The lights to go out in Dublin? Power plants closing.

TheField

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 9, 2012
Messages
3,223
Of course, Dublin citizens need not fear as their power supply will be protected at all costs, even if it means switching off the culchies.

But this closure/ threatened closure by Viridian/ Energia of two power plants is potentially very significant. https://www.irishtimes.com/business/energy-and-resources/viridian-looks-to-close-two-dublin-power-stations-1.3373481

They claim to have the capacity to supply 20% of our electricity needs, that's a fair chunk. The Commission for Regulation of Utilities is only awarding a contract for supply to one plant and since Viridian is not a charity or public service, they are now proposing to shut down both plants. Minister Naughten had better get the finger out.

But what is behind this realignment? Is it the growth of the heavily subsidised wind turbine industry that is blighting many rural landscapes. Perhaps room has to be made for their generating capacity. And what happens when the wind don't blow? Hmm.
 


Volatire

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 25, 2012
Messages
13,436
Of course, Dublin citizens need not fear as their power supply will be protected at all costs, even if it means switching off the culchies.

But this closure/ threatened closure by Viridian/ Energia of two power plants is potentially very significant. https://www.irishtimes.com/business/energy-and-resources/viridian-looks-to-close-two-dublin-power-stations-1.3373481

They claim to have the capacity to supply 20% of our electricity needs, that's a fair chunk. The Commission for Regulation of Utilities is only awarding a contract for supply to one plant and since Viridian is not a charity or public service, they are now proposing to shut down both plants. Minister Naughten had better get the finger out.

But what is behind this realignment? Is it the growth of the heavily subsidised wind turbine industry that is blighting many rural landscapes. Perhaps room has to be made for their generating capacity. And what happens when the wind don't blow? Hmm.
The bullshít wind industry is entirely to blame.

Wind subsidies, including priority despatch, make real power plants that actually generate useful reliable power unprofitable.
 

Niall996

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 5, 2011
Messages
11,823
One good modern decent nuclear plant will deliver cheap energy for generations and proft profitably energy exports.
 

silverharp

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 21, 2015
Messages
16,272
ah sure with brexit, the UK economy will be in the sh1tter for decades, just buy cheap electricity of them
 

Spanner Island

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2011
Messages
23,974
One good modern decent nuclear plant will deliver cheap energy for generations and proft profitably energy exports.
All eggs in one basket isn't an ideal scenario...

What happens if something goes wrong with that single power source?

What happens if it's hacked and taken offline?

The entire country loses power?
 

McSlaggart

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 29, 2010
Messages
17,824
Of course, Dublin citizens need not fear as their power supply will be protected at all costs, even if it means switching off the culchies.

But this closure/ threatened closure by Viridian/ Energia of two power plants is potentially very significant. https://www.irishtimes.com/business/energy-and-resources/viridian-looks-to-close-two-dublin-power-stations-1.3373481

They claim to have the capacity to supply 20% of our electricity needs, that's a fair chunk. The Commission for Regulation of Utilities is only awarding a contract for supply to one plant and since Viridian is not a charity or public service, they are now proposing to shut down both plants. Minister Naughten had better get the finger out.

But what is behind this realignment? Is it the growth of the heavily subsidised wind turbine industry that is blighting many rural landscapes. Perhaps room has to be made for their generating capacity. And what happens when the wind don't blow? Hmm.
The issue is across the Island :

"The closure of Kilroot power station could have major political implications for Northern Ireland when it comes to Brexit negotiations, a senior DUP figure has warned. Sammy Wilson said the decision to shut the plant – with the loss of over 250 jobs – would increase Dublin’s control over the Province’s electricity supply and “strengthen its hand” on the issue of the Irish border post-Brexit."

Read more at: https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/bu...lson-1-8352513
 

Mushroom

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 27, 2009
Messages
15,474
The issue is across the Island :

"The closure of Kilroot power station could have major political implications for Northern Ireland when it comes to Brexit negotiations, a senior DUP figure has warned. Sammy Wilson said the decision to shut the plant – with the loss of over 250 jobs – would increase Dublin’s control over the Province’s electricity supply and “strengthen its hand” on the issue of the Irish border post-Brexit."

Read more at: https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/bu...lson-1-8352513
Maybe Wee Sammy and his DUP colleagues should consider introducing some sort of scheme to help Nordies to generate their own energy - they could call it something like the Renewable Heat and Light Initiative and make it easy for interested parties to apply for large grants.
 

Orbit v2

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
11,790
It's a complicated business. If they think there is a flaw in the auction process then they should point out exactly what the problem is. Otherwise, it's just sour grapes, that they are losing out on free money under the old capacity payment system. It's amusing that the people who whine most about subsidies for wind, are whining for these private fossil fuel burners to be given subsidies under the old inefficient system.

