The obvious way to change the present corrupt, inept political environment and no action is needed.

valamhic

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While hope springs eternal,  there comes a time in life when we have to accept the situation is beyond redemption.     Old age, terminal illness or the car is a bangger and not worth repairing.  Nothing is immune, not even the Irish political system.  It’s broken beyond repair in the present environment.  Trying to change it within the current environment is futile.  . We don’t have Britain to run the country any more and the EU keeps out of day to day administration.     In some areas UN and EU law can be used break the cycle of corruption such as in regard to the environment and the planning process, but it’s limited in scope.

It cannot be fixed by voting.   There is no ability in Fianna Fail or Fine Gael to bring about change even if the will was there.  There is nothing in Sinn Fein either.   They are already corrupt in regard to environmental planning law breaking, even if you forgive their murky past.

As for independents, Katherine Zapone and Shane Ross are now running with the hounds.  

The first step in getting out of a hole is stop digging,  boycott the lot except the handful of TD’s who do their best.   30% voter turn out. That means:

Don’t vote and persuade others not to vote in general elections.
Form groups to go negative campaigning against the main offenders.


There must be priority in the process.    Identify and cripple being the motto.

So,     I would single out Frances Fitzgerald,   Simon Covney,  Eamon Ryan, Catherine Martin, Dennis Naughton,   L. Varadkar , Charlie Flanegan and  M. Martin and Damien English. Weaken the establishment as much as possible.   The objective being to change the political environment to a point where new entrants to the political system will be encouraged.

New entrants to politics cannot emerge while the established parties hold a grip on the Department of Finance, Justice and housing.    It’s like demolishing an old derelict building in order to build a replacement.   I went door to door last time to oust Alex White and it worked.

Have nothing to do with them,  you don’t set up a holiday tent in a landfill site.
 


cobra

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dont do twittering nonsense
Good luck with that.
There is no one involved in so called 'politics' except for for their own enrichment, be it financial (usually) or power.
 

valamhic

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Apple in Eden

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While hope springs eternal,  there comes a time in life when we have to accept the situation is beyond redemption.     Old age, terminal illness or the car is a bangger and not worth repairing.  Nothing is immune, not even the Irish political system.  It’s broken beyond repair in the present environment.  Trying to change it within the current environment is futile.  . We don’t have Britain to run the country any more and the EU keeps out of day to day administration.     In some areas UN and EU law can be used break the cycle of corruption such as in regard to the environment and the planning process, but it’s limited in scope.

It cannot be fixed by voting.   There is no ability in Fianna Fail or Fine Gael to bring about change even if the will was there.  There is nothing in Sinn Fein either.   They are already corrupt in regard to environmental planning law breaking, even if you forgive their murky past.

As for independents, Katherine Zapone and Shane Ross are now running with the hounds.  

The first step in getting out of a hole is stop digging,  boycott the lot except the handful of TD’s who do their best.   30% voter turn out. That means:



Don’t vote and persuade others not to vote in general elections.
Form groups to go negative campaigning against the main offenders.


There must be priority in the process.    Identify and cripple being the motto.

So,     I would single out Frances Fitzgerald,   Simon Covney,  Eamon Ryan, Catherine Martin, Dennis Naughton,   L. Varadkar , Charlie Flanegan and  M. Martin and Damien English. Weaken the establishment as much as possible.   The objective being to change the political environment to a point where new entrants to the political system will be encouraged.

New entrants to politics cannot emerge while the established parties hold a grip on the Department of Finance, Justice and housing.    It’s like demolishing an old derelict building in order to build a replacement.   I went door to door last time to oust Alex White and it worked.

Have nothing to do with them,  you don’t set up a holiday tent in a landfill site.
This is a good idea except for one vital factor. With who and with what do you replace this useless shower of ************************ers?
 

wombat

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As dumb a suggestion as you'll find even on P.ie
 

valamhic

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This is a good idea except for one vital factor. With who and with what do you replace this useless shower of ************************ers?
You disengage from the process and help create an environment where new entrants can come along. You still get a government so the mess continues for a while. The difference is you have no part in it
 

valamhic

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As dumb a suggestion as you'll find even on P.ie
Fair enough if you believe that, but everything else was tried and o joy.

What do you think about going door to door to ask voters not to vote for them?
 

Nitrogen

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Everyone who votes is involved, the blame for the mess is on their hands, they put them there. By voting for the least worst candidate to encourage them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Election_boycott

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/mehrunisa-qayyum/post_7647_b_5350820.html
You've a point there.

The narrative that democracy works because there is wisdom in numbers is obvious B*ll Sh*t.
Rather, it maintains social cohesion because it spreads the responsibility across the population. For instance, Brexit is utterly idiotic, but the people think they have brought it upon themselves and are therefore slow to cry halt.

That said, I'm not sure about your suggestion of mass disengagement from the process. What is that going to achieve, other than the creation of a rival political system, which presumably will be prone to the same pitfalls as the previous one>
 

valamhic

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Get rid of the MI5 spies trying to engineer crisis after crisis...

There is no need to engineer a crisis in a loonitic asylum. We need to remove the current established party loonitics and hopefull replace them with something less corrupt.
 

valamhic

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By the way the abbreviation OP in this context means "Original Post"


Alex White was a Minister. 80 people went door to door in Churchtown Dublin. He lost his seat.

Inagime if 10,000 people rose up and did it.
 

farnaby

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Form groups to go negative campaigning against the main offenders.
Your proposal seems to overly rely on the "destruction" element of creative destruction.

Where I agree is that no new party is going to replace FG/FF any time soon. New entrants are crushed by the established party machinery; if the electorate don't see them challenging for power after two elections they're ultimately toast (CnaP, PDs, SDs soon to follow).

I would rather see positive-thinking groups like voluntary associations, with a local base but national policy focus (vs interest groups and single-issue activists). If these sprout and grow organically, new parties can be formed; but in the meantime their purpose would be to highlight the huge gaps between politician-think and (dare I say) the general will.
 


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