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TUI votes to accept Lansdowne Road Mark 2

GrainneDee

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Oct 12, 2011
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TUI votes to accept Lansdowne Road Agreement following second ballot - Independent.ie

As a TUI member, I'm disgusted at this outcome. We've basically told the government to do what they want with us from now on - a bad day for the teaching profession. Everyone in my workplace was totally against it.
The executive pushed for a yes, and allowed a very short window of time at a very busy time of year for the ballot. If one were inclined to be cynical, one might suspect something not quite right. If one were cynical.
 


Accidental sock

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Nov 19, 2013
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Nothing that a good old fashioned 'split' won't remedy...
 

davidcameron

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If the outcome of the talks is unsatisfactory then, presumably, TUI members can lobby for the union to ballot on withdrawing from LRA2 at the next AGM. Therefore, the claim that those unions who have signed up to LRA have given up the right to take industrial action is a misnomer.
 

GrainneDee

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If the outcome of the talks is unsatisfactory then, presumably, TUI members can lobby for the union to ballot on withdrawing from LRA2 at the next AGM. Therefore, the claim that those unions who have signed up to LRA have given up the right to take industrial action is a misnomer.
They've given it up for now.
 

davidcameron

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They've given it up for now.
I guess that your only hope is that the ASTI gets a better deal, which would, because equality is enshrined in the Constitution, have to be applied to TUI and INTO members just like the deal that the ASTI got on pay and S&S back in 2003 (though the benefits of that deal have long since been wiped out).
 

Accidental sock

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If I remember my school days correctly, you require what is an incontrovertible and effective tool, to release yourself from the obligations of the Landsdowne Road agreement.

It is, what we used to refer to as......"a note".

I would be happy to provide it.

I will need some paper, a pen, and for you to indulge in some really hammy fake-illness.

"Dear faceless Civil Servant

Please excuse Grainne from any LDA requirements, as she has an upset stomach.

Also, if you could see your way fit to let her lie in some mornings this week, it would be very much appreciated.

Sincerely

An in-no-way-forged parental signature
"
 

davidcameron

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Teachers in voluntary secondary schools are technically not State employees even though the State pays their salaries.

The TUI's members are State employees. That is probably the reason why the TUI executive is less resistant to change than its ASTI counterpart, i.e. a civil service mentality.
 

Prester Jim

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We really need a reorganisation of the unions for education, ASTI and TUI should be amalgamated and the lecturers should become part of the lecturers union, they just have different jobs and conditions and are being successfully played off against each other.
The situation where DCU lecturers are organised under IMPACT is another odd one and where Haddington, Lansdowne and Croke Park deals were organised to benefit the govt by allowing them to give just enough to 51% of the unions (membership size being the factor of importance) and get by much crappier conditions on the other unions because they were part of the 49% is not optimum for nurses, teachers, Gardai, firefighters etc.
 

Prester Jim

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Teachers in voluntary secondary schools are technically not State employees even though the State pays their salaries.

The TUI's members are State employees. That is probably the reason why the TUI executive is less resistant to change than its ASTI counterpart, i.e. a civil service mentality.
No, sorry that just makes no difference and technically I am an ETB employee rather then a state employee, the ETB pay me, the secondary school teachers are paid directly by the DoES.
 

davidcameron

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No, sorry that just makes no difference and technically I am an ETB employee rather then a state employee, the ETB pay me, the secondary school teachers are paid directly by the DoES.
ETBs are statutory organisations directly under the authority of the Department of Education. Therefore, you are a state employee. An ETB is to the Department of Education what An Garda Síochána is to the Department of Justice.

There is a cultural difference between voluntary and ETB-run secondary schools because voluntary schools were traditionally run by the Church.

The Supreme Court ruled in the Louise O'Keeffe case ruled that the State isn't liable for abuse committed by teachers employed in schools that are run by the Church. If a teacher employed by an ETB committed abuse then the State would be liable.
 

Prester Jim

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ETBs are statutory organisations directly under the authority of the Department of Education. Therefore, you are a state employee. An ETB is to the Department of Education what An Garda Síochána is to the Department of Justice.

There is a cultural difference between voluntary and ETB-run secondary schools because voluntary schools were traditionally run by the Church.

The Supreme Court ruled in the Louise O'Keeffe case ruled that the State isn't liable for abuse committed by teachers employed in schools that are run by the Church. If a teacher employed by an ETB committed abuse then the State would be liable.
But your point was about who pays us, my pay comes indirectly from the state and a secondary school teacher is directly paid, not that any of that makes the least difference.
 

GrainneDee

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Oct 12, 2011
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I guess that your only hope is that the ASTI gets a better deal, which would, because equality is enshrined in the Constitution, have to be applied to TUI and INTO members just like the deal that the ASTI got on pay and S&S back in 2003 (though the benefits of that deal have long since been wiped out).
The ASTI have been weakened by this vote.
 

GrainneDee

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Oct 12, 2011
Messages
27,318
Teachers in voluntary secondary schools are technically not State employees even though the State pays their salaries.

The TUI's members are State employees. That is probably the reason why the TUI executive is less resistant to change than its ASTI counterpart, i.e. a civil service mentality.
That makes no sense. Teachers, whatever the technical status of their employment, are all paid from the same source. Traditionally the TUI have been more militant. Things have changed at the top
 

davidcameron

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But your point was about who pays us, my pay comes indirectly from the state and a secondary school teacher is directly paid, not that any of that makes the least difference.
No, it wasn't. It was about cultural differences between voluntary and ETB-run secondary schools.

There is at least a perception of difference between the two types of secondary schools, i.e. voluntary ones being more socially conservative because they were established by religious organisations.
 

Uganda

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Aug 17, 2013
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TUI votes to accept Lansdowne Road Agreement following second ballot - Independent.ie

As a TUI member, I'm disgusted at this outcome. We've basically told the government to do what they want with us from now on - a bad day for the teaching profession. Everyone in my workplace was totally against it.
The executive pushed for a yes, and allowed a very short window of time at a very busy time of year for the ballot. If one were inclined to be cynical, one might suspect something not quite right. If one were cynical.
If one were cynical, one would wonder what " very busy" means for a teacher.
 

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