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Sinn Fein set out plans for more progressive tax


factual

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Joined
Feb 5, 2005
Messages
8,761
Mary Lou has today spoken about the tax proposal that Sinn Fein will introduce.

She says that the present tax system is unfair to the least well off and that the new proposals will be aimed at greater economic equality.


Detailed proposals were:

-tax justice in Ireland.
-people should pay according to their ability to pay
-everyone should have equal access to the highest quality public services, infrastructure and social protections.

-immediately lower the tax burden on low and average income earners
-remove unfair tax advantages for the wealthy.
-stop tax breaks for private for profit hospital developers,
-increase the minimum wage to 60% of the average industrial wage and keep those earning it out of the tax net.
-ensure that all those on the average industrial wage are in the standard tax band,
-increase mortgage tax relief for first time buyers
-aggressively close down remaining tax avoidance schemes
-remove all tax exemptions other than where the social and economic value outweighs the cost to the exchequer like for example in Research and Development,
-end tax exile status

A very good set of proposals - fair to the less well off and possible to carry through in government. Hopefully the electorate will agree.
 


The Trinity Politick

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Sep 30, 2006
Messages
248
Even Fianna Fail will ask this question

What about Corporation tax?
 

NickyG

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Sep 21, 2006
Messages
32
I believe SF are now very close to treading that fine line with their policies, the line between ideological fortitude and pragmatism. For too long they have allowed the usual suspects the ammo of branding them loopy left.

Whilst some may still try, SF policies now reside firmly in the arena of the possible, a pretty good balance between radical and do-able, which is not a bad place to be for a party which will hope to get a large protest vote but still wants to harbour the possibility of leverage in Government.

What I want to see now from SF is to not let themselves get outflanked on the presentation to the electorate, as Labour are making some pretty slick moves in this regard recently.
 

The Trinity Politick

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Messages
248
FutureTaoiseach said:
increase the minimum wage to 60% of the average industrial wage
Bonkers.
17.5% Corp Tax....+ minimum wage at 60% of avg industrail wage.

And this will increase our already falling competitiveness how? Thats some economics Sinn Fein have working down in Parnell Street

Not just multi-nationals. Expect Irish companies to suffer. Strange for Sinn Fein of all parties to want to destroy Irish companies employing Irish workers (by and large). These sort of propsals don't stack up to economic scrutiny
 

NickyG

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Sep 21, 2006
Messages
32
With regards Corp Tax, there is a bit of shoring up to do with regards SF direction, as we will want to be seen to have a positon in the 6, and a position in the 26, which will be somewhat harmonious in the long run.

This is a pretty nice dilemma for SF to have, and for those of you who are genuinely interested in scrutinising SF's policies, or may have bemoaned a dirth of substance in the past, this is a good sign of things to come.
 

Cael

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Jun 19, 2006
Messages
13,343
factual said:
Mary Lou has today spoken about the tax proposal that Sinn Fein will introduce.
Dont you mean "would" introduce, Factual? As Im quite sure you are well aware that Irish people in the 26 will never willingly let you lot anywhere near power - unless the Brits manage to impose "powersharing" in the 26 too.
 

factual

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Joined
Feb 5, 2005
Messages
8,761
Cael said:
factual said:
Mary Lou has today spoken about the tax proposal that Sinn Fein will introduce.
Dont you mean "would" introduce, Factual? As Im quite sure you are well aware that Irish people in the 26 will never willingly let you lot anywhere near power - unless the Brits manage to impose "powersharing" in the 26 too.
With Sinn Féin expected to at least double their tally of seats, now in government partnership in the six counties, and today talking to the six county policing board about taking up their seats, your view is really no longer tenable.

The time is coming for Sinn Féin in government. Because Sinn Féin have the talent, the enthusiasm, the ideas.
 

factual

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Feb 5, 2005
Messages
8,761
NickyG said:
I believe SF are now very close to treading that fine line with their policies, the line between ideological fortitude and pragmatism. For too long they have allowed the usual suspects the ammo of branding them loopy left.

