Time to expose the role of the media in all this.

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I posted this comment on the 'traitors' thread but then felt that actually this deserves to be discussed much more fully. It is of vital importance to understanding what happened to us and how to prevent it happening again. If it didn't take so bloody long, I'd love to see a Tribunal into the role of the media in helping create the circumstances that led to our national humiliation. Failing that, perhaps a good academic study or a public inquiry of some nature.

Whatever about 'traitors', certainly not getting their fair share of the blame are the media cheerleaders, spinners, and distorters. The Sindo was still at it last weekend, front page headlines about 'Cowen's fury with BBC "When not If" claim'. It is always government spin, sometimes subtle, sometimes not. Then there are reliable government-pocket journalists, like Sam Smyth, always there to get a leak out or to do a hatchet job on an inconvenient person. There are the likes of several Sunday Business Post journalists who actively promoted the corporate bullsh1t put out by the sort of scumbags that have virtually gambled us into oblivion. There are the polyannas like Marc Coleman, Brendan O'Connor and so on who were and are always quick to denounce in a Stalinist fashion anyone who dares quibble about the wisdom of believing that everything is rosy. Then there is RTE, a singular failure in holding the government to account, a most basic requirement of the national broadcaster. It has spun just as much as anyone over recent years, whether it be on the economy, tribunals, politics, whatever. The methods are more subtle than the Sindo's but just as real - the manipulation of running orders, choice of introductory headlines, choice of guests. And virtually ALL the newspapers had property supplements that were disguised as journalism but were little more than press releases from the property industry. The 'don't panic' propaganda being put out in some of these supplements (take a bow, the Examiner) at the time of the Crash was truly breathtaking in its audacity.

Members of the media never criticize other members of the media, so we never get a true exposition of the performance of many of these people in newspapers or on television. It is high time that this most powerful and influential group of people were thoroughly and independently examined for their role in all this over the last decade or more. Some of them wield enormous influence and, I suspect, are downright corrupt, literally paid hirelings of vested interests. As to who is who, I don't know and won't speculate...

I feel that this is massively important. There is not enough assessment (the media themselves are a cabal from whom there are very few, if any, with the courage and balls to do the job) of the motives and role of journalists and commentators in the national media. Comment should be free, including commentary that I would disagree with. But I believe commentary should also be free from deliberate distortion and ulterior motives, be it the motive of serving the owner's interests, the motive of getting in on the gravy train, the motive of keeping the license fee intact, whatever. Journalists, presenters, and commentators are hugely important in shaping our opinions and, I believe, have a lot to answer for in this situation. Too many are now running for cover and pretending they were critics all along. Time to expose who was who....
 


krusty

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Oct 9, 2009
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178
I posted this comment on the 'traitors' thread but then felt that actually this deserves to be discussed much more fully. It is of vital importance to understanding what happened to us and how to prevent it happening again. If it didn't take so bloody long, I'd love to see a Tribunal into the role of the media in helping create the circumstances that led to our national humiliation. Failing that, perhaps a good academic study or a public inquiry of some nature.

Whatever about 'traitors', certainly not getting their fair share of the blame are the media cheerleaders, spinners, and distorters. The Sindo was still at it last weekend, front page headlines about 'Cowen's fury with BBC "When not If" claim'. It is always government spin, sometimes subtle, sometimes not. Then there are reliable government-pocket journalists, like Sam Smyth, always there to get a leak out or to do a hatchet job on an inconvenient person. There are the likes of several Sunday Business Post journalists who actively promoted the corporate bullsh1t put out by the sort of scumbags that have virtually gambled us into oblivion. There are the polyannas like Marc Coleman, Brendan O'Connor and so on who were and are always quick to denounce in a Stalinist fashion anyone who dares quibble about the wisdom of believing that everything is rosy. Then there is RTE, a singular failure in holding the government to account, a most basic requirement of the national broadcaster. It has spun just as much as anyone over recent years, whether it be on the economy, tribunals, politics, whatever. The methods are more subtle than the Sindo's but just as real - the manipulation of running orders, choice of introductory headlines, choice of guests. And virtually ALL the newspapers had property supplements that were disguised as journalism but were little more than press releases from the property industry. The 'don't panic' propaganda being put out in some of these supplements (take a bow, the Examiner) at the time of the Crash was truly breathtaking in its audacity.

