The Pro -12 Looks Set to Enlarge and Include 2 S. African Sides

General Urko

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The Pro -12 tournament is likely to be increased as early as September to include the 2 South African sides axed from super rugby, The Southern Kings and The Cheetahs.

I wonder how this can possibly work logistically.

Two South African Super Rugby Sides Will Join PRO12 This Season - Pundit Arena

There have been moves to bring in American Franchises but to no avail yet and German and Georgian Franchises have also been proposed.

An Australian Club will also be axed from The Southern hemisphere's primary competition also.

Is it not a bit add The Super Rugby Tournament is getting smaller, while the obviously weaker Pro -12 is set to increase in size with huge logistical issues to accompany this increase.
 


Mushroom

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The Pro -12 tournament is likely to be increased as early as September to include the 2 South African sides axed from super rugby, The Southern Kings and The Cheetahs.

I wonder how this can possibly work logistically.

Two South African Super Rugby Sides Will Join PRO12 This Season - Pundit Arena

There have been moves to bring in American Franchises but to no avail yet and German and Georgian Franchises have also been proposed.

An Australian Club will also be axed from The Southern hemisphere's primary competition also.

Is it not a bit add The Super Rugby Tournament is getting smaller, while the obviously weaker Pro -12 is set to increase in size with huge logistical issues to accompany this increase.

From the linked report:

BBC Sport Wales is reporting that the Southern Kings and the Cheetahs could join the PRO12 in September.

and

The format of the competition has yet to be decided i.e. will it be one 14-team division or divided into two conferences of seven teams.



2 X 7 conferences would mean that teams have only 6 guaranteed home games a season - rather than 11 at present. Add in the minimum of 3 home European Cup games, and supporters are looking at possibly only 9 home games during an 8 month season. That's not good for season ticket holders ........... or for club treasurers!

The reduction in ticket sales and the increase in travelling and accommodation expenses would need to be replaced by significant TV fees and other sponsorship.
 

Dimples 77

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The Pro -12 tournament is likely to be increased as early as September to include the 2 South African sides axed from super rugby, The Southern Kings and The Cheetahs.

I wonder how this can possibly work logistically.

Two South African Super Rugby Sides Will Join PRO12 This Season - Pundit Arena

There have been moves to bring in American Franchises but to no avail yet and German and Georgian Franchises have also been proposed.

An Australian Club will also be axed from The Southern hemisphere's primary competition also.

Is it not a bit add The Super Rugby Tournament is getting smaller, while the obviously weaker Pro -12 is set to increase in size with huge logistical issues to accompany this increase.

All that this tells us is that the sad state of professional rugby union continues.

Super Rugby had just expanded by 3 teams to 18 teams for the 2016 season (with South Africa gaining 1 extra place) and now there is going to be contraction after 2 (two) years? With South Africa losing 2 places. This really is mickey mouse stuff.

What any sports league needs is stability, and not continual tinkering.

This sort of tinkering makes it impossible to attract more rich owners - who wants to invest in the set-up of a new team and then have the rules changed again after just 2 years. Add in the complications regarding the continual revisions of "franchise areas" and the whole thing is a mess.

As for the Pro12 taking on the 2 axed South African teams, is that really a good idea? The Kings have been a mess for years, with the South African Rugby Union having to take over the running of the Kings franchise in 2015. Is that really the sort of team that the Pro12 wants to take on, especially with the increase in costs associated with being part of a European league?
 

Mushroom

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I see Rassie is walking out on Munster. Obviously, the call of the Boks was too hard for him to resist.

"Munster have confirmed that Rassie Erasmus and Defence Coach Jacques Nienaber will leave the province at the end of December. Erasmus will take over as South Africa's Director of Rugby."

Munster confirm Erasmus will leave them in December | Irish Examiner
 

'orebel

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From the linked report:

BBC Sport Wales is reporting that the Southern Kings and the Cheetahs could join the PRO12 in September.

and

The format of the competition has yet to be decided i.e. will it be one 14-team division or divided into two conferences of seven teams.



2 X 7 conferences would mean that teams have only 6 guaranteed home games a season - rather than 11 at present. Add in the minimum of 3 home European Cup games, and supporters are looking at possibly only 9 home games during an 8 month season. That's not good for season ticket holders ........... or for club treasurers!

