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The pre Christmas boom explained


greengoose2

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Joined
May 30, 2009
Messages
25,391
People are not saving as much as they could/should be.

A record 60 per cent of Irish people say that government policy discourages saving according to the latest Nationwide UK (Ireland) Savings Index.
So much for talking up the economy and using flawed statistics in an attempt to fool the people. Mind you, there are far too many who have a pathological need to be fooled!

It seems that the new year good news campaign has faltered.
 


Analyzer

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Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
46,187
The state is also very effective at getting people to think that the system discourages working....
 
D

Dylan2010

higher taxes for sure are a disincentive to save, its difficult to save money thats been appropriated before you get a say.
 

GDPR

1
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Jul 5, 2008
Messages
222,748
People are not saving as much as they could/should be.



So much for talking up the economy and using flawed statistics in an attempt to fool the people. Mind you, there are far too many who have a pathological need to be fooled!

It seems that the new year good news campaign has faltered.
What's your issue here?

Part of the problem with the domestic market is that we're saving too much and not spending enough, that was always the case.
Do you think people were saying there was a lot of new extra money around?
 

statsman

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Joined
Feb 25, 2011
Messages
56,218
What's your issue here?

Part of the problem with the domestic market is that we're saving too much and not spending enough, that was always the case.
Do you think people were saying there was a lot of new extra money around?
This.

People spending some of their disposable income rather than saving it all is somehow meant to be bad news?
 

Dal gCais

Active member
Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Messages
200
People spending their disposable income or at least a portion of it is a good thing no? However, if it's a case of people over using credit cards again then it is really bad news!
 
D

Dylan2010

This.

People spending some of their disposable income rather than saving it all is somehow meant to be bad news?
it could be if they need more money in hindsight in the future. Also people might be better off if they paid down debt by consuming less now. The idea that alot of people out there are only 1 payslip away form debtors banging at their doors is truely sad and shows a lack of financial awareness among the general public
 

Rocky

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Dec 9, 2004
Messages
8,550
Of course it is, it isn't part of the German model we are being assimilated into..
I'm really lost.

The government are bad because they are encouarging people to spend rather than save and they are also bad because they are trying to assimilate us into a German model where people save rather than spend.
 

dizillusioned

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 19, 2011
Messages
14,868
I'm really lost.

The government are bad because they are encouarging people to spend rather than save and they are also bad because they are trying to assimilate us into a German model where people save rather than spend.
You should be lost, like our rudderless leaders..;)
 

statsman

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Joined
Feb 25, 2011
Messages
56,218
it could be if they need more money in hindsight in the future. Also people might be better off if they paid down debt by consuming less now. The idea that alot of people out there are only 1 payslip away form debtors banging at their doors is truely sad and shows a lack of financial awareness among the general public
Are we discussing the good of the individual or the good of the economy?
 

hiding behind a poster

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Joined
Mar 8, 2005
Messages
48,396
People are not saving as much as they could/should be.

So much for talking up the economy and using flawed statistics in an attempt to fool the people. Mind you, there are far too many who have a pathological need to be fooled!

It seems that the new year good news campaign has faltered.
Our savings ratio is too high, way out of line with with where it should be. So people saving a bit less isn't necessarily a bad thing.
 

Mossy Heneberry

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Joined
Jun 10, 2009
Messages
3,841
This.

People spending some of their disposable income rather than saving it all is somehow meant to be bad news?
Consumption/Spending doesn't drive the economy production does.

Production comes first, then spending.
 

livingstone

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Joined
Mar 3, 2004
Messages
24,398
OP makes no sense. You post an article which says that people cannot afford to save, but then also say that it explains the pre-Christmas 'boom'.

That doesn't make sense - if people don't save because they can't afford to, then by definition all of their money is going on basic living costs with little left over. But the hypothesis of the OP is that the reason people spent more before Christmas is that they couldn't afford to save is self-defeating - because if they couldn't afford to save, then by definition they also couldn't afford to spend (beyond basic living costs).

Now, of course, if people CAN afford to save but CHOOSE to save a little less and spend a little more, that might well explain higher spending, but of course that's not what the linked article says. And if it did, that would be a consumer choice, rather than Government economic policies forcing individuals into a position of unsustainable spending.
 

livingstone

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 3, 2004
Messages
24,398
Consumption/Spending doesn't drive the economy production does.

Production comes first, then spending.

Production will only ever match demand. An economy which can increase demand, either through domestic spending or through wider export markets will prompt increased production.
 

statsman

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Joined
Feb 25, 2011
Messages
56,218
Consumption/Spending doesn't drive the economy production does.

Production comes first, then spending.
That's a view, but no the only one. You might argue that there's little economic benefit in producing that which nobody consumes.
 

statsman

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Joined
Feb 25, 2011
Messages
56,218
Production will only ever match demand. An economy which can increase demand, either through domestic spending or through wider export markets will prompt increased production.
So much better expressed than my poor attempt.
 

bob3367

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Joined
Jan 11, 2007
Messages
8,083
What's your issue here?

Part of the problem with the domestic market is that we're saving too much and not spending enough, that was always the case.
Do you think people were saying there was a lot of new extra money around?
Banks and bank officials should not be trusted in this debate, they want your money to recapitalise their balance sheets.

Our saving index is still very high, and as you say money is effectively rotting in bank accounts.

I have been trying for a long time to get an accurate figure for total household savings, I recall seeing a figure of €100bn, and another of €140bn, this is money taken out of thr economy, if 10% of that was spent wonder what the growth figures would be.

Personally, the government needs to incentivise people to spend some of this, perhaps a 25% vat rebate on spends over €500, otherwise impose a 1% levy on the gross, that should shift a bit.
 

Mossy Heneberry

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Joined
Jun 10, 2009
Messages
3,841
Production will only ever match demand. An economy which can increase demand, either through domestic spending or through wider export markets will prompt increased production.
No, you need to increase your production first before you can increase spending. Put it this way, if you want to spend more, you will have to become more poductive to earn more money to spend more.

You might argue that there's little economic benefit in producing that which nobody consumes.

Of course. Why would I want to produce products or services that nobody wants?
 

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