Members of the media never criticize other members of the media, so we never get a true exposition of the performance of many of these people in newspapers or on television. It is high time that this most powerful and influential group of people were thoroughly and independently examined for their role in all this over the last decade or more. Some of them wield enormous influence and, I suspect, are downright corrupt, literally paid hirelings of vested interests. As to who is who, I don't know and won't speculate...

I feel that this is massively important. There is not enough assessment (the media themselves are a cabal from whom there are very few, if any, with the courage and balls to do the job) of the motives and role of journalists and commentators in the national media. Comment should be free, including commentary that I would disagree with. But I believe commentary should also be free from deliberate distortion and ulterior motives, be it the motive of serving the owner's interests, the motive of getting in on the gravy train, the motive of keeping the license fee intact, whatever. Journalists, presenters, and commentators are hugely important in shaping our opinions and, I believe, have a lot to answer for in this situation. Too many are now running for cover and pretending they were critics all along. Time to expose who was who....
I happen to think the Media in Ireland is Incredibly lazy and incompetemt about getting to the truth about what is going on in Ireland. Only now when they have woken up to the fact that people are going to foreign news agencies to find out the truth about what is hapening in Ireland are they copping on to the fact that the spin that comes out from the Politicians mouths is just that spin and not news.
 
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I happen to think the Media in Ireland is Incredibly lazy and incompetemt about getting to the truth about what is going on in Ireland. Only now when they have woken up to the fact that people are going to foreign news agencies to find out the truth about what is hapening in Ireland are they copping on to the fact that the spin that comes out from the Politicians mouths is just that spin and not news.
RTE are now doing a panicked and much-too-late about-turn, knowing that finally their masters are no longer in control. It's pitiable stuff. I have heard hard questioning of Irish government ministers only on the BBC and Sky. There they make no bones about saying that the government screwed us up, here you would draw breath if you ever heard such a thing from the cosy and incestuous world of the national broadcaster. Absolutely pathetic show by RTE.

If they removed RTE from my television and so let me off the license fee I'd be a happy man. Or if they let me choose to give the money to TG4 entirely. I do not want to pay for propaganda and ineptitude.
 

nildesp

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Jul 17, 2009
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Just for a second there I thought the Times was going to expose the role of the media in all of this.

Then I thought of its blatantly biased (with rare and honourable exceptions) economic and political commentary, its PD(!) editor and political staff, its flagrant promotion of rampant consumerism, its general peddling of snobbery and aspirational lifestyle nonsense, its failure consistently to provide serious journalistic interrogation of the powerful in society, its ritualistic public service bashing, its kneejerk 'nasty unions' propaganda, its blind celebration of our 'wealth creators' and of course its infamous Property porn section.

And then I thought, 'Naaaaaaah!'.
 

MsAnneThrope

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Joe Duffy's comment live on air, something like 'shur all the ordinary decent people of Ireland have always voted for Fianna Fáil' was breathtaking in revealing his true colours and attempts to influence his listenership. Perhaps someone has the exact quote or maybe I already have it verbatim.

Of course there's much more than just Duffy. I'll add to this thread over the coming days/week. I'm fortunate at times to be a newspaper hoarder, and I have several from just before the 2007 election.
 

ulsterscotnua

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Oct 29, 2010
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We can't blame the media.
We can blame ourselves. How many times in the last 4 to 5 years have we not seen our leaders make real idiots of us the ordinary people of Ireland.
Just one example we all sniggered and laughed at Brian Cowen's performance after his late night singing and drinking.
What happened, nothing, why? because we couldn't be bothered.
Our leader making a fool of us and he is still our leader. The world laughed at him and then at us. Everyone knew about it. No one acted. Our bonds have gone up and up and now we can't get any money except by IRM and ECB.
What will IRM and ECB do with Cowen. He is not leader any more.
 