The reduction in ticket sales and the increase in travelling and accommodation expenses would need to be replaced by significant TV fees and other sponsorship.
Piss off with your facts, matey!
 

'orebel

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Sync

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The pro-12 is obviously weaker? Really? If you compare the South African teams against them? I think not. The NZ teams are of course strongest because it's all the NZ National team players. But overall the leagues are comparable.

Except people show up to watch the pro-12. The Super 15 constantly struggles with attendances, especially in SA. Those who do show up do so on the extreme cheap.

Which means unless you've an international contract, it's hard to make a living playing rugby in SA.

The real risk here is that players in the Sharks and Bulls look at the Cheetahs players in a year or 2 and realise they're getting paid more to be "relegated" from super league and play in Europe.

For the Pro-12 it's a no brainer. Increased revenue from tickets. Increased revenue from TV deals with the US and other countries, which you then plow into player costs and development. It's a no-brainer for them. How is this a bad thing?
 

redneck

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Professional Rugby is on the up. It is a boom sport at the moment. This idea is a good move imo for Pro 12. That said it is not possible for fans to travel all the way to South Africa to watch games. A compromise could be the winners of the Pro 12 play the winners of the South African leagues.
 

ne0ica

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I think its a bad move.

The Southern Hemisphere tournament was more successful when it was smaller.

TV ratings and attendance has been falling after being enlarged several times.

I hope the Pro 12 is not repeating the same mistake.
 

General Urko

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So the 2 Springbox sides are in and everyone seems delighted. The logistics of it are that there will be 2 conferences of 7 teams each. Each team plays the others in it's conference, twice and the others once with the tradirional provincial rivalries played 2 times. This gives a guaranteed 21 games. The conference winners get home semi finals and 2nd and 3rd in each conference go to The QFs.

Irish rugby derbies will remain as new PRO14 format announced - Dublin Live
 
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Discussing this today and suggested that only Ulster fans will be happy going to play Toyota Cheetahs as it is in the Orange Free State, aside from a lad from Belfast it just went over every bodys heads.

Issue is also that this stadium is at 4500 ft or 100 feet higher than Ben Nevis.............. try and fly for 10 hrs, get acclimatised while suffering jet lag in 30 degree heat.
 

users

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Discussing this today and suggested that only Ulster fans will be happy going to play Toyota Cheetahs as it is in the Orange Free State, aside from a lad from Belfast it just went over every bodys heads.

Issue is also that this stadium is at 4500 ft or 100 feet higher than Ben Nevis.............. try and fly for 10 hrs, get acclimatised while suffering jet lag in 30 degree heat.
No jet lag north to south is there?
 

Sync

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No jet lag north to south is there?
Nope. And they'll do what the super 15 do, you'll tour. Play 3 of the provinces in quick succession.
 
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No jet lag north to south is there?
Funnily enough a saffer who does the trip couple of times a year and has done so for 15 years begs to differ. He was one in office who pointed out elevation of Cheetahs stadium.
Same time zones but as he said going from 2 degrees in London to 30 degrees in Joburg or Cape Town, 10 hour flight and claiming no jet lag has not done it often.
 

gerhard dengler

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The logistics for players to go to South Africa to play, and for their players to travel to play over here, is an obvious impairment.

The other impairment is, supporters. Will supporters shell out to go to support their team playing one game in SA (and will SA supporters reciprocate by travelling over here to support their team)?

I'm all for strengthening the franchise, but at what cost to the players and the supporters?
 

Paddyc

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Nope. And they'll do what the super 15 do, you'll tour. Play 3 of the provinces in quick succession.
The problem with that is there's only one SA team in each conference. The SA teams can base themselves here and play three away matches in three weeks but we can't.

It's asking supporters to spend a small fortune travelling from (for example) Shannon via Heathrow and Johannesburg to Bloemfontein and back again or Dublin via Heathrow and Johannesburg to Port Elizabeth and back again for one match.
 
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The problem with that is there's only one SA team in each conference. The SA teams can base themselves here and play three away matches in three weeks but we can't.

It's asking supporters to spend a small fortune travelling from (for example) Shannon via Heathrow and Johannesburg to Bloemfontein and back again or Dublin via Heathrow and Johannesburg to Port Elizabeth and back again for one match.
Add in a weeks holiday then doable, also likely charters direct to there will be available carrying team.
 

Mushroom

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