The Greens? - What could have been!

McDave

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Germany's Greens second most popular party
Germany's Green Party has nosed ahead of the Social Democrats (SPD) in an opinion poll for the first time to become the country’s second most popular political party.

Some 30 years after emerging from Germany’s anti-nuclear, environmentalist and pacifist movements, the party has soared to 24 per cent support in the Forsa poll, published this morning in Stern magazine.
Germany's Greens second most popular party - The Irish Times - Thu, Oct 07, 2010

The German Greens acquitted themselves quite well in government and had a good idea what they wanted to achieve. They've been slaughtered a couple of times in the polls, but have managed to maintain a continuous political and intellectual presence in Germany, nationally, regionally and locally. And with divisions on the left damaging the SPD, the Greens seem to be back with a bang.

But that the Irish Greens had looked down the line to an Ireland after the (predictable) crash and stayed at arms length from FF. They'd now be reaping their fair share of the vote that's flooding towards Labour. Instead they face political extinction (I don't think they'll survive as a political force in Ireland after their spell in government - Labour will steal too many of their clothes.)

Any views?
 


dresden8

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They're finished because they're stupid and they're greedy.

When they are destroyed they will not be able to protect their "achievements" from the other parties agendas.

Expect the stag hunt to get their licence.
 

GDPR

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The Greens have done well in government, both in terms of their own agenda and in terms of showing some real spine, which to be honest I would not have given them credit for prior to this spell in Government.

The people in the Green party may change after the next election but the Greens will not disappear as a political force, they will come again and good luck to them for the future in that.
 

leroy42

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Totally disagree Tonic, I can only see wipeout for the Greens, which I believe is a same (as in the 'Green' agenda is a worthwhile one but totally betrayed by this party).

They gained most of their vote base by being seen as the honest party, removed from the usual double-speak etc. They had a clear vision, a clear agenda. They wanted to make the world a safer and cleaner place. Thus when Sargent said he would not lead the Greens into government, people quite righly believed that this meant the Greens would not go into government. Of course Greens will argue that HE kept his word, but the preception is that we we're conned.

I don't believe that anybody who cast a vote for the Greens last time did so thinking that that could potentially help keep FF in government.

Since then the Greens have tried to come across as doing the right thing, even it is not the easy thing, which is very worthy. However, even this falls flat when they vote confidence in Willie, O'Donohue etc. Seems they are more interested in staying in power than what is right, and without the perception of being sthically superior to the other parties they just bocome another party, hence FF Lite.

Without a USP, they will disappear as they become an irrelevance. Why bother voting for a Green TD in the next election, they won't get anywhere near government, they won't have many other TD's (if any) and many of the Green principles as now seen as nothing more than money raising stealth taxes.

Will the 'Green' Party survice, quite probably, as I believe that the underlining philiosphy is correct (save the planet et al) but none of the current memebers will play a role in the future.
 

Asparagus

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The Greens have done well in government, both in terms of their own agenda and in terms of showing some real spine, which to be honest I would not have given them credit for prior to this spell in Government.

The people in the Green party may change after the next election but the Greens will not disappear as a political force, they will come again and good luck to them for the future in that.
<what tonic really means>

The Greens have done well in Fianna fail, both in terms our agenda and in terms of abdicating any semblence of a spine, which to be honest I could not have hoped for prior to this spell in Government.

The people in the Green party will change after the next election and the Greens will probably disappear as a political force, they were a nice mudguard that made very little demands and they have their pensions now so good luck to them for the future with that.
 

QuizMaster

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It has to be said the German Greens have turned in to SPD lite to some extent, but that said, it's nice to see some Greens somewhere doing something right.
I grieve for our Greens, though hopefully after the election they will be transformed back into something resembling the party I joined.
 

turdsl

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Any party that says elections would cause instability, frightens me, Is it that they want to take away democracy away from the people, or is that when our full economic position becomes known, the people will revolt and tanks, if we have any, will be required to clear the streets.
 

controller

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The 1 party that I had hopes for, who were going to end the cronyism & corruption that exist in Irish Politics. They have turned into everything that they appeared to be against
 

GDPR

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Totally disagree Tonic, I can only see wipeout for the Greens, which I believe is a same (as in the 'Green' agenda is a worthwhile one but totally betrayed by this party).

They gained most of their vote base by being seen as the honest party, removed from the usual double-speak etc. They had a clear vision, a clear agenda. They wanted to make the world a safer and cleaner place. Thus when Sargent said he would not lead the Greens into government, people quite righly believed that this meant the Greens would not go into government. Of course Greens will argue that HE kept his word, but the preception is that we we're conned.

I don't believe that anybody who cast a vote for the Greens last time did so thinking that that could potentially help keep FF in government.

