Sectarian Recruitment to PSNI should end

Northern Voice

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 28, 2010
Messages
2,115
The secretary of state has revealed that the positive discrimination employed by the Police Service of Northern Ireland in recruitment is to end:

The secretary of state has said he is "not minded" to continue the practice of 50-50 recruitment in the PSNI.

Owen Paterson announced details of a consultation process on the practice which is due to expire in March 2011.

Mr Paterson said that currently more than 29% of serving officers are from a Catholic background which is within the target set by the Patten report.
Full article: BBC News - Paterson confirms PSNI 50-50 recruitment should lapse

Views?
 
Last edited:


picador

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
20,659

picador

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
20,659
No it's not - it says "should" not "will "
Good old cruimh. Ever up for a pointless semantic argument.

How can you confirm something which is conditional?

No final decision has been taken on 50-50 recruitment. Thus nothing is confirmed - except that the BBC sub-editor's English is not up to scratch.

And a very good day to you sir.
 

Arracht

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2010
Messages
1,259
Does anyone know why a target of 30% was chosen? The RC population is more than that.
 

Cruimh

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
83,467
Good old cruimh. Ever up for a semantic discussion.

How can you confirm something which is conditional?

No final decision has been taken on 50-50 recruitment. Thus nothing is confirmed.
It's not semantic.

Read the article.

Paterson says it should end .... that is what the Headline reports

And Patten envisaged a 10 year period....

But You lied with this :

The minimalist 30% figure envisaged by Patten has still not been achieved.

What the Patten report actually said .....

14.10 The model we have developed would lead to the proportion of Catholic officers more than doubling within four years, to between 17% and 19% (depending on the take-up rate of the early retirement option for existing officers), and quadrupling within ten years to 29-33%
29% ..... and what does the BBC article say ?
Mr Paterson said that currently more than 29% of serving officers are from a Catholic background which is within the target set by the Patten report.
 

Ó Ghabhainn

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 2, 2009
Messages
3,123
Does anyone know why a target of 30% was chosen? The RC population is more than that.
Personally I think a target of 45-46% is unrealistic, unless they plan to off-load a few Protestants - but this would actually make it sectarian, unless you class the de-sectarianisation of the police force as sectarian like NV does in his thread title.
 

Northern Voice

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 28, 2010
Messages
2,115
Apologies for the thread title, meant to write "should end" rather than "to end."
 

Scipio

Well-known member
Joined
May 3, 2010
Messages
936
The characterization of the Patten programme as "sectarian" is misleading in the extreme.
 

Northern Voice

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 28, 2010
Messages
2,115
The characterization of the Patten programme as "sectarian" is misleading in the extreme.
Whilst I believe it was necessary to encourage Catholic citizens of Northern Ireland to join the police I think there were better ways to do it that simply rejecting Protestant applicants which is what happened for a long time. If I opened a business tomorrow and refused to employ Muslims or Catholics I would be deemed as having a sectarian recruitment method. For a long time the police have recruited on the basis of religion which is sectarian. I believe we live in a society that requires an extremely solid police force so merit should be the first priority in recruitment rather than being a merely political process.
 

picador

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
20,659
It's not semantic.

Read the article.

Paterson says it should end .... that is what the Headline reports

And Patten envisaged a 10 year period....

But You lied with this :


What the Patten report actually said .....



29% ..... and what does the BBC article say ?
I lied! Really cruimh, you are a delusional bit of work.

Bad English might make sense to you but to me it's just bad English. I don't blame NV for getting the thread title wrong.

Has 50-50 been abolished? NO.

And BTW the Patten target was 30%.
http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/PSNI-5050-rule-to-run.5783654.jp
 

picador

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
20,659
Simple question then picador - where did the Patten report set a target of 30% ?

