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UKIP get 26% Could Ganley / McDowell decimate FG?


Big Brother

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,732
UKIP get 26% Could DDI decimate FG?

Early success for UKIP as new

The circumstances are different.
So are the electoral systems.

But UKIPs startling performance in local elections today - around 26% of vote - raises major issues for Fine Gael

Fine Gael have embraced Labour's social agenda on abortion same sex marriage closing Vatican embassy ending communion money...and so on.... as the "price" for Labour backing cuts.

Now whether FG voters themselves support cuts that occurred is debatable. Arguably FGers would like to see far more quangos closed, semi states privatised and pay & pensions cut than see welfare for the needy cut

But FG's more "Neo-liberal" wing (who favour cutting the weakest as Neolibs usually do) seem to have forged an alliance with Labour's "secular-liberal" wing (who favour aborting the weakest) to forge an agenda that targets children - born and unborn - and pregnant women (who lose maternity allowance) and families in general (property tax).

The abortion legislation is not in itself a vote changer - people rarely vote on abortion alone. But it could constitute the "tipping point" which turns FG's more Christian democratic voters against it.

Those Christian democratic voters would be more protective of the poor (they would come from the Declan Costello "Just society" wing of the party) than the urban NeoLibs who are more "Devil take the hindmost"). They would also be more protective of the unborn.

And while they are broadly pro European the mood in Ireland towards Europe is shifting thanks to the bail out and more lately the perception that Europe is forcing us to adopt liberal abortion laws.

The immigration issue isn't as strong in IReland (thank God we don't have the tolerance for racism they have in Britain and France) but as thousands continue to come in and thousands of Irish continue to leave you never know when it could just take off.

UKIPs rise was sparked by Cameron embracing same sex marriage.

Although a different issue abortion has the same potency for many FG voters.

Ganley and McDowell have been relatively silent for some time.

But with the start of local and Euro election campaigns now less than a year away the abortion issue won't go away.

And the property tax - another bugbear of FG voters of all shades of opinion - is going to start biting.

So will next December's budget.

So my question is: Could a Euro sceptic party of the right emerge to take a significant chunk of FG voters - and perhaps some FF voters - away from them in next year's locals and Euros?

And if it does, could it form the basis for something in the 2016 general election?

Where Britain goes, Ireland usually follows.....
 
Last edited:


pragmaticapproach

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 21, 2010
Messages
8,817
Early success for UKIP as new

The circumstances are different.
So are the electoral systems.

But UKIPs startling performance in local elections today - around 26% of vote - raises major issues for Fine Gael

Fine Gael have embraced Labour's social agenda on abortion same sex marriage closing Vatican embassy ending communion money...and so on.... as the "price" for Labour backing cuts.

Now whether FG voters themselves support cuts that occurred is debatable. Arguably FGers would like to see far more quangos closed, semi states privatised and pay & pensions cut than see welfare for the needy cut

But FG's more "Neo-liberal" wing (who favour cutting the weakest as Neolibs usually do) seem to have forged an alliance with Labour's "secular-liberal" wing (who favour aborting the weakest) to forge an agenda that targets children - born and unborn - and pregnant women (who lose maternity allowance) and families in general (property tax).

The abortion legislation is not in itself a vote changer - people rarely vote on abortion alone. But it could constitute the "tipping point" which turns FG's more Christian democratic voters against it.

Those Christian democratic voters would be more protective of the poor (they would come from the Declan Costello "Just society" wing of the party) than the urban NeoLibs who are more "Devil take the hindmost"). They would also be more protective of the unborn.

And while they are broadly pro European the mood in Ireland towards Europe is shifting thanks to the bail out and more lately the perception that Europe is forcing us to adopt liberal abortion laws.

The immigration issue isn't as strong in IReland (thank God we don't have the tolerance for racism they have in Britain and France) but as thousands continue to come in and thousands of Irish continue to leave you never know when it could just take off.

UKIPs rise was sparked by Cameron embracing same sex marriage.

Although a different issue abortion has the same potency for many FG voters.

Ganley and McDowell have been relatively silent for some time.

But with the start of local and Euro election campaigns now less than a year away the abortion issue won't go away.

And the property tax - another bugbear of FG voters of all shades of opinion - is going to start biting.

So will next December's budget.

So my question is: Could a Euro sceptic party of the right emerge to take a significant chunk of FG voters - and perhaps some FF voters - away from them in next year's locals and Euros?

And if it does, could it form the basis for something in the 2016 general election?

Where Britain goes, Ireland usually follows.....
You do realise that Ukip are socially and economically libertarian on most issues Mark Thompson: Interview with Nigel Farage of UKIP on drugs policy

what sort of moron would support communion payments and the bloated unsustainable welfare state in general?
Let catholics subsisidise their own ceremonies, and if they choose to have large families pay for them themselves.
 
