Should job seekers allowance be abolished for under 21s ?

Bridget558

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I think anybody who is unemployed aged under 21 should be in education not on the dole, i think the goverment should no longer give this age group an allowance unless they go back into education, this has nothing to do with saving money because of the mess the country is in, i just think its a bad idea that an 18 year old who has never worked can drop out of school and go on the dole 90 days later, that cant happen in most other countries.
 
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The Dude

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Why 21? Why not 25? Or 30?

18 year olds in this country are legally adults. Further education isn't for everyone. I believe in withdrawing the dole in increments if the person in receipt of welfare cannot prove that he or she is attempting to find work.

Furthermore, the sad reality is that while we may pretent otherwise, third level education in this country is not universally available due to the prohibitive costs involved
 

Bridget558

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Why 21? Why not 25? Or 30?

18 year olds in this country are legally adults. Further education isn't for everyone. I believe in withdrawing the dole in increments if the person in receipt of welfare cannot prove that he or she is attempting to find work.

Furthermore, the sad reality is that while we may pretent otherwise, third level education in this country is not universally available due to the prohibitive costs involved
im not just talking about third level, if an 19 year old for example is unemployed with no leaving cert i think he or she should be put back to education to do the leaving cert not being paid to sit at home on the dole.
 

kenneth

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No. Not everyone can afford third level education. Others simply don't want to go into third level education straight after their leaving cert. They should not be stripped of jobseekers allowance if that is the case. In particular in the current economic climate a lot of young people won't be able to get a job straight away and deserve jobseekers to assist them if they happen to be out of work for a significant period of time.
 

Dentist

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Why not bring in a national service and force our youths into the Army for a 12month period?? i was previously on the dole and it aint a nice place to be, the body and the mind get lazy doing nothing. But realistically we should force able bodied people on the dole into doing community based work even just 10 hours a week each
 

TaxHavenSite

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Why not bring in a national service and force our youths into the Army for a 12month period?? i was previously on the dole and it aint a nice place to be, the body and the mind get lazy doing nothing. But realistically we should force able bodied people on the dole into doing community based work even just 10 hours a week each
Are you proposing that for all citizens or just residents?
 

CookieMonster

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No. Not everyone can afford third level education, not everyone can deal with third level education and not everyone wants or needs third level education.

what's more, if it were to be abolished what would young people between 17/18 and 21 do? Stay here unable to get a job and turn to crime or leave the country? We've lost a huge amount of young people overseas and you want to encourage more of it?

Cut the ************************************g pension and leave young people a fighting chance.
 

Bridget558

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I was previously on the dole and it aint a nice place to be, the body and the mind get lazy doing nothing.
Thats why i think its a good idea to make young unemployed go back into education, if you are at home on the dole at the age of 18 not working becomes normal to you after awhile. I know of men in their 40s who have been on the dole since the late 1980s.
 

Bridget558

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No. Not everyone can afford third level education, not everyone can deal with third level education and not everyone wants or needs third level education.

what's more, if it were to be abolished what would young people between 17/18 and 21 do? Stay here unable to get a job and turn to crime or leave the country? We've lost a huge amount of young people overseas and you want to encourage more of it?

Cut the ************************************g pension and leave young people a fighting chance.
Now hang on, did you even read what i wrote in this thread? I never said dont give the under 21s nothing, if i as a tax payer am giving 18,19,and 20 year olds money each week i think its only fair that they go to a youth reach or fetac course rather than being at home playing the xbox.
 

vanla sighs

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I think anybody who is unemployed aged under 21 should be in education not on the dole, i think the goverment should no longer give this age group an allowence unless they go back into education, this has nothing to do with saving money because of the mess the country is in, i just think its a bad idea that an 18 year old who has never worked can drop out of school and go on the dole 90 days later, that cant happen in most other countries.
So how exactly are they going to go into further education if the places aren't there for them? Or if they don't have the points to get into an IT or university? And how are they supposed to pay the €1,500 student service/capitation fee for uni/IT (which could be rising come the budget) if they don't have any money?