Since then the Greens have tried to come across as doing the right thing, even it is not the easy thing, which is very worthy. However, even this falls flat when they vote confidence in Willie, O'Donohue etc. Seems they are more interested in staying in power than what is right, and without the perception of being sthically superior to the other parties they just bocome another party, hence FF Lite.

Without a USP, they will disappear as they become an irrelevance. Why bother voting for a Green TD in the next election, they won't get anywhere near government, they won't have many other TD's (if any) and many of the Green principles as now seen as nothing more than money raising stealth taxes.

Will the 'Green' Party survice, quite probably, as I believe that the underlining philiosphy is correct (save the planet et al) but none of the current memebers will play a role in the future.
You don't need a "green" party to vote for, you need what you thought you had, an anti FF party.

They have gone into Government at the toughest time possible and stuck it out, didn't panic at polls (something not all parties can say of themselves) and done what they thought was right.

They may suffer at the next election, they may not, it's always hard to say with smaller parties, but if they do badly at least they will know that when they got their chance they weren't found wanting and did the best they could in the circumstances both for their own agenda and for the country.

I for one salute them for it.
Thank you ladies and gentlemen of the Green.
 

Maximus Cynicus

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The 1 party that I had hopes for, who were going to end the cronyism & corruption that exist in Irish Politics. They have turned into everything that they appeared to be against
Yep, €3,600 a week and generous expenses can do that to ya, allegedly
 

turdsl

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Delighted to see Fianna Fail pay respect to the Green party for their support. I would think a kiss from a rattlesnake would be more welcome, The last signature on a death warrant. It is important that each bring the other down.
 

Asparagus

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Delighted to see Fianna Fail pay respect to the Green party for their support. I would think a kiss from a rattlesnake would be more welcome, The last signature on a death warrant. It is important that each bring the other down.
brian cowen - john, you complete me...... going forward *hic*
 

Asparagus

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You don't need a "green" party to vote for, you need what you thought you had, an anti FF party.

They have gone into Government at the toughest time possible and stuck it out, didn't panic at polls (something not all parties can say of themselves) and done what they thought was right.

They may suffer at the next election, they may not, it's always hard to say with smaller parties, but if they do badly at least they will know that when they got their chance they weren't found wanting and did the best they could in the circumstances both for their own agenda and for the country.

I for one salute them for it.
Thank you ladies and gentlemen of the Green.

you actually laughed when you typed that, didn't you... ?
 

oceanclub

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I for one salute them for it.
Thank you ladies and gentlemen of the Green.
I am sure your kind words will be of great comfort to them when they're eating ************************ at the next election.

P.
 

Cassandra Syndrome

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german greenparty sounds like one of the worst manifestations from Dante's Inferno.

They say that if the Eskimos have 50 different words for "snow" , then there are 50 different words in German for bureaucracy. So imagine a greenparty thrown into that mix?
 

zeleneye

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The German Greens acquitted themselves quite well in government and had a good idea what they wanted to achieve.
The German Greens (as with Greens elsewhere: Belgium, Finland...) suffered badly initially after being in government, as different factions had different ideas of what they wanted to achieve. Government decisions (like on Kosovo and on labour reform) cost them some of their hard left members; sound familiar? In the initial elections afterwards (state level) they were punished, however they did ok in the federal elections and went back into government. It doesn't look likely that the Irish Greens will get off as lightly though.

Polls are what they are though. The German Greens are polling well now because of a number of headline issues in Germany that the Greens are leading on (opposition to nuclear extensions and Stuttgart 21 - a controversial rail infrastructure project). Federal elections are a few years away though.
 

Baron von Biffo

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Germany's Greens second most popular party - The Irish Times - Thu, Oct 07, 2010

The German Greens acquitted themselves quite well in government and had a good idea what they wanted to achieve. They've been slaughtered a couple of times in the polls, but have managed to maintain a continuous political and intellectual presence in Germany, nationally, regionally and locally. And with divisions on the left damaging the SPD, the Greens seem to be back with a bang.

But that the Irish Greens had looked down the line to an Ireland after the (predictable) crash and stayed at arms length from FF. They'd now be reaping their fair share of the vote that's flooding towards Labour. Instead they face political extinction (I don't think they'll survive as a political force in Ireland after their spell in government - Labour will steal too many of their clothes.)

Any views?
When in government, do the German Greens place most emphasis on policy or in fixing up their rejects with cushy jobs?
 

soubresauts

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It has to be said the German Greens have turned in to SPD lite to some extent, but that said, it's nice to see some Greens somewhere doing something right.
I grieve for our Greens, though hopefully after the election they will be transformed back into something resembling the party I joined.
Some hope!

(And welcome back to our Humble P.ie abode, QM.)
 

GDPR

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I am sure your kind words will be of great comfort to them when they're eating ************************ at the next election.

P.
Sometimes it's about a lot more than votes, this last 2 years have been one of those times and the Greens in Government have been big enough to both realise that and act upon it.
 


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