Last edited:

wombat

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 16, 2007
Messages
32,427
Ganley and McDowell have been relatively silent for some time.
Apart from having 2 of the biggest egos in the country, they have nothing in common. If they formed a party, as Behan once said, the first item for discussion would be a split. Ganley is socially conservative, McDowell is liberal.:lol:
 

Ribeye

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 12, 2011
Messages
26,304
Deco the EU Federalist, and McDowell?

Hahahahaaaa:)

There's 30% of the vote up for the grabs in Ireland,

And if ye wanna grab it, you will have to be firmly anti-EU,

VOTE RIBEYE:)
 

Bren Boru

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Messages
1,461
Apart from having 2 of the biggest egos in the country, they have nothing in common. If they formed a party, as Behan once said, the first item for discussion would be a split. Ganley is socially conservative, McDowell is liberal.:lol:
Very true. Plus ca change, plus c'est meme chose.
 
D

Dylan2010

Which McDowell are we talking about Roddy? he was good in Planet of the Apes, not sure I'd vote for him.
 

KevinO

Active member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
279
Early success for UKIP as new

The circumstances are different.
So are the electoral systems.

But UKIPs startling performance in local elections today - around 26% of vote - raises major issues for Fine Gael

Fine Gael have embraced Labour's social agenda on abortion same sex marriage closing Vatican embassy ending communion money...and so on.... as the "price" for Labour backing cuts.

Now whether FG voters themselves support cuts that occurred is debatable. Arguably FGers would like to see far more quangos closed, semi states privatised and pay & pensions cut than see welfare for the needy cut

But FG's more "Neo-liberal" wing (who favour cutting the weakest as Neolibs usually do) seem to have forged an alliance with Labour's "secular-liberal" wing (who favour aborting the weakest) to forge an agenda that targets children - born and unborn - and pregnant women (who lose maternity allowance) and families in general (property tax).

The abortion legislation is not in itself a vote changer - people rarely vote on abortion alone. But it could constitute the "tipping point" which turns FG's more Christian democratic voters against it.

Those Christian democratic voters would be more protective of the poor (they would come from the Declan Costello "Just society" wing of the party) than the urban NeoLibs who are more "Devil take the hindmost"). They would also be more protective of the unborn.

And while they are broadly pro European the mood in Ireland towards Europe is shifting thanks to the bail out and more lately the perception that Europe is forcing us to adopt liberal abortion laws.

The immigration issue isn't as strong in IReland (thank God we don't have the tolerance for racism they have in Britain and France) but as thousands continue to come in and thousands of Irish continue to leave you never know when it could just take off.

UKIPs rise was sparked by Cameron embracing same sex marriage.

Although a different issue abortion has the same potency for many FG voters.

Ganley and McDowell have been relatively silent for some time.

But with the start of local and Euro election campaigns now less than a year away the abortion issue won't go away.

And the property tax - another bugbear of FG voters of all shades of opinion - is going to start biting.

So will next December's budget.

So my question is: Could a Euro sceptic party of the right emerge to take a significant chunk of FG voters - and perhaps some FF voters - away from them in next year's locals and Euros?

And if it does, could it form the basis for something in the 2016 general election?

Where Britain goes, Ireland usually follows.....
Interesting ... but UKIP is a xenaphobic anti foreigner party bodrdering on being racist with immigration and euroscepticism being the original base but also attracting the disaffected from both the Tories and Labour ...

Other than cutting taxes to be funded by pie in the sky .. it has no economic policy that cannot be solved by withdrawl from the EU ... leave the EU and deficit disappears overnight ... oh and they want to increase military expenditure by 50% to fund wars against any and all threats ... probably the French and Germans ....
 

Ulster-Lad

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 26, 2006
Messages
10,092
Anti-Immigration & Euroskepticism has served them well.
 

mr. jings

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 31, 2008
Messages
8,091
Ganley, McDowell, communion money, gay marriage, abortion and UKIP? I think I need to lie down.
 
Last edited:

Big Brother

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Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,732
Deco the EU Federalist, and McDowell?

Hahahahaaaa:)

There's 30% of the vote up for the grabs in Ireland,

And if ye wanna grab it, you will have to be firmly anti-EU,

VOTE RIBEYE:)
Ha :)

Normally I'd vote for you Ribeye.

But I think anger has gone beyond worrying about purity of Ganley / McDowell's views.

That 30% will now vote for anything vaguely resembling a right wing protest vote.

Amazing thing is that Fine Gael are so stuck in the Latte Liberal bubble that they actually think the media represent the people.

They've just told their voters to get stuffed.

And they think an approving editorial from the Irish Times will rescue them

Unbeliveable. Just unbelievable.

The more the usual meeja pundits praise FG, the more screwed they are

And as for Fianna Fail, Noel Whelan - whom I normally have much time for - will destroy them if he urges them to be "mature" (favourite word for condescending liberals) and back govt on this.
 

stakerwallace

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Joined
Feb 27, 2011
Messages
13,422
One has shown his supine nature already by dashing uncermoniously from the count in Dublin and the other was meant to conquer Europe with a new party which folded in jigtime. FG won't loose sleep over these boyos, I think.
 

