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The Free Movement of People scam

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
The Free Movement of People Directive is one of the biggest scams ever fostered on this country by the EU.

Free Movement of People Directive


Beneficiaries
1. This Directive shall apply to all Union citizens who move
to or reside in a Member State other than that of which they
are a national, and to their family members as defined in point
2 of Article 2 who accompany or join them.
2. Without prejudice to any right to free movement and
residence the persons concerned may have in their own right,
the host Member State shall, in accordance with its national
legislation, facilitate entry and residence for the following
persons:
(a) any other family members, irrespective of their nationality,
not falling under the definition in point 2 of Article 2 who,
in the country from which they have come, are dependants
or members of the household of the Union citizen
having
the primary right of residence, or where serious health
grounds strictly require the personal care of the family
member by the Union citizen;
(b) the partner with whom the Union citizen has a durable
relationship, duly attested.
This Article is being used by Nigerian scammers and Pakistani students to engage in fraudulent marriages in order to bi-pass our immigration policies. Now every failed asylum seeker and non-EU student can marry an EU citizen, usually from Eastern Europe, and get residence based on this scam. Not only that but the Polish or Latvian spouse can be brought over for the sole purpose of engaging in this fraud.

The family members or dependents includes parents, grandparents, children, brothers, sisters or any other 'dependants' the scammers can come up with. So a failed Nigerian asylum seeker or a student can enter the country, engage in a sham marriage and then claim his relatives are now dependant or members of the household of the EU citizen and bring the whole family over here.

The checks allowed for this are extremely flimsy because of the directive so the State has very little scope for stopping this fraud.


Article 24
Equal treatment
1. Subject to such specific provisions as are expressly
provided for in the Treaty and secondary law, all Union citizens
residing on the basis of this Directive in the territory of the
host Member State shall enjoy equal treatment with the
nationals of that Member State within the scope of the Treaty.
The benefit of this right shall be extended to family members
who are not nationals of a Member State and who have the
right of residence or permanent residence.

2. By way of derogation from paragraph 1, the host
Member State shall not be obliged to confer entitlement to
social assistance during the first three months of residence
or,
where appropriate, the longer period provided for in Article
14(4)(b),
This Article completely over-ruled the 2 year ban on social welfare that was declared by the government at the time of enlargement in order to stop welfare tourism. This was anounced at the time following a similar anouncement by the UK.

We now have the situation that any EU citizen and their non-EU 'family members' can claim social welfare by looking for work and claim all the additional benefits like social housing, medical cards, childrens allowance etc etc etc.
 


mackthenack

Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2009
Messages
49
The Free Movement of People Directive is one of the biggest scams ever fostered on this country by the EU.

Free Movement of People Directive




This Article is being used by Nigerian scammers and Pakistani students to engage in fraudulent marriages in order to bi-pass our immigration policies. Now every failed asylum seeker and non-EU student can marry an EU citizen, usually from Eastern Europe, and get residence based on this scam. Not only that but the Polish or Latvian spouse can be brought over for the sole purpose of engaging in this fraud.

The family members or dependents includes parents, grandparents, children, brothers, sisters or any other 'dependants' the scammers can come up with. So a failed Nigerian asylum seeker or a student can enter the country, engage in a sham marriage and then claim his relatives are now dependant or members of the household of the EU citizen and bring the whole family over here.

The checks allowed for this are extremely flimsy because of the directive so the State has very little scope for stopping this fraud.




This Article completely over-ruled the 2 year ban on social welfare that was declared by the government at the time of enlargement in order to stop welfare tourism. This was anounced at the time following a similar anouncement by the UK.

We now have the situation that any EU citizen and their non-EU 'family members' can claim social welfare by looking for work and claim all the additional benefits like social housing, medical cards, childrens allowance etc etc etc.
That's half the scam. The other bit is the use of the racist card to supress opposition to it. This scam has been going on for a while now. I suppose it took a recession to concentrate peoples minds against it.
 

FutureTaoiseach

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 20, 2005
Messages
7,980
Website
greatdearleader.blogspot.com
This is a major issue in this campaign and underlines the necessity of voting for Libertas next Friday. No other party supports tighter immigration controls within the EU. Finally the Irish people are being presented with the choice of voting for candidates who favour tighter controls. An electoral revolt against the elite beckons next Friday.
 
G

Geckko

Did you think the EU was some sort of money funnel that sent gushing loads of cash Ireland's way????

It is an EU policy. You can take your Philippino wife to Germany and Hans can bring his to Ireland.
 

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
Did you think the EU was some sort of money funnel that sent gushing loads of cash Ireland's way????

It is an EU policy. You can take your Philippino wife to Germany and Hans can bring his to Ireland.
The problem is not that Hans can take his genuine wife and family here and vice versa, the problem is that any bogus asylum seeker, bogus student or illegal immigrant can arrange a fraudulant marriage or pretense partnership to an Eastern European and gain full residency rights. They can then bring any relatives they want and claim social welfare. That's what's happening now.
 

euroboy

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 8, 2008
Messages
322
The OP has distorted the quoted articles.

