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The British Army's Secret Deal With The Attorney General.


james toney

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Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
16,066
After the discovery of declassified statements and documents from the ministry of defence, it is apparent that a secret deal existed between the Army and the attorney general,where by the most senior soldier in Northern Ireland,Gen Frank King lobbied the AG.
This is just further evidence of collusion between different parts of the british establishment of the time.
Lieutenant General Frank King sought to prevent soldiers from being prosecuted by the courts, for a range of offences, some of which included murder.King said “Attorney General has now undertaken to invite my views on the public interest in aspects of the prosecution of a soldier arising out of an operational shooting incident before any final decision in the case is reached.”King also called for soldiers to be exempt from any civil law.
The documents reveal assurances given to army chiefs by then Attorney General, Sir Peter Rawlinson, that his officials were not “unsympathetic” to the plight of soldiers in Northern Ireland and would do all in their powers to avoid prosecutions.

http://www.thedetail.tv/system/uploads/files/275/original/p Army chief sets out confidential agreement with Attorney General.pdf?1365767595

So the attorney general at the time sought the views of General King before any decision was made as to the prosecution of a soldier.Given that,the chances of any british soldier facing trial for crimes committed were very slim indeed.
Yet it didn't stop the Army from paying out compensation to victims families that were murdered by soldiers.

http://www.thedetail.tv/system/uploads/files/276/original/fatality cases settled (excluding Bloody Sunday).jpg?1365767932

Families are calling for cases that involved the lobbying and meetings between the army and the DPP to be reviewed,and reopened.
The documents, uncovered by researchers from the Pat Finucane Centre, reveal:

• The Attorney General was “always ready to receive representations” from army officers to prevent soldiers being charged with serious crimes.

• Less than 10% of all cases submitted to the DPP, regarding shootings or assault incidents involving soldiers, resulted in prosecutions.

• MoD officials were assured that the Attorney General and DPP were all ex-army and by “no means unsympathetic” to the plight of soldiers.

• By 1976 the British army had paid out the equivalent of £5.7m in today’s money in more than 400 out-of-court settlements to avoid soldiers being convicted of unlawful shootings and assaults on civilians.

• The army’s most senior soldier warned that any decision to convict soldiers would force the British army to review its entire operation in Northern Ireland.

Declassified documents reveal army lobbied Attorney General not to prosecute soldiers | TheDetail.tv
 
Last edited:


Ren84

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Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Messages
49,992
This is just one of many reasons why the British state and unionists would be so opposed to any truth commission. How many skeletons in the closet are there?
 

CarnivalOfAction

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
16,545
After the discovery of declassified statements and documents from the ministry of defence, it is apparent that a secret deal existed between the Army and the attorney general,where by the most senior soldier in Northern Ireland,Gen Frank King lobbied the AG.
This is just further evidence of collusion between different parts of the british establishment of the time.
Lieutenant General Frank King sought to prevent soldiers from being prosecuted by the courts, for a range of offences, some of which included murder.King said “Attorney General has now undertaken to invite my views on the public interest in aspects of the prosecution of a soldier arising out of an operational shooting incident before any final decision in the case is reached.”King also called for soldiers to be exempt from any civil law.
The documents reveal assurances given to army chiefs by then Attorney General, Sir Peter Rawlinson, that his officials were not “unsympathetic” to the plight of soldiers in Northern Ireland and would do all in their powers to avoid prosecutions.

http://www.thedetail.tv/system/uploads/files/275/original/p Army chief sets out confidential agreement with Attorney General.pdf?1365767595

So the attorney general at the time sought the views of General King before any decision was made as to the prosecution of a soldier.Given that,the chances of any british soldier facing trial for crimes committed were very slim indeed.
Yet it didn't stop the Army from paying out compensation to victims families that were murdered by soldiers.

http://www.thedetail.tv/system/uploads/files/276/original/fatality cases settled (excluding Bloody Sunday).jpg?1365767932

Families are calling for cases that involved the lobbying and meetings between the army and the DPP to be reviewed,and reopened.
The documents, uncovered by researchers from the Pat Finucane Centre, reveal:

• The Attorney General was “always ready to receive representations” from army officers to prevent soldiers being charged with serious crimes.

• Less than 10% of all cases submitted to the DPP, regarding shootings or assault incidents involving soldiers, resulted in prosecutions.

• MoD officials were assured that the Attorney General and DPP were all ex-army and by “no means unsympathetic” to the plight of soldiers.

• By 1976 the British army had paid out the equivalent of £5.7m in today’s money in more than 400 out-of-court settlements to avoid soldiers being convicted of unlawful shootings and assaults on civilians.

