The Last Debate: Varadkar v Martin v McDonald.

Volatire

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Generation rent: ‘There’s no hope of any of us buying a house’

'A group who could decide Election 2020, on their political priorities'


about 4 hours ago


Jennifer O'Connell

"Housing has become one of the dominant issues the 2020 general election, and the cohort sometimes glibly referred to as “generation rent” could yet be the ones to decide its outcome. This is the demographic in their late 20s or 30s .​
"Typically, they have a good education and excellent career prospects. [...] Their adult lives have not been blighted by recession or negative equity. […]​
"Yet they see little prospect of ever being able to afford to buy a home. And for some, this means they are left feeling stuck on the cusp of adulthood, unable to move forward to the next stage of life.​

28-year-old Muireann Nagle & two of her housemates – all friends from Tipperary:

"The house they share costs €2,800 per month to rent, which they agree is reasonable for the area. But it still represents a significant chunk of their income.​
Collapsing the property market is unofficial SF policy it would seem.

It worked out so well in 2008, SF/MI5 want to do it all over again.
 


Marcella

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Are there any further opinion polls released prior to the election or is that it ?
 

AhNowStop

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You do realise that an alternative to something you don't like can be something you like even less?

SFs alternative is to take us back to 1977. The only thing they forgot is the abolition of car tax.

Edit: Typo.
ok you cant be persuaded thats fine .. but what about option 1 & option 2 ...


Option 1
FF & SF or FG & SF make a deal .. that means SF will be in government right now ...

Option 2 (and this is where is gets really interesting)
FF & FG carve up AGAIN
but this sticks them together even more than now .. with SF as the only real opposition ... It more or less guarantees the even more meteoric rise of SF as tweedledee & tweedledum will undoubtedly fuk up again .. Their greed & arrogance virtually assure it
So SF will definitely win "the next election" .. or the next war as you like to call it.


which option do you prefer ... surely it has to be one of them ?
 

StarryPlough01

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* Mary Lou McDonald is a Visionary Leader for Ireland*


'The party leaders' final #GE20 pitch.'
'Three questions. Three straight answers'





Sinn Fein - Mary Lou McDonald

Irish Examiner:
"Our readers have identified the need for better public services as an immediate priority. Can you highlight two policy initiatives in this regard whose achievement will be red line issues for you and your party / grouping in the next Dail term?​


Mary Lou McDonald:

"Sinn Féin has put housing at the centre of our general election manifesto, and we are absolutely committed to tackling the housing crisis and we will solve it.​
"The single biggest failure of Fine Gael in government, supported by Fianna Fáil, is that rents are too high, Council house waiting lists are too long and affordable accommodation is non-existent. A whole generation of young people are locked out of home ownership.​
"Sinn Féin’s Housing spokesperson Eoin Ó Broin has set out how we will deliver the biggest public housing programme in the history of State and how we will cut rents and freeze them.​
"We will ensure that affordable housing is available and actually affordable for people.​
"To do this we will introduce legislation to reduce rents by up to €1,500 a year, via a refundable tax credit, and freeze them for three years.​
"We will also build 100,000 homes over five years, to include Council housing and affordable homes for renters and first time buyers.​
[…]​
Tackling crime: " Sinn Féin are proposing to deliver the biggest Garda recruitment drive in the history of the State…​
"Sinn Féin will ensure that people will have the right to retire at the age of 65 with a State pension. We will stop the pension age increase to 67 and we will return it to 65.​
"Sinn Féin will also work towards Irish unity because it is what’s best for the future of our island.​
"Sinn Fein commits to work for the full implementation of the Good Friday Agreement and to establish an all-island representative Citizens Assembly to discuss and plan for Irish Unity.​
"In government, we Sinn Fein will publish a White Paper on Irish Unity, establish a Joint Oireachtas Committee on Irish Unity and secure a unity referendum, north and south.​
[…]​

Continue reading for other Leaders' answers.


"May the road rise up to meet you.
May the wind be always at your back.
May the sun shine warm upon your face;
the rains fall soft upon your fields and until we meet again,
may God hold you in the palm of His hand."
 

Mickeymac

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ok you cant be persuaded thats fine .. but what about option 1 & option 2 ...


Option 1
FF & SF or FG & SF make a deal .. that means SF will be in government right now ...

Option 2 (and this is where is gets really interesting)
FF & FG carve up AGAIN
but this sticks them together even more than now .. with SF as the only real opposition ... It more or less guarantees the even more meteoric rise of SF as tweedledee & tweedledum will undoubtedly fuk up again .. Their greed & arrogance virtually assure it
So SF will definitely win "the next election" .. or the next war as you like to call it.


which option do you prefer ... surely it has to be one of them ?

