Too Quick to Accuse of Homophobia !

bactrian

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1. I strongly support Marriage Equality and do my best to advocate for it.

2. I have a "dog in the fight" : My 17 year old daughter is a Lesbian.

I have the impression that some people who would like to speak out against Marriage Equality are reluctant to do so for fear of being accused of Homophobia. I know that there are homophobes ,but, I believe that many who oppose the Referendum to confer Marriage Equality are not motivated by homophobia.

I believe that these people should be allowed to speak, to express their view , without fear of an unfair accusation.

I firmly believe in the principle of "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" , however that is not my sole reason for allowing a "Safe Space " for those who oppose the Referendum . I have an ulterior motive.

Those who fear to speak out against Marriage Equality , who are not homophobes, must feel resentful. I speculate that "non-homophobes" (I had to come up with a shorter way of describing them) must feel that they are not being listened to , that the supporters of Marriage Equality have closed their ears and their minds to the concerns of the "non-homophobes" . If this is how they feel , that they are not being listened to, then they probably have decided not to listen back.

If "non-homophobes" are allowed a "Safe Space" to express their views and can feel that they are being listened to , without prejudice and without pre-judgement, then they are more likely to listen back.

I believe the arguments in favour of Marriage equality are convincing, I believe that these arguments will sway some "non-homophobes". All I want is for them to listen to the reasoning of the Marriage Equality side.

If we on the Marriage Equality side are not clearly and honestly listening to the "No " side , we cannot ask that they listen to us!
 


cricket

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1. I strongly support Marriage Equality and do my best to advocate for it.

2. I have a "dog in the fight" : My 17 year old daughter is a Lesbian.

I have the impression that some people who would like to speak out against Marriage Equality are reluctant to do so for fear of being accused of Homophobia. I know that there are homophobes ,but, I believe that many who oppose the Referendum to confer Marriage Equality are not motivated by homophobia.

I believe that these people should be allowed to speak, to express their view , without fear of an unfair accusation.

I firmly believe in the principle of "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" , however that is not my sole reason for allowing a "Safe Space " for those who oppose the Referendum . I have an ulterior motive.

Those who fear to speak out against Marriage Equality , who are not homophobes, must feel resentful. I speculate that "non-homophobes" (I had to come up with a shorter way of describing them) must feel that they are not being listened to , that the supporters of Marriage Equality have closed their ears and their minds to the concerns of the "non-homophobes" . If this is how they feel , that they are not being listened to, then they probably have decided not to listen back.

If "non-homophobes" are allowed a "Safe Space" to express their views and can feel that they are being listened to , without prejudice and without pre-judgement, then they are more likely to listen back.

I believe the arguments in favour of Marriage equality are convincing, I believe that these arguments will sway some "non-homophobes". All I want is for them to listen to the reasoning of the Marriage Equality side.

If we on the Marriage Equality side are not clearly and honestly listening to the "No " side , we cannot ask that they listen to us!
I agree completely, the only problem is that I've yet to hear a logical argument against the equality proposal.
People have said that :
It's against the bible, probably the most insane argument of all. Just look at what the bible says about slavery, women's menstrual cycle, etc.
It destabilises "traditional" marriage, I've never heard how.
It's a danger to adopted children, simply illogical.
The government should concentrate on jobs, the economy or whatever tickles your fancy. It's not an "either or" situation, every other issue can get its due attention at the same time as this issue is being dealt with.
 

A REASON

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Is your daughter in a lesbian relationship? I've always found that there is one butch looking lesbian and one prettier one in relationships. Strange but true.
 

cricket

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Is your daughter in a lesbian relationship? I've always found that there is one butch looking lesbian and one prettier one in relationships. Strange but true.
Insightful contribution there !
 

APettigrew92

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I agree completely, the only problem is that I've yet to hear a logical argument against the equality proposal.
People have said that :
It's against the bible, probably the most insane argument of all. Just look at what the bible says about slavery, women's menstrual cycle, etc.
It destabilises "traditional" marriage, I've never heard how.
It's a danger to adopted children, simply illogical.
The government should concentrate on jobs, the economy or whatever tickles your fancy. It's not an "either or" situation, every other issue can get its due attention at the same time as this issue is being dealt with.
The same nutters in the US demanding the bombing of ISIS and the like never see the irony in that one. ISIS massacre thousands over religion, quoting the Qu'ran and inciting hatred via religion. That's evil.

Anti-equality Christians do the same thing based on "Gad" on it's fine?

This referendum isn't for the kids of the OP who, thankfully, have a parent accepting and loving enough to accept them for who they are.

This is becoming as much about parents loving their children as it is about LGBT folk loving one another.

Love is unconditional. You can't not "love" your child based on their sexuality as that implies that what you wanted them to be is something different and consequently means you clearly don't understand the nature of love to begin with.