Whilst some may still try, SF policies now reside firmly in the arena of the possible, a pretty good balance between radical and do-able, which is not a bad place to be for a party which will hope to get a large protest vote but still wants to harbour the possibility of leverage in Government.

What I want to see now from SF is to not let themselves get outflanked on the presentation to the electorate, as Labour are making some pretty slick moves in this regard recently.
I agree, SF policies are firmly committed to making a difference for the least well off via policies that are realistic and modern while also being clearly left wing.
 

Cael

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13,343
factual said:
Cael said:
factual said:
Mary Lou has today spoken about the tax proposal that Sinn Fein will introduce.
Dont you mean "would" introduce, Factual? As Im quite sure you are well aware that Irish people in the 26 will never willingly let you lot anywhere near power - unless the Brits manage to impose "powersharing" in the 26 too.
With Sinn Féin expected to at least double their tally of seats, now in government partnership in the six counties, and today talking to the six county policing board about taking up their seats, your view is really no longer tenable.

The time is coming for Sinn Féin in government. Because Sinn Féin have the talent, the enthusiasm, the ideas.
Factual, do you really think being RUC/PSNI lapdogs and informers is going to win you any support in the 26? The kind of people who support this kind of degerate behaviour already support Fine Gael and the PDs.

When you say "Sinn Féin," no doubt you are not talking about Sinn Féin, but the Sticky collaborators mislead by Constable Adams and J118. Their only enthusiasm is for lying to their own supporters and running after Crown appointments. Do you really think Leinster House needs even more of this kind of dross?

And by the way, the opera is not over till the fat lady sings - in this case Ian Paisley, and its still a long time to May 8th, so dont say your "in government partnership" until you really are.
 

doheochai

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Nov 7, 2005
Messages
61
factual said:
The time is coming for Sinn Féin in government. Because Sinn Féin have the talent, the enthusiasm, the ideas.
Word of warning -

Labour for many years had policies as far to the 'left' if not further than SF. As with SF they were hungry for government. They had the 'the talent, the enthusiasm, the ideas' - or so they claimed.
 

Skin

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Messages
1,080
FutureTaoiseach said:
increase the minimum wage to 60% of the average industrial wage
Bonkers. Hello Mary-Lou goodbye multinationals.
According to the CSO average industrial earnings are 601.95 a week. The Labour courts recommendation is to raise the minimum wage 1 euro to 8.65 per hour. SF proposal would raise it further to 9.02. If multi-million euro profit multi-nationals cant handle that then we truly are f*****.

Another point worth noting is that the FF/PD government keep informing us of how we are moving toward a "knowledge economy" and "moving up the value chain" - the impression I'm getting is that these multi-national "high value" jobs wont be too concerned about a minimum wage as they wont be employing to many accountants, solicitors, scientists, researchers, engineers, architects etc...etc...who would accept the minimum wage as a payment. They will have to fork out a bit more than that.

But on the other hand while the economy is becoming more valuable, the people who sell coffee and sandwhiches, work in petrol stations, newsagents and supermarkets, as cleaners, couriers etc..etc...will need some form of protection so as to feel valued in society....8.65 might help, 9.02 would be better.

As a PD you probably havent a clue about equality.
 

Skin

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Joined
Aug 25, 2005
Messages
1,080
The Trinity Politick said:
FutureTaoiseach said:
increase the minimum wage to 60% of the average industrial wage
Bonkers.
17.5% Corp Tax....+ minimum wage at 60% of avg industrail wage.

And this will increase our already falling competitiveness how? Thats some economics Sinn Fein have working down in Parnell Street

Not just multi-nationals. Expect Irish companies to suffer. Strange for Sinn Fein of all parties to want to destroy Irish companies employing Irish workers (by and large). These sort of propsals don't stack up to economic scrutiny

http://www.esri.ie/pdf/MTR_8CHAPTER6.PDF

If you go to page 122 and read from the article titled "Industrial Policy", it explains why a rise to 17.5% in corporation tax is recommended after 2010.
 

