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The Martyrs of Louth and Meath


Kevin Parlon

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I've just read a piece on the IT which I am still trying to take in. I'm still trying to just take on board the fact that an Irish paper would publish such a piece. I don't know how else I'd describe it other than a whitewash/puff piece of travelling jihadists in Syria, titled "The Martyrs of Louth and Meath". The piece talks long and softly about the fate of these people but doesn't for a moment reflect on their motivation, or the type of society these men are fighting and dying to put in place. Zero reflection. Read and weep: The martyrs of Louth and Meath - The Irish Times - Sat, Mar 02, 2013

EDIT: The Irish Times seem to have moved to shut down the comments section attached to the referenced article.
 
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Eire1976

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I've just read a piece on the IT which I am still trying to take in. I'm still trying to just take on board the fact that an Irish paper would publish such a piece. I don't know how else I'd describe it other than a whitewash/puff piece of travelling jihadists in Syria, titled "The Martyrs of Louth and Meath". The piece talks long and softly about the fate of these people but doesn't for a moment reflect on their motivation, or the type of society these men are fighting a dying to put in place. Read and weep: The martyrs of Louth and Meath - The Irish Times - Sat, Mar 02, 2013
If they've gone off to fight for democracy and western values, the good luck to them.


If not, then let them stay there
 

parentheses

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I don't know how else I'd describe it other than a whitewash/puff piece of travelling jihadists in Syria, titled "The Martyrs of Louth and Meath".
What do you expect?

The Irish Times has been the voice of British imperialism in Ireland.

Covert British imperialism helps drive the Jihadi insurgency in Syria. Naturally the IT is chuffed that Ireland has become an incubator for naive youngsters to further the agenda of the empire
 

dunno

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First it carries several Moslem clerics or scholars who are opposed to travelling to Syria for jihad:

In October, however, an influential Saudi cleric, Salman al-Ouda, who has visited Ireland a number of times, advised Muslim youths against going to Syria to fight “so as not to give the regime a pretext” that it is battling “terrorists” who have infiltrated the country.

There are several of those critical voices regarding travelling jihadis in the article, supportive of a cause all reasoning people would back, but pointing out they are not needed. Did you read the article or did your weeping blind you to those points?

The FSA and other mujiahideen have greater need of weapons than men might be committed, but have no military experience. First Syrian peasant farmers ruined by drought, followed with a continual flow of Sunnis depart Batta Assad's army, together with under-employed urban workers ruined by economic reforms, means manpower isn't a priority. The Kurdish Peshmerga largely control the northern boundary, hostile Iraq, the west, with wary Lebanon, the east and cautious Jordan the south. Foreign fighters are not an efficient use of resources for them, really awkward to reinforce, and therefore are a minority.

Not surprising they shut down the comments. Syria related articles draw a torrent of insane Alex Jones types.

IMPERIALISTS! ILLUMINATI! REPITILIANS! ISRAEEEEEEL!
\
 
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Kevin Parlon

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First it carries several Moslem clerics or scholars who are opposed to travelling to Syria for jihad:

In October, however, an influential Saudi cleric, Salman al-Ouda, who has visited Ireland a number of times, advised Muslim youths against going to Syria to fight “so as not to give the regime a pretext” that it is battling “terrorists” who have infiltrated the country.

There are several of those critical voices regarding travelling jihadis in the article, supportive of a cause all reasoning people would back, but pointing out they are not needed. Did you read the article or did your weeping blind you to those points?

The FSA and other mujiahideen have greater need of weapons than men might be committed, but have no military experience. First Syrian peasant farmers ruined by drought, followed with a continual flow of Sunnis depart Batta Assad's army, together with under-employed urban workers ruined by economic reforms, means manpower isn't a priority. The Kurdish Peshmerga largely control the northern boundary, hostile Iraq, the west, with wary Lebanon, the east and cautious Jordan the south. Foreign fighters are not an efficient use of resources for them, and therefore are a minority.
My problem with the piece is that it ignores (or worse; treats as irrelevant) the ideology of those upon whom it focuses. These people are fighting and dying to establish a theocratic fascist state; something the author doesn't bother mentioning, instead portraying them as idealistic revolutionaries . The vileness of the Assad regime does not confer a 'pass' on those who would have him gone (and I wish him gone).
 

dunno

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My problem with the piece is that it ignoresthe ideology of those upon whom it focuses. These people are fighting and dying to establish a theocratic fascist state; something the author doesn't bother mentioning, instead portraying them as idealistic revolutionaries . The vileness of the Assad regime does not confer a 'pass' on those who would have him gone (and I wish him gone).
She does leave too far much unexamined in regard to religious radicalism (only the Christian radicals interest the IT and Guardian), but at least most fighters do not subscribe to radical jihadism. Some in the FSA promise that the next fight after Assad will be with Jabhat al Nusra. Mary Fitzgerald has written part of an interesting article, but it is lacking. The youths themselves are hardly ideologues. The greater interest would be to see if they have recruiters and the like, who would be.
 

freewillie

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She does leave too far much unexamined in regard to religious radicalism (only the Christian radicals interest the IT and Guardian), but at least most fighters do not subscribe to radical jihadism. Some in the FSA promise that the next fight after Assad will be with Jabhat al Nusra. Mary Fitzgerald has written part of an interesting article, but it is lacking. The youths themselves are hardly ideologues. The greater interest would be to see if they have recruiters and the like, who would be.
Poor young lads were probably brainwashed by their seniors to go and fight like the young gullible lads up North who wasted their lives in Long Kesh for a DUP government
 

Nordie Northsider

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I've given up on the Irish Times to be honest. It's a dead duck.
 

