The time has come for unionists to decide what kind of United Ireland they can accept

McSlaggart

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Champagne hasn’t been on the shopping list for Northern Irish unionists for a while now. A combination of horrendous election results at home and betrayal in the form of a border thrust down the Irish sea by their supposed allies in London gave little cause for celebration. And yet, last Friday as Sinn Fein were shut out of government in the Republic of Ireland, by a previously unthinkable alliance between Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, one could imagine unionists rushing out across the province in search of that most celebratory sparkling drinks.
The campaign for a United Ireland appeared to have been set back, perhaps by many years. Such an assessment of the political environment in Ireland is undoubtedly true. But any unionists reaching for champagne flutes should consider a much deeper, more fundamental, truth. Project unification has been delayed, but its march remains singular in its trajectory – forward. More slowly than before, perhaps, but forward nevertheless....
 


Sync

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They can't have those sort of discussions. Their idealogical purity is all they have. The second it crumbles then the raison d'etre falls away.

Everyone would know what sort of girl they were, you'd just be haggling over the price.
 

McTell

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Do they have champagne flutes?

I'm worried that they will be dragged down to my level of pint glasses lifted from numerous pubs.
 

Clipper

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Champagne hasn’t been on the shopping list for Northern Irish unionists for a while now. A combination of horrendous election results at home and betrayal in the form of a border thrust down the Irish sea by their supposed allies in London gave little cause for celebration. And yet, last Friday as Sinn Fein were shut out of government in the Republic of Ireland, by a previously unthinkable alliance between Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, one could imagine unionists rushing out across the province in search of that most celebratory sparkling drinks.
The campaign for a United Ireland appeared to have been set back, perhaps by many years. Such an assessment of the political environment in Ireland is undoubtedly true. But any unionists reaching for champagne flutes should consider a much deeper, more fundamental, truth. Project unification has been delayed, but its march remains singular in its trajectory – forward. More slowly than before, perhaps, but forward nevertheless....
More worrying for Unionism is that article comes from the Telegraph. This would indicate that the Tories have decided the time to cut NI loose is drawing nearer. All to facilitate Brexit of course which the DUP supported. Talk about own goals.
 

recedite

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The whole article is a little ungracious, isn't it.
Like going up to somebody who had cancer and just got some good news that its in remission, and then saying to them "yeah, but you're still gonna die sooner or later".
 

McTell

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Seems that there's the sash wearing unionists, but also a lot of economic unionists of every background who will want to know where the next £10,000,000,000-a-year "subvention" is coming from.

LeoMi hasn't budgeted for it o_O

Then there's car tax, my merc would be 400 in the uk, about 1,800 here.

Tesco, compare the same items in newry and dundalk, and it;s a good 20% cheaper up there. Where is all that support going to come from?

I don't mind in the least bit having unity in the morning, but it seems unlikely that a lot of nordies will vote to become even poorer than they are now.

If the supporters of unity would only arrange a free gift to our new northern province of €11 billion a year from the Usa / EU, that would be just the ticket. I'd be seriously impressed.

Britain got into brexit over an £8 Bn a year net cost, so of course a lot of GB voters would want to end this payment of 10 Bn a year.
 

McSlaggart

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Seems that there's the sash wearing unionists, but also a lot of economic unionists of every background who will want to know where the next £10,000,000,000-a-year "subvention" is coming from.

LeoMi hasn't budgeted for it o_O

Then there's car tax, my merc would be 400 in the uk, about 1,800 here.

Tesco, compare the same items in newry and dundalk, and it;s a good 20% cheaper up there. Where is all that support going to come from?

I don't mind in the least bit having unity in the morning, but it seems unlikely that a lot of nordies will vote to become even poorer than they are now.

If the supporters of unity would only arrange a free gift to our new northern province of €11 billion a year from the Usa / EU, that would be just the ticket. I'd be seriously impressed.

Britain got into brexit over an £8 Bn a year net cost, so of course a lot of GB voters would want to end this payment of 10 Bn a year.

The first thing to note is that "northern Ireland" has the effect of making the border counties much less economically effective.

The second point is that northern Ireland was traditionally the most effective part of the Island in purely economical terms. It was the troubles which has left the economy in a poor place not the quality of the work carried out by the population.


The wee six has a highly educated workforce who are who are to a large extent emigrating to places such as Dublin. In an all Island situation we would have the opportunity to make the border counties more economically effective and have a natural economic corridor between Belfast and Dublin.
 

NMunsterman

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They can't have those sort of discussions. Their idealogical purity is all they have. The second it crumbles then the raison d'etre falls away.

Everyone would know what sort of girl they were, you'd just be haggling over the price.

Indeed.

But the real problem for Unionists is that the longer they try to pretend Re-unification of the country is not happening, the weaker their negotiating position becomes as the irreversible downward trajectory of Unionist parties in the North continues.
 

Marcos the black

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I agree with all the above.
Conversely, Republicans have to decide what type of United Ireland they want.
Will it be one that welcomes all traditions, including Unionists, and opens up the possibility of a new country, not just an extended Republic, or will it be one in which only republican traditions can be celebrated?
From my experience of talking to republicans I fear they want the latter.
 

McSlaggart

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, or will it be one in which only republican traditions can be celebrated?
From my experience of talking to republicans I fear they want the latter.

The fact is that orange traditions are tolerated in counties such as Tyrone. If the good people of Tyrone wanted to stop loyalist parades then they would not take place.
 

wombat

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Conversely, Republicans have to decide what type of United Ireland they want.
I think that is far more important. We are talking about territorial unity when the population of the 6 counties decide by 50% + 1 to unite with the south whereas unity will happen when the majority of unionists change their minds and decide their interests are better served by joining with the rest of us.
 

ruserious

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Time to stop referring to “it” as the Irish border. It is not the Irish border.

I now refer to it as the BLOC. British line of control.

Do not give it the respect it doesn’t deserve by giving it the legitimising name of a border.

Here’s to ending the BLOCade.
 

McSlaggart

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I now refer to it as the BLOC. British line of control.
The British could never really defend that line. The Brtiish army used to hold to the old miguire line of control. about half of Fermanagh was left to defend itself. It had a major impact on members of the UDR etc who could be killed at will.
 

Marcos the black

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The fact is that orange traditions are tolerated in counties such as Tyrone. If the good people of Tyrone wanted to stop loyalist parades then they would not take place.
But are they tolerated "down here"?
 


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