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"Smoking When Pregnant Harms Your Baby"


Radix

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Messages
10,031
Given the current political climate surrounding Taoiseach Enda Kenny TD's announcement that our statute books are to be amended legislatively to permit the practice of at the very least, more than harmful procedures to some babies, I wonder at how this conflicts with other statutory measures currently in place aimed at reducing the harm to unborn babies by other practices.

To me this latest move by the Taoiseach suggests an institutional and cultural division emerging in contemporary Irish public life, where on the one hand we endeavour through statutory instrument to protect our unborn children, by forcing tobacco manufacturers to tell the truth about the effects their industry has on unborn health, while on the other, it seems we are seeking to undermine the life of some perfectly healthy children, solely based on the fact that their mother doesn't want them.

Observations?

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/pdf/2008/en.si.2008.0255.pdf

Tobacco packaging warning messages - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

Marcos the black

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Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
18,708
Think there's a big difference to be honest in the state ensuring knowledge about the effects of smoking compared to giving people, in very exceptional circumstances the option to abort a child when their own life is in danger. No?
 

Tea Shark

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Joined
Jun 6, 2012
Messages
4,090
What is interesting father is that despite the USA having a third of the population of India they have more than twice the abortions.

Abortions statistics - countries compared - NationMaster

As a priest based there how much do you think this is an illustration of the "lifestyle uber alles" approach as opposed to here?

Maybe the warning labels are simply immaterial to most yanks?
 

drummed

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Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
Think there's a big difference to be honest in the state ensuring knowledge about the effects of smoking compared to giving people, in very exceptional circumstances the option to abort a child when their own life is in danger. No?
Yes. But lets not let the facts obscure a perfectly promising rant and rave thread re abortion. Its just what the site needs afterall.
 

Marcos the black

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Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
18,708
Yes. But lets not let the facts obscure a perfectly promising rant and rave thread re abortion. Its just what the site needs afterall.
But this is P.ie. I thought rants weren't allowed?? :)
 

drummed

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Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
But this is P.ie. I thought rants weren't allowed?? :)
Never mind rants. Can't you see we were short of abortion threads featuring all the same posters making all the same points with visits from all the same (or new) socks to back them up? All culminating in a collective nervous breakdown by a handful of posters before all moving on to the next trojan horse thread where the pattern repeats itself. I propose we compare mandatory wearing of seatbelts in cars as a legal requirement to protect life to this "Buy one get one free" new abortion law while keeping in mind the outcome of the smoking while pregnant discussion. Its a perfect example of why the site brings such enlightenment into all our lives.
 

Mitsui2

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Joined
Nov 13, 2009
Messages
33,382
Given the current political climate surrounding Taoiseach Enda Kenny TD's announcement that our statute books are to be amended legislatively to permit the practice of at the very least, more than harmful procedures to some babies, I wonder at how this conflicts with other statutory measures currently in place aimed at reducing the harm to unborn babies by other practices.

To me this latest move by the Taoiseach suggests an institutional and cultural division emerging in contemporary Irish public life, where on the one hand we endeavour through statutory instrument to protect our unborn children, by forcing tobacco manufacturers to tell the truth about the effects their industry has on unborn health, while on the other, it seems we are seeking to undermine the life of some perfectly healthy children, solely based on the fact that their mother doesn't want them.

Observations?

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/pdf/2008/en.si.2008.0255.pdf

Tobacco packaging warning messages - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Are you suggesting that some kind of health-warning re abortion should be placed on people's genitals (or some other appropriate point)?

It would seem to be one thing one might logically take from your post - in so far as one can logically take anything from what is obviously a Trojan Horse for yet another abortion thread.

I'd suggest the thread be zooed, but it would be too kind.
.
 

drummed

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
Are you suggesting that some kind of health-warning re abortion should be placed on people's genitals (or some other appropriate point)?

It would seem to be one thing one might logically take from your post - in so far as one can logically take anything from what is obviously a Trojan Horse for yet another abortion thread.

I'd suggest the thread be zooed, but it would be too kind.
.
Ah now! It's almost coherent and even has links. Not that i looked obviously but they might even work.
Give him a break. It takes a special kind of genius to keep coming up with this stuff day after day after day.
You go and see how many random issues you can link abortion to, its not so easy.
 