Biffo

Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2004
Messages
79
factual said:
Mary Lou has today spoken about the tax proposal that Sinn Fein will introduce.

She says that the present tax system is unfair to the least well off and that the new proposals will be aimed at greater economic equality.


Detailed proposals were:

-tax justice in Ireland.
-people should pay according to their ability to pay
-everyone should have equal access to the highest quality public services, infrastructure and social protections.

-immediately lower the tax burden on low and average income earners
-remove unfair tax advantages for the wealthy.
-stop tax breaks for private for profit hospital developers,
-increase the minimum wage to 60% of the average industrial wage and keep those earning it out of the tax net.
-ensure that all those on the average industrial wage are in the standard tax band,
-increase mortgage tax relief for first time buyers
-aggressively close down remaining tax avoidance schemes
-remove all tax exemptions other than where the social and economic value outweighs the cost to the exchequer like for example in Research and Development,
-end tax exile status

A very good set of proposals - fair to the less well off and possible to carry through in government. Hopefully the electorate will agree.
Yip that all seems vague enough to pass off as SF policy alright.
 

eurocrat

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Joined
Dec 23, 2004
Messages
231
factual said:
Detailed proposals were:

-tax justice in Ireland.
-people should pay according to their ability to pay
-everyone should have equal access to the highest quality public services, infrastructure and social protections.
So are you getting rid of VAT then?

Also the minimum wage proposal (according to Skins figures) is nothing special. Just an extra 40 cent an hour. In fairness it was a PD idea in the first place and is supported by every party in Ireland.

Any idea how much this tax package will cost?
 

Skin

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Joined
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Messages
1,080
eurocrat said:
factual said:
Detailed proposals were:

-tax justice in Ireland.
-people should pay according to their ability to pay
-everyone should have equal access to the highest quality public services, infrastructure and social protections.
So are you getting rid of VAT then?

Also the minimum wage proposal (according to Skins figures) is nothing special. Just an extra 40 cent an hour. In fairness it was a PD idea in the first place and is supported by every party in Ireland.

Any idea how much this tax package will cost?

The minimum wage proposal although nothing special is still a 4% percent increase over and above the 1 euro increase recommended by the Labour court. Its not going to make anyone rich but is still better than nothing. And the point was made by the PD above that such an increase will scare off all the multinationals - either the increase will scare off the multinationals because it is too costly, or it wont.

Ask the PD what the answer is, after all, as you say it was they who introduced it.
 

eurocrat

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Joined
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Messages
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Skin said:
The minimum wage proposal although nothing special is still a 4% percent increase over and above the 1 euro increase recommended by the Labour court. Its not going to make anyone rich but is still better than nothing. And the point was made by the PD above that such an increase will scare off all the multinationals - either the increase will scare off the multinationals because it is too costly, or it wont.

Ask the PD what the answer is, after all, as you say it was they who introduced it.
Well nice to see you too think the Minimum wage proposal is nothing special too. I would expect it to rise to that level by next year in any case. They only interesting aspect of this is tying the increase to increases in the average industrial wage - which in fairness is a novel enough approach.

I've had this debate before about the minimum wage. Its not going to scare away any multinationals as few multinationals are paying minimum wage (Do Intel pay their engineers €8.65 per hour?).

Only a small proportion (5%) of the Labour force earn minimum wage. These jobs tend to be concentrated in the catering and hospitality industry and filled largely by students, immigrants and part time workers. The income distribution effect of the minimum wage is ambiguous. It still remains, I believe an important tool in attracting good labour into the country. The inflationary effects of an increase are also fairly minimal, especially when put in the context of the benchmarking pay awards.

The PD posters should be a little more aware of the history of minimum wages and that their own party is committed to further increases.
 

bobbysands81

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Messages
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Bar what Sinn Féin's plans (might or might not be) for Corporate Tax who could have any problems with any of that???
 

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