Should Kathleen Lynch Resign



The Trinity Politick

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If she resigns, then Kileen resigns.

I would rather the Labour party, Fine Gael or Fianna Fail bring in legislation barring Dail deputies making representation in cases such as these. Its clientelism gone too far. TDs need to be aware that, while it may be well meaning, it is highly inappropriate to make such an intervention. The judical process is separate, and should be treated as such
 

The OD

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Should she resign? More importantly, why should she? She claims it would have been cowardly to refuse the rapists mother, yet am I the only one who thinks her act of not refusing would be cowardly? And what of her claim that she knew the family well? Is that a prerequisite for a TD doing something for you?

No, she shouldnt resign, but she should take a good hard look at what she did - she claims she didnt want to influence the sentencing so why write the letter.

She shouldnt resign, but her constituents should sack her at the next election - I hope someone makes an issue of it when it comes around, possibly with a nasty comment like vote Lynch - the rapist advocate or something along those lines.

In short, she is an utter gobshite. Still, could be worse, her and her sister didnt get raped by a man from a 'respectable family' I suppose?
 

geraghd

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Limerick Lad said:
I think Kathleen Lynch has made a grievous error in judgement and find it alarming that she and other TDs have not learned lessons from the public outcry that has occurred before when similar incidents were exposed.
Should she resign as a TD? No, she sent her letter through the defendant's legal team, which is how character references no matter how ill judged are normally placed before the court.

Interestingly, on RTE News a barrister said that a judge is required to take in family background and circumstances into account when considering sentencing which I find to be extraordinary.
Why? There are usually mitigating circumstances, which is a pretty important principle of law that should be taken into account when sentencing.
 
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An Scadan Rua said:
its a straight forward enough question and it begs to be asked.

:D :D :D you're joking right??

really. has one single irish politician in the entire history of this state EVER said "i made a mistake, i'm going to do the honourable thing and resign"

and don't say bertie because according to him, he's "done nothing wrong".

so he hasn't any honour.
 

Limerick Lad

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geraghd said:
Limerick Lad said:
I think Kathleen Lynch has made a grievous error in judgement and find it alarming that she and other TDs have not learned lessons from the public outcry that has occurred before when similar incidents were exposed.
Should she resign as a TD? No, she sent her letter through the defendant's legal team, which is how character references no matter how ill judged are normally placed before the court.

Interestingly, on RTE News a barrister said that a judge is required to take in family background and circumstances into account when considering sentencing which I find to be extraordinary.
Why? There are usually mitigating circumstances, which is a pretty important principle of law that should be taken into account when sentencing.
Should the fact that one's parents are decent law abiding people or otherwise affect how the judge decides on the severity of one's sentence. There seems to be a dichotomy when it comes to sentencing, in some cases the judge is informed that the defendant comes from a good family, well educated and acted out of character then we have the opposite the defendant's childhood was blighted by deprivation, social exclusion etc. yet he's expected to take both types of background into account as mitigating circumstances.
 

loner

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No she should not resign but this case sets down a marker in relation to how TDs should behave.For years many TDs who are our primary legislators were acting as messenger boys and girls for their constituents---they complained that they could not do the job properly because they had no research facilities. Some years ago they were allowed to take on Parliamentary Assistants to do research for them. As far as Ican see ,in the main, they have used the additional staff to further exacerbate an already bad clientist activity by using the additional staff for more messenger boy/girl purposes. How can we hope for more and better legislation from a Parliamentary system that operates in this manner.
 

blucey

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returning officer said:
It was not sent to the judge. That is a lie. It formed part of the submissions of defence counsel (who clearly had little to say by way of mitigation).
She wrote on behalf of the family of a rapist (read the statement above - she did not know the accused nor comment on him). That is entirely different, from what I have read the judge commented on it not because it was improper but because it was irrelevant.

The family of the accused could be at risk of being victimised (how are Wayne O'Donoghues's family treated?) - she wrote on their behalf. Perhaps a letter to the paper might have been a better forum to make that point, but there is nothing inheretely improper in a TD making representations on behalf of innocent constituents ie the family.

I think I am wasting my breath.
"Dear Whoever. Re Mr Rapist. his Mammy's nice. Give him a break......"