Big Brother

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Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,732
One has shown his supine nature already by dashing uncermoniously from the count in Dublin and the other was meant to conquer Europe with a new party which folded in jigtime. FG won't loose sleep over these boyos, I think.


All McDowell was doing was giving us a preview of some FG Ministers after the next election.

Besides I'm not saying McD's stock is so high.

Rather than current gov'ts stock is so low even he could make a comeback.

FG are kidding themselves if they think he and Ganely can't.

A year ago they would've been right to dismiss them.

If they're still doing it they're living in cloud cuckoo land.

People ready to vote for anything at this stage.
 

stakerwallace

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 27, 2011
Messages
13,422
All McDowell was doing was giving us a preview of some FG Ministers after the next election.

Besides I'm not saying McD's stock is so high.

Rather than current gov'ts stock is so low even he could make a comeback.

FG are kidding themselves if they think he and Ganely can't.

A year ago they would've been right to dismiss them.

If they're still doing it they're living in cloud cuckoo land.

People ready to vote for anything at this stage.
I am not an FG supporter but realistically they have deep roots in many parts of the country, considerable affiliation for many, a strong brand name etc etc. etc. These two lads are regarded as egotistical and largely unconnected to ordinary mortals.
 

Big Brother

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Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,732
I am not an FG supporter but realistically they have deep roots in many parts of the country, considerable affiliation for many, a strong brand name etc etc. etc. These two lads are regarded as egotistical and largely unconnected to ordinary mortals.
I take those points.

But I think country is now polarising rapidly and those affiliations are much weaker than they were.

Not saying there isn't an element of personal motivation in the other gentlemen

Just that the cynical abandonment of promises on property tax and abortion is removing those as obstacles.

The point is these are no longer obstacles, so low has the public estimation of the liberal-left self interested establishment sunk.
 

ShoutingIsLeadership

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Joined
Jan 17, 2011
Messages
50,433
Ha :)

Normally I'd vote for you Ribeye.

But I think anger has gone beyond worrying about purity of Ganley / McDowell's views.

That 30% will now vote for anything vaguely resembling a right wing protest vote.

Amazing thing is that Fine Gael are so stuck in the Latte Liberal bubble that they actually think the media represent the people.

They've just told their voters to get stuffed.

And they think an approving editorial from the Irish Times will rescue them

Unbeliveable. Just unbelievable.

The more the usual meeja pundits praise FG, the more screwed they are

And as for Fianna Fail, Noel Whelan - whom I normally have much time for - will destroy them if he urges them to be "mature" (favourite word for condescending liberals) and back govt on this.
A right wing protest vote? Are you utterly out of touch with what has been happening over the last few years?

What exactly would they be protesting about? People not suffering enough?

Or do you think every right wing voter decides who to vote for based on abortion?
 

Socratus O' Pericles

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Joined
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Messages
33,555
A right wing protest vote? Are you utterly out of touch with what has been happening over the last few years?

What exactly would they be protesting about? People not suffering enough?

Or do you think every right wing voter decides who to vote for based on abortion?

Fated to pretend?

[video=youtube;B9dSYgd5Elk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9dSYgd5Elk[/video]
 

Big Brother

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Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,732
A right wing protest vote? Are you utterly out of touch with what has been happening over the last few years?

What exactly would they be protesting about? People not suffering enough?

Or do you think every right wing voter decides who to vote for based on abortion?

People are suffering from a left wing government inflicting left wing taxes to fund left wing exorbitant public pay and pensions and left wing semi state companies charging inflated anti competitive left wing rip off prices.

And all this after a left wing Bertie (socialist) regime pursued left wing spending increases (30% in just three years 2004-2007)

Finally the left wign agenda of socialism for bondholders when any respectable right winger would have let shareholders take losses.

So given that left wing politics is the cause of the problem, right wing policies are the cure.
 

Cassandra Syndrome

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Joined
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Messages
16,908
But UKIPs startling performance in local elections today - around 26% of vote - raises major issues for Fine Gael

Where Britain goes, Ireland usually follows....
 

darkknight

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Joined
Mar 6, 2009
Messages
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...
UKIPs rise was sparked by Cameron embracing same sex marriage....
I think UKIP's rise is down to two issues - (1) growing disillusionment with EU, and (2) concern about immigration

I don't think the immigration issue would be as big a vote-getter in Ireland. But it would be interesting to see how an explicitly anti-EU Party would fare.

I don't get the feeling that there is much 'Little Irelander' sentiment about. One consequence of the post-Celtic Tiger hangover is that many people are so disgusted with our indigenous politicians that they may even regret seeing the back of the Troika.

100 years after the Rising, it is sad that so many Irish people feel that our worst enemies are within! :?
 

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