This referendum is revealing what we all seem to know anyways; the "duirt bean go nduirt bean eile" culture is alive and well. Social pressure still exists in strength.

As for all the Priests telling people not to vote for equality (happened in the Precious Blood in Cabra West, a good number of the congregation walked out). What does "Gad" really say?

Love is always patient and kind; it is never jealous;
love is never boastful or conceited; it is never rude or selfish; it does not take offence, and is not resentful.
Love takes no pleasure in other people's sins but delights in the truth; it is always ready to excuse, to trust, to hope, and to endure whatever comes.
Love does not come to an end.

This is the word of the Lord.
 

Mercurial

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Jun 4, 2009
Messages
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1. I strongly support Marriage Equality and do my best to advocate for it.

2. I have a "dog in the fight" : My 17 year old daughter is a Lesbian.

I have the impression that some people who would like to speak out against Marriage Equality are reluctant to do so for fear of being accused of Homophobia. I know that there are homophobes ,but, I believe that many who oppose the Referendum to confer Marriage Equality are not motivated by homophobia.

I believe that these people should be allowed to speak, to express their view , without fear of an unfair accusation.

I firmly believe in the principle of "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" , however that is not my sole reason for allowing a "Safe Space " for those who oppose the Referendum . I have an ulterior motive.

Those who fear to speak out against Marriage Equality , who are not homophobes, must feel resentful. I speculate that "non-homophobes" (I had to come up with a shorter way of describing them) must feel that they are not being listened to , that the supporters of Marriage Equality have closed their ears and their minds to the concerns of the "non-homophobes" . If this is how they feel , that they are not being listened to, then they probably have decided not to listen back.

If "non-homophobes" are allowed a "Safe Space" to express their views and can feel that they are being listened to , without prejudice and without pre-judgement, then they are more likely to listen back.

I believe the arguments in favour of Marriage equality are convincing, I believe that these arguments will sway some "non-homophobes". All I want is for them to listen to the reasoning of the Marriage Equality side.

If we on the Marriage Equality side are not clearly and honestly listening to the "No " side , we cannot ask that they listen to us!
I am genuinely curious: could you offer an example of an argument against same-sex marriage which is not homophobic?
 

The_SR

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Is your daughter in a lesbian relationship? I've always found that there is one butch looking lesbian and one prettier one in relationships. Strange but true.
That is an unfortunate contribution in the context of homophobia.
 

silverharp

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Anyone quoting the bible cannot be taken seriously because they might as well be quoting Harry Potter, both would be very poor books to base political decisions on. The definition below suggests to me that religious people are homophobic unless they choose to ignore their own church's teachings.

Homophobia encompasses a range of negative attitudes and feelings toward homosexuality or people who are identified or perceived as being lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender (LGBT).[1][2][3] It can be expressed as antipathy, contempt, prejudice, aversion, or hatred, may be based on irrational fear, and is sometimes related to religious beliefs.[4]

Im sure it is possible to be against this amendment and not be homophobic but would need to see framework where having a different arrangement is logical and not based on scaremongering
 

truthforsooth

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I am genuinely curious: could you offer an example of an argument against same-sex marriage which is not homophobic?
I've heard one interesting one: that marriage could be used as a vehicle for one person to pass on property or other assets to another person, without incurring taxes. Obviously that applies not only to same-sex marriages, but it could open new avenues for say (mostly male) property developers and other speculators.
 

Mercurial

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I've heard one interesting one: that marriage could be used as a vehicle for one person to pass on property or other assets to another person, without incurring taxes. Obviously that applies not only to same-sex marriages, but it could open new avenues for say (mostly male) property developers and other speculators.
Sure - there are plenty of arguments (of varying quality) against marriage in general, but finding one which applies to same-sex marriage in particular, and which isn't homophobic, is much more difficult.
 

johnnypockets

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In the case of two men getting married. If they decide they want to have kids and decide to go down the route of a surrogate. What rights does the (biological) mother have?
 

Rural

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An excellent OP and I think

1. There is no need for a campaign on either side.

2. We will vote "Yes", because we believe that everyone deserves happiness.

3. My Father will vote "Yes" because after 50 years of marriage, he believes that everyone should be as miserable as he is.

4. Some will vote "No", for their own reasons and some of those reasons could be very personal.

5. I do believe there will only be a tiny turnout - A lot of voters don't think or care about the question.
 

bactrian

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The same nutters in the US demanding the bombing of ISIS and the like never see the irony in that one. ISIS massacre thousands over religion, quoting the Qu'ran and inciting hatred via religion. That's evil.

Anti-equality Christians do the same thing based on "Gad" on it's fine?
Using the terms "nutters " and "Anti-equality Christians " isn't quite demonstrating the "open to listening " that I was hoping for!
 


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