Munnkeyman

Moderator
Joined
Jul 14, 2010
Messages
7,189
Are you suggesting that some kind of health-warning re abortion should be placed on people's genitals (or some other appropriate point)?

It would seem to be one thing one might logically take from your post - in so far as one can logically take anything from what is obviously a Trojan Horse for yet another abortion thread.

I'd suggest the thread be zooed, but it would be too kind.
.
Please don't post any pictures illustrating your brilliant new idea. Please.
 

mr. jings

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Joined
Mar 31, 2008
Messages
8,095
Sorry, can't get my head around the first sentence in the OP.

Oh look, Training Day is about to start on the Telly...
 

drummed

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Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
Please don't post any pictures illustrating your brilliant new idea. Please.
Can we not just cull this one now? Just for a laugh. Bet we get a brilliant flounce thread out of it.
That's just what the site needs right now, another flounce/feedback thread.

 

Radix

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Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Messages
10,031
Yes. But lets not let the facts obscure a perfectly promising rant and rave thread re abortion. Its just what the site needs afterall.

No, the thread is about cultural norms; we protect life with some statutes and with other lives we are equivocal.

For farmers it is like having a scheme to preserve John Deere tractors, whilst simultaneously introducing a scrappage scheme for them, and all by statute.

We either love John Deeres of all ages or we hate them all.

As a John Deere lover you will appreciate this.

Have to confess we have a much loved Davy Brown.

:)
 

drummed

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Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
I only love Fendts. Everything else is rubbish.

Your now comparing a scrappage scheme for John Deere's with abortion as some sort of cultural discussion. Way to go poster!!!!!! Even i did'nt see that angle.
 

Radix

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Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Messages
10,031
Are you suggesting that some kind of health-warning re abortion should be placed on people's genitals (or some other appropriate point)?


Not at all Mitsy; you're being more than a bit dismissive, read the OP again.

We officially have a policy on preserving early human life, hence our published policies with regards to consuming tobacco products by pregnant women, but at the same time we now seem to be intent on publishing another policy which also will adversely affect them.

Abortion does 'terminate' life you know.

Tobacco smoking 'may adversely affect unborn life'.

It's there on our officially published statutes.
 

drummed

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Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
Bad tractor puns alert.
 

Radix

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Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Messages
10,031
Think there's a big difference to be honest in the state ensuring knowledge about the effects of smoking compared to giving people, in very exceptional circumstances the option to abort a child when their own life is in danger. No?

I have no difficulty with saving mother's lives in any circumstance, but you are missing the point that 'suicide' is not an external threat to a mother's life, but rather a self imposed internal one; the clue is in the name.

How do we differentiate between one case and another?

And also, sticking with my own OP, if we officially consider it necessary to tell mothers that smoking can harm our babies, how then can we also introduce laws which will have a terminal effect to those same children based on possibly nebulous threats of self harm?
 

drummed

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
37,438
I have no difficulty with saving mother's lives in any circumstance, but you are missing the point that 'suicide' is not an external threat to a mother's life, but rather a self imposed internal one; the clue is in the name.

How do we differentiate between one case and another?

And also, sticking with my own OP, if we officially consider it necessary to tell mothers that smoking can harm our babies, how then can we also introduce laws which will have a terminal effect to those same children based on possibly nebulous threats of self harm?
Its a total mystery.
 

darkhorse

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 12, 2005
Messages
18,210
Given the current political climate surrounding Taoiseach Enda Kenny TD's announcement that our statute books are to be amended legislatively to permit the practice of at the very least, more than harmful procedures to some babies, I wonder at how this conflicts with other statutory measures currently in place aimed at reducing the harm to unborn babies by other practices.

To me this latest move by the Taoiseach suggests an institutional and cultural division emerging in contemporary Irish public life, where on the one hand we endeavour through statutory instrument to protect our unborn children, by forcing tobacco manufacturers to tell the truth about the effects their industry has on unborn health, while on the other, it seems we are seeking to undermine the life of some perfectly healthy children, solely based on the fact that their mother doesn't want them.

Observations?

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/pdf/2008/en.si.2008.0255.pdf

Tobacco packaging warning messages - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Its certainly a contradiction
You cant smoke while pregnant because it will harm your baby
But you can kill him altogether via abortion
Not sure how they square that one ...
 
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