MsAnneThrope

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RTÉ have a guy on Radio 1 now (with Boucher-Hayes) singing the virtues of the IMF. Dónal something (Donovan?). Saying it's all "exaggerated", lots of "positives". They were "a threat at times, but not very often"

Summary: The IMF are our new bestest friends. Add it to Lenihan's "desirable outcome" comment earlier, also on RTÉ.
 

Expatriot

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Good thread, well done.

Here is my post from the Irish times thread. better suited here I think.



I think you make an important point there. I think the Times is better than most media outlets in this country and is certainly worth reading. But it needs to have a hard look at itself too.

The media in this country are all to quick too run with whatever story comes out of Merrion street. The property bubble was a orgy the media was stuck right in the midde of, from TV programs about painting houses to property porn supplements in every paper. We all make mistakes, but we need to be honest about them. That goes all the more for people in the media. An honest looking at the weaknesses in the media would be welcome. Some people in the meida have been excellent in this crisis, they have been honest and our spoken. I think of people like Dunphy, VB, McWilliam and O'Toole. They may not agree, but I think they help us understand where we went so badly badly wrong. But the media needs to look at itself too.

We had politicians attacking sites like this one and I assume the people running it for letting people become "hysterical". OK there is plenty of crap written on line and there is no quality control like a newspaper. But there seems to be a great deal more honesty and a lot less political interference in what people can say. The traditional media have no future at all if they are not trust worthy, its as simple as that.

The last year has seen the media jumping on the band wagon of pitting private worker against public worker. This is a disgrace. By all means have an honest and forthright debate about reducing costs etc and getting the most from the public euro, but there was an attempt to put up a smoke screen of paranoid hatred against PS workers by the goverment to distract from the bank sham. This is whole heartedly taken up by the most popular elements of the media. Make no mistake, large elements of the media are very directly to blame for the loss of Independence and the total ride we have been taken for by the banks.

No doubt pay and numbers will be slashed again in the public service, but we will still have a disfunctional government, media and banking systems at the end of all of that. Anyone going to write an editorial about that, or is it too close to the bone
 

mothball

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TV3 are the only exception and that has basically been due Vincent Browne's show.
 

Expatriot

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The only reason RTE are panicking is because the IMF well sell them for sure.
 

eyeSpy

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we're probably no worse than anywhere else and better than others.
take a UK example outlined in the current issue of the superb Private Eye:

The Sun switched to Conservative a few years ago.
Murdoch Jr. made a speech about the excessive power of the BBC, the incompetence of the BBC trust, the allocation of the licence monies and the performance of BBC International.
Then, the Conservatives get elected.

Head of the BBC Trust 'resigns'.
BBC has to sell off foreign and diverse interests such as their magazines.
And the TV licence is under review.
 

Hewson

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RTE is an unmitigated failure as a public service broadcaster. I appreciate that it has to operate under fairly strict guidelines regarding impartiality and time allocation to different parties, but it continually fails to nail down interviewees, particularly ministers, when it's obvious that they're dodging and bluffing their way through interviews. They have a couple of excellent interviewers in Richard Crowley – probably the best – and Sean O'Rourke but they also have a habit of dragging on people like Fionnan Sheehan. This guy's wife is neck deep in Fianna Fail. Who's going to take his views on politics seriously?

RTE needs to invigorate its dormant journalistic talents to do more investigative reports into the stinking carcasses of corruption and croneyism that are the hallmarks of Irish politics. It shouldn't be afraid to do so either, regardless of who is in government. If there's any political pressure put on the DG as a result of such work then that pressure should be publicised and names broadcast.

Haughey had Scrap Saturday dropped. Things haven't moved on much.
 

eyeSpy

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but they also have a habit of dragging on people like Fionnan Sheehan. This guy's wife is neck deep in Fianna Fail. Who's going to take his views on politics seriously?

see that's the kind of information people don't know.
commentators should have to declare an interest, professional or personal, before giving their views.
 