What exactly is the problem with a market for capacity based on efficiency?
 

publicrealm

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 11, 2007
Messages
5,902

From the link:

Eirgrid maintains that the move will save consumers and businesses €200 million, as the payments are funded through network charges paid by all electricity users.

Our electricity costs are way above the EU average. I wonder whether any such saving would actually result in lower 'network charges' for consumers, i.e. a reduction in bills - or might it instead be 're-invested' with no change in consumer levies?
 

TheField

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 9, 2012
Messages
3,223
Private company looking for state payout.
It's a complicated business. If they think there is a flaw in the auction process then they should point out exactly what the problem is. Otherwise, it's just sour grapes, that they are losing out on free money under the old capacity payment system. It's amusing that the people who whine most about subsidies for wind, are whining for these private fossil fuel burners to be given subsidies under the old inefficient system.

What exactly is the problem with a market for capacity based on efficiency?
No problem at all with a market for capacity based on efficiency. Power plants though are fairly critical pieces of infrastructure and you don't just build and then open/ close them willy nilly. Stability of contracts and income is going to be a significant factor for any private companies sinking money into this market.

The Minister and his civil servants better have their ducks in a row here. Because the potential for this to go pear shaped is significant. The plebs will not be pleased if their precious power supplies fail.
 

Volatire

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 25, 2012
Messages
13,436
It's a complicated business. If they think there is a flaw in the auction process then they should point out exactly what the problem is. Otherwise, it's just sour grapes, that they are losing out on free money under the old capacity payment system. It's amusing that the people who whine most about subsidies for wind, are whining for these private fossil fuel burners to be given subsidies under the old inefficient system.

What exactly is the problem with a market for capacity based on efficiency?
Clueless.
 
D

Deleted member 48908

From the link:

Eirgrid maintains that the move will save consumers and businesses €200 million, as the payments are funded through network charges paid by all electricity users.

Our electricity costs are way above the EU average. I wonder whether any such saving would actually result in lower 'network charges' for consumers, i.e. a reduction in bills - or might it instead be 're-invested' with no change in consumer levies?
Once the consumer becomes accustomed to paying a certain level of rates, they will seldom be reduced, but rather maintained at that level.
 

Orbit v2

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
11,790
No problem at all with a market for capacity based on efficiency. Power plants though are fairly critical pieces of infrastructure and you don't just build and then open/ close them willy nilly. Stability of contracts and income is going to be a significant factor for any private companies sinking money into this market.

The Minister and his civil servants better have their ducks in a row here. Because the potential for this to go pear shaped is significant. The plebs will not be pleased if their precious power supplies fail.
I was surprised that Viridian's older plant didn't qualify. It's still a fairly modern design.

I don't know the ins and outs of the bid process, but did they high-ball their bid in error? Unfortunate if so. But, these contracts are short term presumably, and they can bid again, next time, I presume
 

hollandia

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 11, 2012
Messages
30,151
Of course, Dublin citizens need not fear as their power supply will be protected at all costs, even if it means switching off the culchies.

But this closure/ threatened closure by Viridian/ Energia of two power plants is potentially very significant. https://www.irishtimes.com/business/energy-and-resources/viridian-looks-to-close-two-dublin-power-stations-1.3373481

They claim to have the capacity to supply 20% of our electricity needs, that's a fair chunk. The Commission for Regulation of Utilities is only awarding a contract for supply to one plant and since Viridian is not a charity or public service, they are now proposing to shut down both plants. Minister Naughten had better get the finger out.

But what is behind this realignment? Is it the growth of the heavily subsidised wind turbine industry that is blighting many rural landscapes. Perhaps room has to be made for their generating capacity. And what happens when the wind don't blow? Hmm.
Four days late, lads.

http://www.politics.ie/forum/northern-ireland/261818-kilroot-close-240-jobs-risk.html

The SEM is basically phasing out older plants by not awarding them contracts. Veridian are just playing hardball here. To suggest closing an inviable older plant makes your newer, more efficient plant unviable makes no sense whatsoever.
 

TheField

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 9, 2012
Messages
3,223
I was surprised that Viridian's older plant didn't qualify. It's still a fairly modern design.

I don't know the ins and outs of the bid process, but did they high-ball their bid in error? Unfortunate if so. But, these contracts are short term presumably, and they can bid again, next time, I presume
How would that work? Don't think you'd just mothball a power plant. Where are examples of this in Ireland? These things either run or shut down.
 

mr_anderson

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 12, 2007
Messages
9,709
Every house should have a little windmill where the old TV aerial used to sit.

No new plant or imported fossil fuels required.
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top