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The Britsh establishment take on Northern Ireland


Glaucon

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A bang on the money analysis, really:

“For 700 years the English in their folly sought to govern the Irish and employed every method including, alas, the plantation of colonists to achieve their aim. When they grew weary of ill-doing and decided towards the end of the 19th century to leave the Irish to their own devices their Scots-Calvinist colonists shouted, ‘Hey, what about us?’ ”
He said the North was a “tribal society and the two tribes” trusted “each other about as well as dog and cat, Arab and Jew, Greek and Turkish Cypriot.”
“in fear of domination by the South unionists took care to dominate the North”, with the British government perpetuating a “most unBritish-style injustice towards the Catholic minority”.
He described the B Specials as the RUC’s “paramilitary strong-arm squad” and wrote of how “two Paisleyites have won seats to that disgrace to democracy, the Belfast Corporation”, now Belfast City Council.
Makes you wonder how Westminster could have proven so inept in dealing with Northern Ireland's problems later on and why it took them so long to prorogue that shameful stain on British democracy, the old Stormont.
 

Cruimh

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Nice editing Glaucon

But the minority, though perhaps more sinned against than sinning, has been far from blameless . . . In true Irish fashion the Micks have enjoyed provoking the Prods as much as the Prods have enjoyed retaliating.
“Catholic attitudes have been at best ambivalent and at worst treacherous
Still happy That it is a bang on the money analysis? petunia
 

Glaucon

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Nice editing Glaucon



Still happy That it is a bang on the money analysis? petunia
Yes. I think there is a large measure of truth in the portion you quoted; Nationalists/Catholics were oppressed under the Northern régime, but were not blameless.
 

Gurdiev

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It all seems fairly astute , if uncharitable .analysis

Westminster did seem always to send unsuitable people to NI , who could manage to alienate all parties.
 

Swords Hoopster

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Nationalists/Catholics were oppressed under the Northern régime, but were not blameless.
I would agree with that also. I've said it hundreds of times. Both sides were culpable in bringing about "the troubles".
 

RedCloud

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I would agree with that also. I've said it hundreds of times. Both sides were culpable in bringing about "the troubles".
Ahh no. The pira death squads were wholly responsible for their murder campaign. No one else :)
 

Swords Hoopster

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Ahh no. The pira death squads were wholly responsible for their murder campaign. No one else :)
Yep. And you'll have Global Justice telling me it was entirely your sides fault.

I believe its called "themmuns Syndrome" ;)
 

RedCloud

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Just Jack

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Ahh no. The pira death squads were wholly responsible for their murder campaign. No one else :)
The UVF, RUC and British Army murdered over a dozen people before the PIRA fired a single shot.
 

RedCloud

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The UVF, RUC and British Army murdered over a dozen people before the PIRA fired a single shot.
Ummm, depends what your stating point is sonny. :)
 

RedCloud

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*starting
 

Cruimh

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Interesting:

He praised then Fianna Fáil taoiseach Jack Lynch’s realism.


He must come to realise that the only prospect of Irish unity lies in the seduction not the rape of the North. The South will, I suspect, be a long time a-wooing, if they ever start: the Irish tend to marry late, I believe.
Something Blythe and others had been saying for decades before 1970.
 

InsideImDancing

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Nice editing Glaucon



Still happy That it is a bang on the money analysis? petunia
He also said the Irish marry late. :) WTF?

Edit; Didn't see your comment above.
 

InsideImDancing

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J

Johnny Boy

Interesting link from today's Irish Times ....
This is an extract of a briefing document prepared by a senior civil servant for James Callaghan .Quite insightful , would you agree
Archive reveals senior British civil servant's frank view of Northern Ireland - Irish News, World News & More | The Irish Times - Sat, Mar 09, 2013
Thanks for that very revealing link.
I loved this bit:

“Catholic attitudes have been at best ambivalent and at worst treacherous. It makes the Prods’ blood boil – and all Irish blood boils at a very low temperature – to see the Micks enjoy the superior material benefits of the British connexion while continuing to wave the tricolour at them.”

It's amusingly condescending to both sides. It is how we are seen in London even today i.e. as outsiders, and all of us are seen as Irish)- this must be infuriating to some of the loyalist clowns on this forum:p), and ironically the SDLP are far more respected in Westminster as relatively modern pluralists who can be persuaded to vote against the teachings of the Church most of them belong to, while the DUP are seen as a joke party of uncouth rednecks, who are still stuck in 17th century superstition-land.
 
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Swords Hoopster

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the DUP are seen as a joke party of uncouth rednecks, who are still stuck in the 17th century.
Totally. They think that the British respect them for their supposed loyalty to queen and Country but in reality they look down upon them as a bunch of backward-ass bush-whackers.

They really are everyone's joke that lot.
 

Cruimh

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It is how we are seen in London even today i.e. as outsiders, and ironically the SDLP are more respected in Westminster as relatively modern pluralists who can be persuaded to vote against the teachings of the Church most of them belong to, while the DUP are seen as a joke party of uncouth rednecks, who are still stuck in the 17th century.
LOL - the SDLP are below the radar in Westminster.

Persuaded to vote against the teachings of the Church? Who was it played the Church Card when faced with the notion of increased integrated education ? Slither forward the stoops but of course SF followed closely .....
 
J

Johnny Boy

LOL - the SDLP are below the radar in Westminster.

Persuaded to vote against the teachings of the Church? Who was it played the Church Card when faced with the notion of increased integrated education ? Slither forward the stoops but of course SF followed closely .....
Catholic schools are popular for a reason. They are far more successful than their equivalents in the Controlled sector. Nationalist parties ignore that at their peril, and turkeys don't vote for Christmas.
But you're dodging the issue. You know as well as I do that the DUP are sneered at in Westminster becuause of their singular backwardness - the inarticulate contribution of David Simpson to the gay marriage debate was mortifying - "Adam and Eve/Adam and Steve" - and you vote for clowns like him because he makes you feel safe. :D
 
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