The Directive provides for member states to protect themselves from marriages of convience

And on the OP's second point, that of welfare entitlment. After 3 months member states cannot discriminate between home nationals and foreign EU nationals(and their families). The Irish government have gotten around this by applying the 2 year rule to Irish nationals.
 

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
The OP has distorted the quoted articles.

The Directive provides for member states to protect themselves from marriages of convience
Marriages of convenience are very hard to prove which was why the State originally insisted that they had to be living in another Member State prior to moving here. This was overturned in the ECJ "Metock" case. The evidence of proof required for residence is set out in the directive making it even more difficult to prove:

2. For the residence card to be issued, Member States shall
require presentation of the following documents:
(a) a valid passport;
(b) a document attesting to the existence of a family relationship
or of a registered partnership;
(c) the registration certificate or, in the absence of a registration
system, any other proof of residence in the host
Member State of the Union citizen whom they are accompanying
or joining;
(d) in cases falling under points (c) and (d) of Article 2(2),
documentary evidence that the conditions laid down
therein are met;
(e) in cases falling under Article 3(2)(a), a document issued by
the relevant authority in the country of origin or country
from which they are arriving certifying that they are dependants
or members of the household of the Union citizen, or
proof of the existence of serious health grounds which
strictly require the personal care of the family member by
the Union citizen;
(f) in cases falling under Article 3(2)(b), proof of the existence
of a durable relationship with the Union citizen.

And on the OP's second point, that of welfare entitlment. After 3 months member states cannot discriminate between home nationals and foreign EU nationals(and their families). The Irish government have gotten around this by applying the 2 year rule to Irish nationals.
This applies to Jobseeker's Benefit not Jobseeker's Allowance and other social welfare payments.
 

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
As an EU citizen with a non-EEA wife and child, I am very happy with the law that allows us to live anywhere in the EU, as a family.

Do you object to me and my family living here?
Absolutely not, you sound like you are in a genuine marriage and not trying to fraudulently abuse our immigration policies.
 

seabhcan

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
14,228
Absolutely not, you sound like you are in a genuine marriage and not trying to fraudulently abuse our immigration policies.
The law only applies to genuine marriages. The authorities can, and do, evaluate all EEA Family Permit applications on a case by case basis, and we have to supply evidence that we are truely living as a family (ie. proof of a joint address, etc). Sometimes they even ask to see the wedding photos.

I think the number of fake marriages is exaggerated.
 

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
The law only applies to genuine marriages. The authorities can, and do, evaluate all EEA Family Permit applications on a case by case basis, and we have to supply evidence that we are truely living as a family (ie. proof of a joint address, etc). Sometimes they even ask to see the wedding photos.

I think the number of fake marriages is exaggerated.
The majority of these marriages are between Nigerians/Pakistanis and Polish/Latvians, there's no cultural or historical ties between these countries, no shared first language and goes against all the normal trends of marriage.
 

seabhcan

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
14,228
The majority of these marriages are between Nigerians/Pakistanis and Polish/Latvians, there's no cultural or historical ties between these countries, no shared first language and goes against all the normal trends of marriage.
What do you mean by "the majority of these marages"?

The majority of scam marriages? Or the majority of EU-nonEU marriages?
 

TheLastPaddy

Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
26
The first people to negoitate free movement of people were the Irish who insisted on free movement to the UK after " independence " !! Suck it up.
Even if it were true, what has that got to do with anything? The issue here is abuse of process and undermining of EU law by non-EU migrants using sham marriages.
 

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
What do you mean by "the majority of these marages"?

The majority of scam marriages? Or the majority of EU-nonEU marriages?
The majority for applications for residence based on the directive i.e. EU citizens married to non-EU citizens.
 

Horace Horse

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 4, 2009
Messages
429
The first people to negoitate free movement of people were the Irish who insisted on free movement to the UK after " independence " !! Suck it up.

That was after centuries of free movement of English into Ireland, you dope. No one asked Cromwell to show a visa when he arrived in Ireland.
 

Lthse

Active member
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
142
Do you have stats to back up that claim? I find it surprising.
I believe stats were compiled after the ECJ judgement last year but haven't been able to find them online. They showed the largest numbers were between the countries I mentioned, accounting for more than half of all appliations. I am reliably informed that it's an open secret in the various departments working in immigration that there's wide abuse going on. There has been criminal networks setting up sham marriages for Pakistanis arrested in Spain and Belgium. I believe it's worse here because of the high numbers of East Europeans and Pakistani students.
 

seabhcan

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
14,228
I believe stats were compiled after the ECJ judgement last year but haven't been able to find them online. They showed the largest numbers were between the countries I mentioned, accounting for more than half of all appliations. I am reliably informed that it's an open secret in the various departments working in immigration that there's wide abuse going on. There has been criminal networks setting up sham marriages for Pakistanis arrested in Spain and Belgium. I believe it's worse here because of the high numbers of East Europeans and Pakistani students.
The authorities have wide powers to examine the validity of marriages, and the EEA Family Permit is only available to co-habiting married couples. Its surprising, considering the hassel they put us through, that such a vast scam can continue unhindered.
 


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