I've quoted from the report and shown that the target envisaged has been met.
Perhaps you should inform the Northern Ireland Office, who have clearly lied to the News Letter. :rolleyes:

The NIO says that currently more than 27 per cent of serving PSNI officers are from a Catholic background and, says that with the 50-50 provisions in place for another year, current projections indicate that the PSNI will have 30 per cent Catholic composition by 2011, as set out in the Patten Report.

It said that once the 30 per cent target has been reached, the legislation will come to an end.
 

Cruimh

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
83,467
I've quoted the Patten report :)

Silly bhoy!

14.10 The model we have developed would lead to the proportion of Catholic officers more than doubling within four years, to between 17% and 19% (depending on the take-up rate of the early retirement option for existing officers), and quadrupling within ten years to 29-33%
29% - which has been exceded :)
 

picador

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
20,659
I know you think you have been really smart but you are just showing yourself up as an unbearable (and misguided) pedant again

This is what then NI Security Minister Paul Goggins told the House of Commons last year

Since the introduction of the temporary recruitment provisions in 2001, there have been 3,751 appointments to the PSNI-1,888 Catholic, 1,831 Protestant and 32 not determined. Catholic composition within the PSNI has increased from 8.3 per cent. to 27.68 per cent. We remain on track to reach the target of 30 per cent. Catholic composition by March 2011, and today I am laying before Parliament an order that will renew the temporary provisions for a further final year.
PSNI (Recruitment): 3 Feb 2010: House of Commons debates (TheyWorkForYou.com)

Perhaps he was lying to Parliament ;)
 

Cruimh

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 30, 2010
Messages
83,467
I know you think you have been really smart but you are just showing yourself up as an unbearable (and misguided) pedant again
It's called accuracy ......

You wrote that Patten envisaged a minimalist 30%

I've proved that Patten wrote 29-33%

You've obviously not read the report and lack the basic manners to admit you got it wrong - In a strop because your Party leader says she'll be wearing a poppy ? ;)
 

picador

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
20,659
It's called accuracy ......

You wrote that Patten envisaged a minimalist 30%

I've proved that Patten wrote 29-33%


Sir Hugh (Orde)said that when he took up his role almost seven years ago, he joined an organisation that was facing massive change. Implementation of key Patten recommendations on human rights, the 50/50 recruitment policy and accountability have been critical to the success of the reforms, he said.

A human rights ethos was embedded right across the policing system, from training through to operations. The recruitment policy had helped to build public confidence in the service and the PSNI was on target to hit achieve the “top end” of what Patten considered should be achievable ----30% Catholic membership of the PSNI – by 2011.
University Of Ulster News Release - Patten Produced Model Policing Blueprint, Says NIPB Chairman

LOL. It seems that I am not the only one to associate the 30% target with Patten.

Here's why:
We estimate that the proportion of Catholic officers in the police should more than double in four years and reach 30% or more within ten years
Statement by Chris Patten on the future of Policing in Northern Ireland, 9 September 1999

That was the same day the Patten Report was published ;)

cruimh said:
You've obviously not read the report and lack the basic manners to admit you got it wrong - In a strop because your Party leader says she'll be wearing a poppy ? ;)
Amusing to see you lecturing others about manners.

cruimh said:
Silly bhoy!
Go on, have the last word - but try not to make it a sectarian slur about 'bhoys'. I am not a Glasgow Celtic supporter.
 
Last edited:

SevenStars

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 17, 2009
Messages
4,201
Whilst I believe it was necessary to encourage Catholic citizens of Northern Ireland to join the police I think there were better ways to do it that simply rejecting Protestant applicants which is what happened for a long time. If I opened a business tomorrow and refused to employ Muslims or Catholics I would be deemed as having a sectarian recruitment method. For a long time the police have recruited on the basis of religion which is sectarian. I believe we live in a society that requires an extremely solid police force so merit should be the first priority in recruitment rather than being a merely political process.
You do realize though that the Brits arent doing all this for the laughs?

They are doing this to secure the Union.
 

former wesleyan

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2009
Messages
25,562
There's no hope.
 


New Threads

Most Replies

Top