Analyzer

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I've given up on the Irish Times to be honest. It's a dead duck.
I gave up on it during the property boom, when Austin Hughes and Dan McLaughloin were thye "Two Pillar bank economists" on duty telling the readers to keep borrowing.

However, I am sure that there are rewards for any media organization which agrees with wealthy middle eastern oil based kleptocracies backing the retrenchment of social development in neighbouring countries.

THE SH!TE RIMES - in favour of feminism as long as the discussion is not about the Middle East ?
 

Abaddon

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I've given up on the Irish Times to be honest. It's a dead duck.
It wasn't great under Geraldine Kennedy but it's been positivley Indo under Kevin O'Sullivan.
 

florin

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The piece talks long and softly about the fate of these people but doesn't for a moment reflect on their motivation, or the type of society these men are fighting and dying to put in place. Zero reflection.[/URL]
Does it have to? Can't a newspaper just give facts and let readers reach their own conclusions? Beyond calling them martyrs, which is usually used in an ironic sense anyway, the IT doesn't really praise them.
 

Shpake

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Well it's so wierd that maybe there really is something fishy going on. Compare the Irish times version and the RTE broadcast of some sixteen year old from Navan (I think it was )
who was reported to either have been killed while doing humanitarian work or killed while taking part in the fighting ... depending on which news service you read.
I think you have to take a few steps back to understand this.
We, as a country : not just simply broke, but up to our eyeballs in debt.

Them: floatin' in it... oil, currency reserves... shows great promise for export contracts.

Now in this situation would any news service not wax lyrical about the heroic tales of the fallen martyrs in ... in .... where was it he was fighting again?
 

Nebuchadnezzar

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My problem with the piece is that it ignores (or worse; treats as irrelevant) the ideology of those upon whom it focuses. These people are fighting and dying to establish a theocratic fascist state; something the author doesn't bother mentioning, instead portraying them as idealistic revolutionaries . The vileness of the Assad regime does not confer a 'pass' on those who would have him gone (and I wish him gone).
Is Liwa al Umma trying to establish a theocratic fascist state? They seem to be a lot more moderate than al Nusra Front. They claim to want to follow the Turkish or Tunisian model of Islamic democracy. Now maybe that's just for the benefit of naive western ears but they have evolved out the Libyan Tripoli Brigade which AFAIK a relatively moderate group itself. The IT article seems fairly neutral to me and in any case it is about the death of an idealistic if perhaps misguided youth.
 

Little_Korean

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An unfortunate title but otherwise an interesting article on the sort of idealistic young men risking their lives (and sometimes losing them) for an adopted cause.

Not surprising that many of these imported fighters tend to be on the young side - it takes a while before the brain finally matures and makes you understand the folly of fights that aren't your own.
 

Shpake

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An unfortunate title but otherwise an interesting article on the sort of idealistic young men risking their lives (and sometimes losing them) for an adopted cause.

Not surprising that many of these imported fighters tend to be on the young side - it takes a while before the brain finally matures and makes you understand the folly of fights that aren't your own.
What young men do is one thing, but I am baffled at the Irish media glorifying the martyrs... are the new Irish a significant part of the readership, viewership now?
 

borntorum

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There's an article in the news section about the naming of the new Luas bridge in Dublin which seems to turn into a campaign piece for Labour Youth's attempts to get it named after a female trade unionist, complete with internet link to the campaign site. Strange behaviour from the so-called 'paper of record'
 

Kevin Parlon

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Does it have to? Can't a newspaper just give facts and let readers reach their own conclusions? Beyond calling them martyrs, which is usually used in an ironic sense anyway, the IT doesn't really praise them.
No it doesn't have to. But it is a 'feature' piece and not a news report. Feature pieces usually tease things apart in detail. If we were to rely on Fitzgerald for the full picture, we'd be seriously short-changed.
 

Kevin Parlon

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Eric Cartman

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Why is it when young Muslim immigrants join armed religious groups, to fight abroad, liberals are prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume their motivations are noble and idealistic?

When young Catholics rally peacefully in Dublin against abortion, liberals vent their collective spleens and have nothing but contempt and hatred for them?

These young Muslims have joined Islamist militias that have committed atrocities against minorities such as heterodox Muslims (Alawites, Nusairis, Yezidis and Druses), Christians (13% of population) and Shia.

Personally, I am glad they have died. Bashar Al Assad is infinitely more satisfactory than these vicious Islamists. I hope more die over there, rather than return here radicalized.
 
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