• The army’s most senior soldier warned that any decision to convict soldiers would force the British army to review its entire operation in Northern Ireland.

Declassified documents reveal army lobbied Attorney General not to prosecute soldiers | TheDetail.tv
Despite murdering hundreds of unarmed civilians and colluding in the murder of hundreds more, British soldiers served a grand total of only five years in jail [the RUC none altho' they started the Troubles]. Nearly all the war-criminals who commanded the murderers received tin-tops & promotion:

https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/midlandscommunists/nMywgNLiMv4

"
General Sir Michael Jackson, Britain's most senior soldier, faced allegations of having played a key role in the cover up of the Bloody
Sunday killings. Documents from 1972, apparently in his handwriting, gave what lawyers to the Bloody Sunday families insisted was an inaccurate account of the shootings.


Michael Mansfield QC, representing two of the families, characterised one of the documents - a 'shot list' - dated 31st January 1972, in Jackson's handwriting as a "fabrication".
It was signed by Major Edward Loden, commander of 'support company' However, the body of the document was in a different handwriting, which the legal team representing most of the soldiers - including Jackson and Loden - agreed was Jackson's."

 

RedCloud

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 1, 2012
Messages
2,998
Just put THE Army.
All right minded people know what you mean. :)
 

NMunsterman

Well-known member
Joined
May 18, 2007
Messages
6,137
After the discovery of declassified statements and documents from the ministry of defence, it is apparent that a secret deal existed between the Army and the attorney general,where by the most senior soldier in Northern Ireland,Gen Frank King lobbied the AG.
This is just further evidence of collusion between different parts of the british establishment of the time.
Lieutenant General Frank King sought to prevent soldiers from being prosecuted by the courts, for a range of offences, some of which included murder.King said “Attorney General has now undertaken to invite my views on the public interest in aspects of the prosecution of a soldier arising out of an operational shooting incident before any final decision in the case is reached.”King also called for soldiers to be exempt from any civil law.
The documents reveal assurances given to army chiefs by then Attorney General, Sir Peter Rawlinson, that his officials were not “unsympathetic” to the plight of soldiers in Northern Ireland and would do all in their powers to avoid prosecutions.

http://www.thedetail.tv/system/uploads/files/275/original/p Army chief sets out confidential agreement with Attorney General.pdf?1365767595

So the attorney general at the time sought the views of General King before any decision was made as to the prosecution of a soldier.Given that,the chances of any british soldier facing trial for crimes committed were very slim indeed.
Yet it didn't stop the Army from paying out compensation to victims families that were murdered by soldiers.

http://www.thedetail.tv/system/uploads/files/276/original/fatality cases settled (excluding Bloody Sunday).jpg?1365767932

Families are calling for cases that involved the lobbying and meetings between the army and the DPP to be reviewed,and reopened.
The documents, uncovered by researchers from the Pat Finucane Centre, reveal:

• The Attorney General was “always ready to receive representations” from army officers to prevent soldiers being charged with serious crimes.

• Less than 10% of all cases submitted to the DPP, regarding shootings or assault incidents involving soldiers, resulted in prosecutions.

• MoD officials were assured that the Attorney General and DPP were all ex-army and by “no means unsympathetic” to the plight of soldiers.

• By 1976 the British army had paid out the equivalent of £5.7m in today’s money in more than 400 out-of-court settlements to avoid soldiers being convicted of unlawful shootings and assaults on civilians.

• The army’s most senior soldier warned that any decision to convict soldiers would force the British army to review its entire operation in Northern Ireland.

Declassified documents reveal army lobbied Attorney General not to prosecute soldiers | TheDetail.tv
David Caldwell should be along any minute now to advise that :

- "this is all relative"
- "by international standards, the British Army is obviously better than most"
- "by and large the British Army played by the book"
- "there were only a few bad apples"

and of course, " for the most part, more or less, to a certain degree, in a broad sense at least, a case could well be argued, that at all times a solemn commitment to the highest virtues were always - at least in principle - maintained and that a solemn undertaking to maintain traditional British values was always paramount "



Case dismissed.


Did I forget anything ?
 

NMunsterman

Well-known member
Joined
May 18, 2007
Messages
6,137
Yes.....your point.
Remind us all again of your description of the innocent unarmed civilians shot dead on Bloody Sunday in cold blood.
Or are you too chicken ?
 

DuineEile

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 29, 2010
Messages
14,939
Just put THE Army.
All right minded people know what you mean. :)

Eh. This is an Irish site. If we wish to refer to a foreign army, we should state what country that foreign army is from.

