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Should voting in LEs and GEs be compulsory

locke

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May 2, 2007
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Socrates the great Greek philosopher highlighted the weaknesses in Democracy, when he opined that not all of the citizens were intellectually fit to exercise their vote.
He construed that those of low educational capacity were easily swayed by the false promises of smooth talking, snake oil salesmen populists. This resulted in inferior self interested candidates being elected to positions of power and inevitable corruption and crisis in the State.
I'm sympathetic to some of that.

Fianna Fail and Fine Gael are not of themselves corrupt, but always at risk of being corrupted.

A corrupt individual who wants to further themselves will always look at how they can influence power and place themselves in the parties of power.

Fianna Fáil's near chokehold on the office of Taoiseach prior to 2011 meant that they were the natural choice of the corrupt.

A few went for the bigger fish in a smaller pond of Fine Gael.

There was little point in being corrupt in Labour, and no point being corrupt in The Green, Sinn Fein, The Workers Party etc.

With the rebalancing of our electoral system that happened after 2011, Fine Gael should worry that those who want to feather their own nest will exploit the party.
 


hiding behind a poster

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I was reading an article the other week about the Euro and Local elections, specifically about voter turnout and entire swathes of society that didn't engage at all.

We often wonder why we keep returning to the same old politics, over and over again and I'm beginning to believe it's down to voter management rather than policies.
Who's "we"?

A sure cure for this would be making voting compulsory as they do in many countries already:


Low turnout and pockets of concentrated party allegiances is distorting the actual democratic process
So voting for a political party distorts democracy? That's a new one - and a completely unfounded one, too.

- if I were one of the rag tag collection of small parties in Ireland I'd start agitating collectively for a law to make voting compulsory. The "democrats" would struggle to argue against it and the general public should in theory welcome it.
Would the general public welcome the sanctions proposed against those who don't vote? You also don't understand that this is a classic dog-whistle issue. Very few people would tell you why they oppose your idea, but that won't make their opposition any less trenchant.
 

hiding behind a poster

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With the right to vote comes the right not to while ideally everyone should vote there may be logical reasons why many others dont disillusionment of the whole thing being a major factor many are genuinely fed up of the current political situation that they are either voting for alternatives or choosing to not participate entirely indeed the lack of alternative choices to the current political establishment is most likely why those people are choosing to stay away in the first place they simply have no one credible to vote for and they have decided to not to do so because of it which is quite understandable really.
You're missing one huge factor. Lots of people don't actually care. Virtually all shades of political opinion are represented on the ballot paper, yet some people don't vote. That only leaves apathy.
 

hiding behind a poster

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Therein lies the problem - the established parties can mobilize a base vote from those with a vested interest and the impact of those votes is effectively double what it should be, largely drowning our the “policy” driven voters who want to vote for the people with capability and integrity - the big parties will ALWAY win elections due to the apathy of the citizens and funnily enough I’ve never heard the topic of compulsory voting ever discussed in the Dail, despite us looking to Australia for many good examples of democracy.
You're making a lot of assumptions there - none supported by evidence. Do better next time.
 

hiding behind a poster

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So tell me which General election , your particular vote has made a significant difference after near 100 years of Tweedledum (FF) and Tweedledee (FG and Lab) with not a jot of difference between the 2.
An electorate that routinely returns Lowry and the Healy Raes ..and electorate that returned all 3 councillors outed by Prime Time..an electorate that voted in Maria bailey , and (routinely) her Dad.

Id rather stay at home and do something constructive like weed the garden that delude myself that my vote makes the slightest difference
No single individual's vote makes a significant difference in itself - and with over 2 million people voting, nor should it. Every vote cast is equal.
 

hiding behind a poster

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Ireland and England have a similar voting system. Both have the same weaknesses in the integrity of the vote.
The main weakness is the Postal voting system, where multiple ballots can be submitted without adequate identification.
The ballots from Postal voting are mixed with regular ballots and can not be distinguished.
. A colour coding of Postal ballots would correct this.
In the recent surprise Labour by-election victory in Peterborough, UK, it is estimated that 6000 ballots or 20% of the vote were Postal votes.
Considering that Labour won by 680 votes, the result is questionable, but there is no way under the present system to prove illicit activity.
Surprisingly ,no exit polls were conducted, which could have indicated a disparity in the voting patterns.
As usual, you're wrong. Postal ballots in Ireland are opened and counted separately - witnessed by agents of the candidates.
 

bang bang

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Everybody has a vested interest in who's in our parliament.
I'm not sure about compulsory voting, but
Why should you be forced to Vote if there is nobody espousing policies you agree with ?

Why should you be forced tp vote if you believe Irish MEPs make not 1 jot of difference to EU policy ? (11 out of 705) - (and your vote will be taken as evidence of support for the EU)

Why should you be forced to vote for counciillors that have no powers

Why should you be forced to vote for people to earn € 500,000 a year while thousands wait on Trollies in Hospitals

I didnt vote and have no intention of voting in the GE ....and you want to fine me for holding those beliefs ?
Whose earning the 500k? I think it's strange posting on a political to have no interest in voting, or maybe that's just me.
 

bang bang

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That's the reason i voted May 24th

i was worried if law abiding people like me didn't bother voting then sinn féin could do very well
Says the para's and butchers fan, while on a personal level you may or may not be law abiding, your support for the aforementioned tells it's own story. One day you may be cured of your obsession, I hope so as it's not healthy.
 

bells of shando

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As usual, you're wrong. Postal ballots in Ireland are opened and counted separately - witnessed by agents of the candidates. 'Quote'

As usual, you have not accounted for how the postal votes got in the ballot box in the first place.
Postal votes are the weakest point in an electoral system, Multiple votes can be made by a single person using identities from a voting register. Irelands voting register contains thousands of dead and absent people.
Postal voting manipulation has been prosecuted in the UK and is an ongoing problem.
 

brughahaha

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I didn't make that silly claim and if I was you I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for an intelligent reply from the poster who did.
So you cant add as well as lacking in basic comprehension skills ...oh dear !

wow you really are (still) smarting from that P.ie hiding you took arent you :LOL:
 
Last edited:

brughahaha

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I'm not sure about compulsory voting, but

Whose earning the 500k? I think it's strange posting on a political to have no interest in voting, or maybe that's just me.

MEPs


Salary expenses and allowances add up to on average 500k a year
 

hiding behind a poster

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As usual, you're wrong. Postal ballots in Ireland are opened and counted separately - witnessed by agents of the candidates. 'Quote'

As usual, you have not accounted for how the postal votes got in the ballot box in the first place.
Postal votes are the weakest point in an electoral system, Multiple votes can be made by a single person using identities from a voting register. Irelands voting register contains thousands of dead and absent people.
Postal voting manipulation has been prosecuted in the UK and is an ongoing problem.
As you've been asked before, why does no candidate allege this fraud is happening?
 

hiding behind a poster

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MEPs


Salary expenses and allowances add up to on average 500k a year
The allowances include the cost of employing staff - is it your view that MEPs should pay for their staff from their own pockets?
 

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