All he really really wants is ABSF sir, has no concern for the change the people want.
 

Baron von Biffo

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I know it's difficult without actual numbers but still maintain they'd be mad to go into government this time - if they can become the leading opposition party they're away on a hack.

For me the ONLY logical action is to force FF/FG together - easily answerable when media attacks SF for 'not wanting to be responsible' etc etc by saying that same is more applicable to FFG as their mantra was that SF would destroy the place so onus on FFG to get together 'in the national interest'.
What is it about SF that you seem to believe you can dictate what the other parties do?

FG and FF will do what they believe is in their own interest, not what the SF Ard Comhairle wants them to do.

Then sit back, watch your sweet, and wait for the next time round when you field plenty of candidates ...
Why would you assume that the next election would be the same for SF as this one rather than the 3 that went before it?
 

Baron von Biffo

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ok you cant be persuaded thats fine .. but what about option 1 & option 2 ...


Option 1
FF & SF or FG & SF make a deal .. that means SF will be in government right now ...
I don't see that as a realistic option this time.

Both FG and FF have been emphatic that they won't coalesce with SF and both realise that the price of a U-turn on that would likely be very high.

Option 2 (and this is where is gets really interesting)
FF & FG carve up AGAIN
but this sticks them together even more than now .. with SF as the only real opposition ... It more or less guarantees the even more meteoric rise of SF as tweedledee & tweedledum will undoubtedly fuk up again .. Their greed & arrogance virtually assure it
So SF will definitely win "the next election" .. or the next war as you like to call it.
Meteor might not be the best metaphor for your vision here. You'll recall that while they burn brilliantly they also burn briefly.

Suppose FG and FF do put together a deal whereby one governs with the support of the other, and suppose that government performs as you predict. Why do you assume that SF would be the beneficiaries?

The voters might say 'we voted SF last time because we wanted change but they let FG/FF back again. This time we'll go Green or Labour'.

which option do you prefer ... surely it has to be one of them ?
My preferred option is a few elections in quick succession in order to weed out independents and micro parties.
 

derryman

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I don't see that as a realistic option this time.

Both FG and FF have been emphatic that they won't coalesce with SF and both realise that the price of a U-turn on that would likely be very high.



Meteor might not be the best metaphor for your vision here. You'll recall that while they burn brilliantly they also burn briefly.

Suppose FG and FF do put together a deal whereby one governs with the support of the other, and suppose that government performs as you predict. Why do you assume that SF would be the beneficiaries?

The voters might say 'we voted SF last time because we wanted change but they let FG/FF back again. This time we'll go Green or Labour'.



My preferred option is a few elections in quick succession in order to weed out independents and micro parties.


The voters might say 'we voted SF last time because we wanted change but they let FG/FF back again.


How can SF force a coalition with either?
 

artfoley56

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I remember when Dev died people saying that now there was no obstacle to FF and FG merging.

That was 45 years ago.
Ah but there was back then as between they had over 70% of the vote. Now one of them will be wiped out in the next 20 years if they don't merge
 

dub14

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What is it about SF that you seem to believe you can dictate what the other parties do?

FG and FF will do what they believe is in their own interest, not what the SF Ard Comhairle wants them to do.



Why would you assume that the next election would be the same for SF as this one rather than the 3 that went before it?
Maybe because there's a trend. 2007: 4 seats off 7%. 2011: 14 seats off 10%. 2016: 23 seats off 14%. Likely to increase again this year.
 

dub14

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SF are going to be in government eventually so maybe now is as good a time as any.

A couple of years in office and then they'll be gone for a generation.
Labour's demise from 37 seats in 2011 to 7 seats in 2016 should be a lesson to SF on the perils of being the lessor of the 2. Can't see them going in this time even in the unlikely event that they are asked.
FF will probably lead the next government we all know that won't end well. SF may well have a chance at being the largest party next time out
 

Baron von Biffo

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Ah but there was back then as between they had over 70% of the vote. Now one of them will be wiped out in the next 20 years if they don't merge
What share of the vote had SF then?

Party fortunes was and wane and there's nothing to say that the next generation won't want 'change' and see FG and/or FF as the mechanism to achieve it.
 

Baron von Biffo

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Labour's demise from 37 seats in 2011 to 7 seats in 2016 should be a lesson to SF on the perils of being the lessor of the 2. Can't see them going in this time even in the unlikely event that they are asked.
FF will probably lead the next government we all know that won't end well. SF may well have a chance at being the largest party next time out
I think that it would be better if, when SF does get into government, it's the larger party. That way there will be absolutely nowhere to hide.
 

jmcc

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Ah but there was back then as between they had over 70% of the vote. Now one of them will be wiped out in the next 20 years if they don't merge
Faster if there's a United Ireland.
 


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