JCR

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There is actually a way to do something about this while shaming the Irish media and doing their job at the same time. People can simply go on to sites like these, then contact British and international media to inform them of what has happened to the Irish media and the joke they have become. The Irish story will run a while yet so while its newsworthy use it, the international media will love to have a go at the Irish fools and gombeens.

It is equally important to share the scorn for the current irish media and polticians, we need a PR job on the country, the Irish people need to distance the Irish nation from the gombeens who destroyed the economy and the reputation of Ireland. The Irish media fell victim to the same cloak and dagger chinese whisper gombeen style of FF due to them practically being the ruling party. Kiss the best ass you can to get your paws on the goodies too seemed to be the rule of thumb for most of the Irish media instead of doing their job. Now they have to watch while the BBC does their job for them. Because only a handful had to he balls to speak out - and were told to go kill themselves - and even at this disgusting remark the great Irish mediua still kissed Bertie's ass, RTE even giving him a chance to shed some lying tears to win over the houswives. Question is, did Byran Dobson physically kiss his ass? Because he might as well have the idiot gombeen 'journalist'.
 
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TV3 are the only exception and that has basically been due Vincent Browne's show.
Vincent Browne, at the time of the Tribunals, was so soft on Denis O'Brien in an interview on his then Radio 1 show that Dearbhaill McDonald actually took him to task for it afterwards. He has also defended Owen O'Callaghan at length and rarely, if ever, commented on the sheer ludicrousness of his explanations for why he was paying Frank Dunlop large VAT free round-figure amounts to a front-company that had no accounts and which used false invoices (out of which politicians were bribed). Browne's record is not good either.
 

Sham96

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Duffy this morning was a disgrace. Unbelievable FF bias. Break up RTE and lets have a real hard look at people like O'Reilly and O'Brien and their control of the media.
 

Tomas Mor

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I began a thread along those lines last March
Tomas Mor




Did media fall down on its job in last decade , boasting of Celtic Tiger, Bertie lifestyle (Sindo) and contaminated by property supplements revenue. Shame on them,they have serious case to answer
__________________
The Sindo is FF "Volkischer Beobackter". Cowen had all in stitches in Galway at 3.30a.m.but he was "not impaired" he mimicked and sang -DD Power on RTE.
 

mothball

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Vincent Browne, at the time of the Tribunals, was so soft on Denis O'Brien in an interview on his then Radio 1 show that Dearbhaill McDonald actually took him to task for it afterwards. He has also defended Owen O'Callaghan at length and rarely, if ever, commented on the sheer ludicrousness of his explanations for why he was paying Frank Dunlop large VAT free round-figure amounts to a front-company that had no accounts and which used false invoices (out of which politicians were bribed). Browne's record is not good either.
I had forgotten about that. However, as sad as it may be, his show is the best option on offer on any national station at this moment. Channel four and the BBC are offering a fair appraisal now, but in the near future there will be little interest in little old Ireland and our politicos will be getting a free ride if it was left to Prime Time. As it stands, Tonight with Vincent Browne is the best daily political review show on Irish TV.
 

Zamidan

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Jun 24, 2008
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I have askaboutmoney to thank for my present state of affairs...

When they banned talk on property ..and the property pin sprung up..I started taking notice and interest of what was going on in this country..The Pin led me to here, and ONLY for these two websites do i find myself informed on what is the truth of what did go on and IS going on in this country..RTE is a disgrace..how they let Bertie Ahern within a asses roar of the place is beyond me....Willie o Dea another tosser..they should not be let on the airwaves...They should not even be let run for election again..
In a way you have to watch RTE (I dont buy papers so cant really comment on that) to see the spin and FF bias ..ITs sickining but then again knowledge is power..
I think with the amount of people that listen to Joe Duffy he is one of the biggest offenders for doleing out the FF spin..But then they are all feeding from the same trough...
 


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