UK: 71% 'still oppose euro'

seabhcan

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BBC NEWS | UK | Most Britons 'still oppose euro'

The Brits 'still' oppose the euro (interesting choice of words by BBC).

Business Secretary Lord Mandelson said that while joining was still the government's long-term policy aim, such a move was "not for now".

Meanwhile, the shadow foreign secretary reportedly told the Daily Mail newspaper that the Tories under David Cameron "would never join the euro".
Its partly 'not for now' because they wouldn't have a hope of getting in without major structural reforms.
 


borntorum

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Perhaps the great unwashed still do, but there definitely seems to be a shift of emphasis amongst the intelligentsia. The old Little Englander nationalistic dismissals of the Euro seem to be fading away, and a new focus in the economic benefits and costs is being made.

I was interested to see the following article in today's London Times, written by Oliver Kamm who is a leader writer for that paper. It's his own personal opinion, but it's noteworthy that such support is now being allowed to be printed in a newspaper that heretofore was very anti-Euro.

The market has spoken: long live the euro | Oliver Kamm - Times Online
 

ibis

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I think it's very easy for us to underestimate the depth and viscerality of the English attachment to sterling.
 

borntorum

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I think it's very easy for us to underestimate the depth and viscerality of the English attachment to sterling.
Undoubtedly, but I wonder how deep will it remain if it becomes clear that the attachment is impoverishing the nation
 

Thac0man

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If Euro/Sterling are close to parity in the summner when people are taking their holidays, then the public mood might change towards being in favour. Especially if Britain locks the Sterling in at a favourable change-over rate, but that could happen any time.
 

seabhcan

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If Euro/Sterling are close to parity in the summner when people are taking their holidays, then the public mood might change towards being in favour. Especially if Britain locks the Sterling in at a favourable change-over rate, but that could happen any time.
They wont be able to fix the rate - that costs money and the UK has almost no reserves. Denmark spent 3%/GDP in reserves in October along trying to keep the Krona/ euro rate stable. The UK has less than 2% reserves in total.

A Sterling/Euro peg won't happen soon, and neither will the UK adopt the euro anytime in the next decade. They can't afford it.
 

Big Bobo

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Perhaps the great unwashed still do, but there definitely seems to be a shift of emphasis amongst the intelligentsia. The old Little Englander nationalistic dismissals of the Euro seem to be fading away, and a new focus in the economic benefits and costs is being made.

I was interested to see the following article in today's London Times, written by Oliver Kamm who is a leader writer for that paper. It's his own personal opinion, but it's noteworthy that such support is now being allowed to be printed in a newspaper that heretofore was very anti-Euro.

The market has spoken: long live the euro | Oliver Kamm - Times Online
As opposed to the general ignorance of the Irish public (due to our dreadful media) who believe the EU is a cross between Santa Claus and Mother Teresa and is responsible for everything good and noble in the world. Merkel, Sarkozy and Berlusconi are indeed a progressive group for us all to follow! I don't think the Irish are in any position to mock the little englanders.
 

Truth.ie

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If Euro/Sterling are close to parity in the summner when people are taking their holidays, then the public mood might change towards being in favour. Especially if Britain locks the Sterling in at a favourable change-over rate, but that could happen any time.
In the flip side, I'm sure many Europeans will consider visiting Britain more for trips/weekends etc. Many in the public/business sector will see this as a counterbalance. One year without going foreign is not the end of the world.
 

borntorum

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As opposed to the general ignorance of the Irish public (due to our dreadful media) who believe the EU is a cross between Santa Claus and Mother Teresa and is responsible for everything good and noble in the world.
And that's why we voted Yes to Lisbon. Wait a minute...

So you've resolved to maintain your posting standards as at the same high level of 2008 then, have you Bobo?
 

Big Bobo

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And that's why we voted Yes to Lisbon. Wait a minute...

So you've resolved to maintain your posting standards as at the same high level of 2008 then, have you Bobo?
Lisbon wasn't a treaty on whether Irish people believed the EU was a positive thing or not even if the ruling class wanted us to vote based on that. Compared with most member states, the Irish people give almost uncritical support to the Brussels bureacracy
 

Lthse

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As opposed to the general ignorance of the Irish public (due to our dreadful media) who believe the EU is a cross between Santa Claus and Mother Teresa and is responsible for everything good and noble in the world. Merkel, Sarkozy and Berlusconi are indeed a progressive group for us all to follow! I don't think the Irish are in any position to mock the little englanders.
Agree 100%
 

ibis

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Undoubtedly, but I wonder how deep will it remain if it becomes clear that the attachment is impoverishing the nation
It will remain deep, which was my point. The attachment to sterling isn't a rational one. The government might well prefer a more reasonable view, which could well involve entering the euro - but whoever does that will go down in infamy as the person who betrayed centuries of British history etc etc.
 