You're right it wouldn't save any money - in fact it would cost the State hundreds of millions more each year: extra teachers, extra supports etc etc. Would also mean a few new colleges would need to be built -how much do you reckon that'd cost?

The dole has already been cut by 50% for those under 21, from approx €200p.w to €100p.w - a move which imho was shameful and mean fisted in the first place. Why should the under 21's be treated as though they are a different breed from the over 21's?

Edit: So how exactly do we put all those under 21 into 2nd level with people younger than them when class sizes are already maxed out? You must remember when you hit 18 you're an adult and you are entitled to the services which the States provides for its citizens.
 

CookieMonster

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Now hang on, did you even read what i wrote in this thread? I never said dont give the under 21s nothing, if i as a tax payer am giving 18,19,and 20 year olds money each week i think its only fair that they go to a youth reach or fetac course rather than being at home playing the xbox.
How are the supposed to get to the course they're being made do if they don't have an income? They've already had it cut to almost noting as it is. You'd think young lads want to be sitting at home week in week out playing xbox and feeling utterly useless.

Stop dumping on young people.
 

Bridget558

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So how exactly are they going to go into further education if the places aren't there for them? Or if they don't have the points to get into an IT or university? And how are they supposed to pay the €1,500 student service/capitation fee for uni/IT (which could be rising come the budget) if they don't have any money?

You're right it wouldn't save any money - in fact it would cost the State hundreds of millions more each year: extra teachers, extra supports etc etc. Would also mean a few new colleges would need to be built -how much do you reckon that'd cost?

The dole has already been cut by 50% for those under 21, from approx €200p.w to €100p.w - a move which imho was shameful and mean fisted in the first place. Why should the under 21's be treated as though they are a different breed from the over 21's?

Edit: So how exactly do we put all those under 21 into 2nd level with people younger than them when class sizes are already maxed out? You must remember when you hit 18 you're an adult and you are entitled to the services which the States provides for its citizens.
you think an 18 year old living at home with their parents should be getting €200 per week for doing nothing? GET REAL. With the billions going into fas there should be money to get all the young unemployed back into education.
 

Bridget558

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How are the supposed to get to the course they're being made do if they don't have an income? They've already had it cut to almost noting as it is. You'd think young lads want to be sitting at home week in week out playing xbox and feeling utterly useless.

Stop dumping on young people.
You dont seem to know your facts, youth reach and fetac pay travel expenses, also a meal allowence.
 
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CookieMonster

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You dont seem to know your facts, youth reach and fetac pay travel expenses, also a meal allowence.
who pays for those courses? What use are they to anybody?
 

vanla sighs

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you think an 18 year old living at home with their parents should be getting €200 per week for doing nothing? GET REAL. With the billions going into fas there should be money to get all the young unemployed back into education.
When you say "education" are you speaking in the academic sense of the word, i.e: uni, IT etc or in the more vocational sense, such as FAS (soon to be gotten rid of and replaced btw) €200? 18 year old get €100 not €200.

It is very unlikely that whatever agency replace FAS that it will have the capacity to ensure all those aged 18 - 21 have access to a course. And even if they did, what happens to the 18 year old after the 6 or 12 month course? No job so back on the dole - or would they be expected to do cours after course after course just for the hell of it. Or perhaps train em and ship em out? Make them emigrate, force them to leave Ireland? Export the problem, as us Irish do with another sensitive issue?

And if whatever agency replaces FAS concentrates all its energy on those aged 18 -21 what happens everyone else who wants a place on a course? It's not as simple as it appears you think it is.
 

CookieMonster

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Better use than sitting at home, I as a tax payer have no problem paying for them.
Why not cut the dole from all unemployed people and force them to take these course? Why just under 21s?
 

vanla sighs

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I would support a "work for the dole" type scheme. Back to Education is best for under 21s who left school early.
Why is a Back to Education scheme best for under 21's? I wouldn't support a Work for Dole scheme. How exactly would this work for your dole scheme work for lets say single mums? Who looks after the kids when they are out working? I'm not a single mum but I do know childcare costs are an issue.

And why should people work for their dole in the first place? If you are working you should on principle be paid at least minimum hourly rates.
 


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