You are not in East Belfastshire now.

D
 

SgtBilko

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 11, 2011
Messages
7,400
Remind us all again of your description of the innocent unarmed civilians shot dead on Bloody Sunday in cold blood.
Or are you too chicken ?
I'm aware that you are fairly irrelevant with your fanciful, wishful thinking type posts.....but don't drag me into it.

If you want to talk about the bravery of young British Soldiers in Northern Ireland, open a thread on it and I'll consider contributing to it. Not here though....like yourself, it's not relevant.
 

NMunsterman

Well-known member
Joined
May 18, 2007
Messages
6,137
I'm aware that you are fairly irrelevant with your fanciful, wishful thinking type posts.....but don't drag me into it.

If you want to talk about the bravery of young British Soldiers in Northern Ireland, open a thread on it and I'll consider contributing to it. Not here though....like yourself, it's not relevant.
Chicken.
 

rmn640

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2011
Messages
669
Remind us all again of your description of the innocent unarmed civilians shot dead on Bloody Sunday in cold blood.
Or are you too chicken ?
I asked how the actual act of executing unarmed innocent civilians at point blank range was "brave", as he described it

Still waiting, so good luck
 

NMunsterman

Well-known member
Joined
May 18, 2007
Messages
6,137
I asked how the actual act of executing unarmed innocent civilians at point blank range was "brave", as he described it

Still waiting, so good luck
He's chicken - no chance he'll fess up.
 

james toney

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
16,066
This is just one of many reasons why the British state and unionists would be so opposed to any truth commission. How many skeletons in the closet are there?
No doubt there is many many more,you only have to look at the recent Da Silva report into collusion,where it said Loyalist paramilitaries got 85% of their information/intelligence from various british security forces,RUC,UDR,ect.
Some say that figure is generous,and is higher than that,the only thing they didn't do for Loyalists was wipe their arses,and tie their shoe laces for them.
Interesting to see how the latest evidence of collusion pans out.
 

RedCloud

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 1, 2012
Messages
2,998
No doubt there is many many more,you only have to look at the recent Da Silva report into collusion,where it said Loyalist paramilitaries got 85% of their information/intelligence from various british security forces,RUC,UDR,ect.
Some say that figure is generous,and is higher than that,the only thing they didn't do for Loyalists was wipe their arses,and tie their shoe laces for them.
Interesting to see how the latest evidence of collusion pans out.
When is a war not a war ?
When the cowardly pira death gangs start getting shot back at. :)
 

InsideImDancing

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 3, 2011
Messages
21,961
David Caldwell should be along any minute now to advise that :

- "this is all relative"
- "by international standards, the British Army is obviously better than most"
- "by and large the British Army played by the book"
- "there were only a few bad apples"

and of course, " for the most part, more or less, to a certain degree, in a broad sense at least, a case could well be argued, that at all times a solemn commitment to the highest virtues were always - at least in principle - maintained and that a solemn undertaking to maintain traditional British values was always paramount "



Case dismissed.


Did I forget anything ?
petunia POTWeek!
 
T

Thomas_

I'm aware that you are fairly irrelevant with your fanciful, wishful thinking type posts.....but don't drag me into it.

If you want to talk about the bravery of young British Soldiers in Northern Ireland, open a thread on it and I'll consider contributing to it. Not here though....like yourself, it's not relevant.
That would be quite interesting.
 

likesfish

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Joined
Feb 20, 2011
Messages
1,710
The British army killed 149 civillians in 30+ years not acceptable or justifiable by any means.:-(

But you put armed soldiers on the ground with people attempting to kill them innocents are going to die. Either by mistake, accident. Or a delibrate act of malice.
Strangely when PIRA went on ceasefire British army stopped being on the streets and civillians being killed stopped funny that?
 

eskrimador

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 17, 2009
Messages
11,991
The British army killed 149 civillians in 30+ years not acceptable or justifiable by any means.:-(

But you put armed soldiers on the ground with people attempting to kill them innocents are going to die. Either by mistake, accident. Or a delibrate act of malice.
Strangely when PIRA went on ceasefire British army stopped being on the streets and civillians being killed stopped funny that?
Funny you say that because in a few of the relatively recent HET reposrts, it's came out that the British soldiers made up activity to justify their killing of innocent people, including men dandering along the road (shot from the security of army sangers) and a litle girl on a quiet country road.
 

likesfish

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Joined
Feb 20, 2011
Messages
1,710
Which were probably both **** ups.
Firearms are dangerous add enough soldiers and enough time and mistakes will happen.
 

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