FutureTaoiseach

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They oppose it for reasons of national sovereignty. I do not agree with UK opposition to the Euro, but it would be hypocritical of me, as a believer in self-determination and a democratic Europe of nation states rather than a superstate, to tell them they have to join. I predict they will not join unless the British people reverse their opposition to the Euro. But then again, Labour broke it's word to hold a referendum on the EU Constitution/Lisbon so who knows - it's just that this is a much more visible aspect of European integration than treaties, particularly as you have the euro in everyone's hands unlike treaties. Don't expect a change in British public opinion unless Sterling suffers a crisis of Icelandic proportions.

 

euroboy

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I think people overplay the British attachment to the Pound. Of course the pound, especially when it was strong, is core symbol of British identity and its former glory, but they will overcome that in the end.

The Germans valued the D mark over anything else and trusted the Bundesbank more than any government of the day and yet the Germans gave up that symbol and joined the Euro.

The Greeks, whose currency was the oldest in the world, equally gave up the drachma.

The British will give up the pound once their government decides to join the Eurozone for which it must first overcome its fear of the Murdoch media and the false sense of attachment they attribute the British people have about the pound.

It is unlikely to happen anytime soon. This current economic and finance crisis has, contrary to what many think, strengthen the case for Britain to keep the pound and control over its own monetary policy especially when the ECB is being criticised from all angles (bar Germany) for not doing enough....i.e follow a misguided anglo-saxon monetary policy of fixing the problem with policies that created it in the first place.
 
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expat girl

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The UK would not go gladly into monetary union. But we may see some screaming and kicking if a run on the pound forces the issue. On the other hand is it a given that the ECB would take them?? I would have thought that the City of London would be too much of an almighty liability for the ECB to agree to take them under its wing. A crisis of Icelandic proportions is not entirely incredible re the UK. Their property bust is at the stage ours was at LAST Christmas. Things have changed since then here and I would expect their 2009 to mirror our 2008. Last year, too, there were 3 reposessions per 100000 mortgages in Ireland. The equivalent figure in the UK was 200 per hundred thousand. I am unsure as to whether Gordon can afford to re-recapitalise his banks, and sterling is not a reserve currency to the same extent as the dollar. The UK relies very heavily on imports for basic necessities such as food. Quantitative monetary easing (printing money) may cause a run on the pound and/or massive inflation

It's not looking good for Sterling and the CBI may prove to be more influential than Murdoch if push comes to shove

But do we want them and their debt?? National debt + PFI debt is most likely above 100% GDP in the UK.....is Axel Weber likely to be begging them to join?? The liabilities of their banks as a % of GDP dwarf the wee problem we have here.
 

Thac0man

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They wont be able to fix the rate - that costs money and the UK has almost no reserves. Denmark spent 3%/GDP in reserves in October along trying to keep the Krona/ euro rate stable. The UK has less than 2% reserves in total.

A Sterling/Euro peg won't happen soon, and neither will the UK adopt the euro anytime in the next decade. They can't afford it.
I was referring to the rate of exchange if the UK decide to enter into the Euro - not the current rate when they still are keeping the Pound.

But its academic as the UK are in a plum position now. UK holiday makers will holiday in the UK and spend their money there and UK made goods will be cheaper than imports. In the current global economic climate that is a nice position to be in, compared to a few other - like ours when vaste quantities of Irish cash start flooding north of the border like never before.
 

Ramon21

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And? who cares?
I don't, do you guys ever think that maybe we don't even want them in the euro?
Let me say this, I atleast don't want them anymore it will bring more bad than good.
 

hiding behind a poster

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They oppose it for reasons of national sovereignty. I do not agree with UK opposition to the Euro, but it would be hypocritical of me, as a believer in self-determination and a democratic Europe of nation states rather than a superstate, to tell them they have to join.
No, it wouldn't be hypocritical of you at all - given that you've already taken the view that its okay for one country to interfere with the sovereign ratification processes for the Lisbon treaty in other countries.
 

droghedasouth

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Undoubtedly, but I wonder how deep will it remain if it becomes clear that the attachment is impoverishing the nation
Sadly, that sort of conclusion is in fact very hard to prove to someone who does not wish to recognise it.

However, the relative stability of the Euro system and the ECB in spite of the global financial disaster disproves all party UK scepticism about the Euro.

If the Euro rides out the storm, we can expect the UK to consider joining in about 5 years time.
 
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