Give me a break more like it.
 

earlyandoften

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pikey said:
Keith-M said:
Yes, no question about it, she's a disgrace to her constituency, her party and her sex. This isn't just a case of saying "sorry" and hoping the storm will blow over. She took the side of a rapist over the side of his victims and if the woman had an ounce of morality she would stand down.
But do you think she is the only TD to make representations like this ? Is it possible this has happened in manslaughter or serious assault cases ?
And if I may broaden the discussion Consider this , In Limerick Willie O Dea is legendary for " getting things for people " and his "can do " attitude . I wonder is it beyond the bounds of possibility that he may have helped a ne'er do well get a medical card or a house or whatever ? ( theres no evidence to suggest he has , but its possible,just using him as an example )
Why did you use Willie O'Dea as an example and not Michael Ring or John Gormley or Tony Gregory?
Also does it matter if others have been doing it? is your argument that because other haven't been caught she should get away with it?
If she's a member of the front bench she should be demoted.
 

Laudenum

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PronsiasPilate said:
really. has one single irish politician in the entire history of this state EVER said "i made a mistake, i'm going to do the honourable thing and resign".
Bobby Molloy for one?

and em....that Fine Gaeler
 

NotDevsSon

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No. She should not. She made an error of judgement. It shouldn't have happened. But she is a decent good person widely respected who simply made a mistake.
 

earlyandoften

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peader odonnell said:
of course not ,let the people of CNC decide at the next election.


well peader, i guess with a name like that you're a fellow traveller . Not sure how you'd feel if it was a fianna failer
 
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NotDevsSon said:
No. She should not. She made an error of judgement. It shouldn't have happened. But she is a decent good person widely respected who simply made a mistake.

No of course not. Nobody in this country should ever be held accountable for anything and nobody should ever have to resign/
 

pikey

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earlyandoften said:
pikey said:
But do you think she is the only TD to make representations like this ? Is it possible this has happened in manslaughter or serious assault cases ?
And if I may broaden the discussion Consider this , In Limerick Willie O Dea is legendary for " getting things for people " and his "can do " attitude . I wonder is it beyond the bounds of possibility that he may have helped a ne'er do well get a medical card or a house or whatever ? ( theres no evidence to suggest he has , but its possible,just using him as an example )
Why did you use Willie O'Dea as an example and not Michael Ring or John Gormley or Tony Gregory?
Also does it matter if others have been doing it? is your argument that because other haven't been caught she should get away with it?
If she's a member of the front bench she should be demoted.
I mentioned Willie cause Im in his constituency and know many people who have said ' willies grand , he'll help you with this , that and the other ' . I cant say anything with certainty about the others . My argument is that if there is a culture of TDs making representations then it is hypocritical/unfair to just vilify one . I am not partisan , I despise all politicians in equal measure .
 

jerryp

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Don't have time to read all of this thread : she was wrong, admitted it and said sorry. Now, if other politicians and public figures appearing before tribunals had been as upfront, we would have saved the country millions and politics in general would not have been debased.
 

jholt

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Well said jerryp, that sums it up nicely.
 

drjimryan

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alone, without anyone else.......NO

should an independent audit of such letters sent by td's be carried out and published?.......YES.....


would that lead to a large number of td's being exposed as having helped child rapists?..............YES.......

is their a much worst culprit than kathleen in leinster house, supporting child rapists?.....YEs.....
 

Schuhart

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NotDevsSon said:
No. She should not. She made an error of judgement. It shouldn't have happened. But she is a decent good person widely respected who simply made a mistake.
Never mind what she's like. I think it should hinge on whether or not she comes from a good family.

Were her parents regular Communicants? Has she any close relatives in the clergy? If so, it was all clearly an unfortunate misunderstanding. If not, she's obviously of bad stock and should be treated accordingly regardless of whatever she has achieved in her life.
jerryp said:
Don't have time to read all of this thread : she was wrong, admitted it and said sorry. Now, if other politicians and public figures appearing before tribunals had been as upfront, we would have saved the country millions and politics in general would not have been debased.
I'm sorry, but her apology is less than perfect. It reads alright once, and then you start to wonder. She says she made the statement 'in good faith'. That usually means you did something because you were truly unaware of the factual context. What does this statement mean in this context?

Also, what does a good family mean in this context? What conclusion are we supposed to draw?
 


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