said that!
 

Polybius

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The Irish people have been defeated. Totally ground down by years of lies and disappointment. We don't even get angry about the state of our health service anymore. A hospital going 3 times over budget, sure what can you do? The housing situation would cause riots in other countries but the Irish have come to passively accept it. Our island is quickly being turned into a globalised multicultural rock run for the benefit of the super rich and we just accept it - it's not worth objecting and being called a bigot by the quangos and IT journalists. The politicians and media try to distract us from the country's enormous debts, loss of sovereignty and terrible public services by focusing us on LGBTQ and feminist stuff. So you can't afford a decent home? Not to worry here's Zappone and Bacik navel gazing about how we need more female stockbrokers and CEOs.

Leo is the perfect leader for this new Irish politics - a vacuous posh boy puppet for the bankers and Brussels bureaucrats. He hasn't a patriotic bone in his body so doesn't care what happens to Ireland in the long run. He has no children so doesn't care about the next generation. Squabbling about who paid for the drinks for his entourage at a Kylie concert is what preoccupies this airhead.
 

Fr. Ted Crilly

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The Irish people have been defeated. Totally ground down by years of lies and disappointment. We don't even get angry about the state of our health service anymore. A hospital going 3 times over budget, sure what can you do? The housing situation would cause riots in other countries but the Irish have come to passively accept it. Our island is quickly being turned into a globalised multicultural rock run for the benefit of the super rich and we just accept it - it's not worth objecting and being called a bigot by the quangos and IT journalists. The media try to distract us from the country's enormous debts, loss of sovereignty and terrible public services by focusing us on LGBTQ and feminist stuff.

Leo is the perfect leader for this new Irish politics - a vacuous posh boy puppet for the bankers and Brussels bureaucrats. He hasn't a patriotic bone in his body so doesn't care what happens to Ireland in the long run. He has no children so doesn't care about the next generation. Squabbling about who paid for the drinks for his entourage at a Kylie concert is what preoccupies this airhead.
All that and paying €270 million to unsecured bondholders while trying to deflect from it by squealing "look over there, it's the nasty shinners in balaclavas".............
The chap is a useful idiot serf for his EU masters.
 

wombat

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but FG chose to píss the borrowed money away on current spending instead.
I wonder how many seats a party would win if they had a policy detailing what current spending they would cut?
 

bokuden

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I wonder will he roll over on the backstop?
Well, FG are now admitting that there will be a hard border in the event of a no deal Brexit, so who will enforce that? Ireland on behalf of the EU?
 

bokuden

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It was damaged to a point that made borrowing at sustainable rates impossible for us - I wouldn't call that destroyed, as we never hit junk status or went as far down as countries who showed little or no inclination to fix their deficits, but it's a relatively moot point. More to the point is that had FG started picking and choosing which debts it suited them to service on taking office, we'd have been right down there with the junk brigade in jig time.

Mind you it would've prevented the housing crisis.
FG caused the housing crisis. Own it.
 

SPN

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I wonder how many seats a party would win if they had a policy detailing what current spending they would cut?
Indeed.

Given that the current bubble is about to burst, and the pay increases for the PS/CS are still being paid for with borrowed money, and our borrowing capacity is pretty much maxxed out, it would be a very honest party who would flag up that current spending is unsustainable at present levels.
 

Half Nelson

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SPN

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Here's is two faced Leo in action "not another cent"
And they didn't get another cent.

They only got what had been committed under the October 12th 2008 plan.

You will recall that the Troika had put in place a €15 Billion facility that would be available to Ireland if the Irish banks needed additional capital, above what was expected whenever the numbers were being run in late 2010.

But we never needed this money because a floor had been put under the losses in the banks at that stage.


Whenever it became obvious that this money would not be needed to buy bank shares the Government went cap in hand to the Troika and asked them, pretty please, if the €15 Billion could be used to fund even more pay, perks and pensions for the insiders.
 

wombat

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Indeed.

Given that the current bubble is about to burst, and the pay increases for the PS/CS are still being paid for with borrowed money, and our borrowing capacity is pretty much maxxed out, it would be a very honest party who would flag up that current spending is unsustainable at present levels.
There is brave and there is suicidal, the current proposals from the opposition is to increase nurses' pay, although some of them would cut consultants' pay. I suppose you could have a cup of tea while dying of an undiagnosed ailment?
 

sic transit

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Well, FG are now admitting that there will be a hard border in the event of a no deal Brexit, so who will enforce that? Ireland on behalf of the EU?
EU says so, which is why there's been all that fuss about a backstop.
 

SPN

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There is brave and there is suicidal,
There is also pointing out that the emperor is wearing no clothes.

We have ridden the current economic bubble hard, driving it on with €120 Billion of new state borrowing, maxxing out our credit card in the process.

Whenever the bust comes, and it is months away rather than years away, someone will have to step up and tell the truth.



the current proposals from the opposition is to increase nurses' pay, although some of them would cut consultants' pay. I suppose you could have a cup of tea while dying of an undiagnosed ailment?
A 24 year old starting out as a teacher gets paid €33,000 for a 35 week year.

Is is any wonder that nurses, who work 24/7/52 for less money, might want some of that same level of gravy.
 
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